1/48 - North American P-51B/C Mustang by Eduard - P-51B released

[TheKinksFan]

9 hours ago, Mycapt65 said:

Whatever.

Oh my, what eloquence!

[Bozothenutter]

Trying to go back on topic....Eduards primary objective is to sell kits, and to make money to be able to sell more kits.

It the market wants rivets  they get rivets....simple really.

I've been thinking about filling rivets with black paint, hoping they'll show up subtly under the paint. 

[Mycapt65]

3 hours ago, TheKinksFan said:

Oh my, what eloquence!

Yep that's all you get after a long diatribe that included wind blowing through his hair and "real" millennium falcons. I'm simply exhausted from collecting abuse from people like that. They carefully dissect words and skip over underlying messages so they can argue for the sake of beating people in front of a crowd to pump up their own ego. 

 

2 hours ago, Bozothenutter said:

Trying to go back on topic....Eduards primary objective is to sell kits, and to make money to be able to sell more kits.

It the market wants rivets  they get rivets....simple really.

I've been thinking about filling rivets with black paint, hoping they'll show up subtly under the paint. 

Yes you're right. Let's gets this back on track. Yes companies give people what they want to sell more kits. Apparently the people vehemently want rivets so that's what we're getting.

 

That said, I'm still looking forward to building the new Eduard Mustang releases myself. I'll just have to fill in the rivets. What I'd really like to see them do is a proper MkIA. 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 22 by Mycapt65

[Tokyo Raider]

I have tried to stay out of rivet debate here...  i have seen horrible rivets before...  but THESE are not THEM.  The eduard kits have wonderful rivet detail, i dont see a need to fill them.  They are super fine, you have to look for them...

 

What bugs me is when builders panel line wash every recessed panel and that is worse.  No photo of an airplane looks like that!  I wash certain things like control surface hinges, and access panels.  But these rivet complainers should be worried about wash before the rivets!

[Masinissa]

Please keep this on topic folks.

 

A modeler's artistic choices have nothing to do with Eduard's New Tool P-51B/C. 

 

Don't want rivets on a 1/48th scale P-51B/C? Get the Accurate Miniatures (inaccurate ) P-51B/C or the Tamiya P-51B. Don't want panel lines on the wing? Fill them in or wait for a perfect 3D printed P-51 smooth wing.

 

I eagerly anticipate the release of Eduard's New Tool P-51B/C. Looks like a very fine kit that compares well with their 1/48 P-51D/K Mustang.

 

From what I see this is the first kit that gives the Malcolm hood with the roller details for the open and closed Malcolm canopy. Looking at the cockpit parts you can build a highly detailed cockpit straight OOB and save money because an aftermarket one will only give marginal gains. There are three different seat options as well as the various radio/IFF setups in the box. The overall shape of the kit looks spot on, the flaps can be posed up or down, the wheel well is highly detailed out of the box and there is a choice of three propellers. I do hope that the kit's exhaust stacks don't suffer the molding issues that the P-51D kits have . . . 

[pengland007]

8 minutes ago, Masinissa said:

Please keep this on topic folks.

 

A modeler's artistic choices have nothing to do with Eduard's New Tool P-51B/C. 

 

Don't want rivets on a 1/48th scale P-51B/C? Get the Accurate Miniatures (inaccurate ) P-51B/C or the Tamiya P-51B. Don't want panel lines on the wing? Fill them in or wait for a perfect 3D printed P-51 smooth wing.

 

I eagerly anticipate the release of Eduard's New Tool P-51B/C. Looks like a very fine kit that compares well with their 1/48 P-51D/K Mustang.

 

From what I see this is the first kit that gives the Malcolm hood with the roller details for the open and closed Malcolm canopy. Looking at the cockpit parts you can build a highly detailed cockpit straight OOB and save money because an aftermarket one will only give marginal gains. There are three different seat options as well as the various radio/IFF setups in the box. The overall shape of the kit looks spot on, the flaps can be posed up or down, the wheel well is highly detailed out of the box and there is a choice of three propellers. I do hope that the kit's exhaust stacks don't suffer the molding issues that the P-51D kits have . . . 

Thank you, I am very excited for this kit as well, it's a license to print money with all the markings they can do.

[Scooby]

4 hours ago, pengland007 said:

Thank you, I am very excited for this kit as well, it's a license to print money with all the markings they can do.

Careful now, I was chastised last week for saying a 1/32 Hurricane from Tamiya would be a license to print money. 😝

[zigster]

I'm not sure if that is the license to print money, but they will get something out of my pocket!

zig

[IanF]

On 2/22/2024 at 12:52 AM, Mycapt65 said:

Whatever. You're right, I'm wrong. It's not important enough to me to argue endlessly over semantics. Enjoy your new pock marked wonder kits.

I think what’s clear in this discussion is that everybody has their own opinion, which is great and has generated healthy discussion. However,  just because you don’t like rivets on your kits, it doesn’t mean those that do are wrong. 

Personally, I love kits with fine, recessed rivets, I can’t tell you why, I just do. What I do know is that I think kits with minimal surface detail look like toys, but that’s just my opinion, doesn’t mean I’m right. It does mean I will still  buy a kit with minimal surface detail though, if it’s a subject I’m into, it’s not a deal breaker. 
 

Clearly this isn’t a kit for you, but who knows, maybe another manufacturer will produce a kit better suited to your tastes.

 

Ian 

[John Thompson]

I was watching a program about the Convair XP5Y-1 last night which included period footage of A-1 Skyraiders. late Corsairs, and F8F Bearcats in flight. What struck me was how plain and featureless their fuselages looked - no rivets no panel lines. Very sleek, but also kinda boring, finished in a slightly weather-dulled Glossy Sea Blue. OTOH, I also thought, "What beautiful aircraft these are! Why do I not have one of each on my workbench?!".

 

John

[Piotr Mikolajski]

On 2/22/2024 at 12:32 PM, Bozothenutter said:

Trying to go back on topic....Eduards primary objective is to sell kits, and to make money to be able to sell more kits.

It the market wants rivets  they get rivets....simple really.

 

Technology is allowing the production of moulds with better and better details, the market is demanding better and better details, the competition is making models with better and better details, so for market advantage the manufacturer has to make models with better and better details. And these are all constant factors. If someone expects the whole industry to go back half a century in development, he might be disappointed.

 

On 2/22/2024 at 4:03 PM, Tokyo Raider said:

What bugs me is when builders panel line wash every recessed panel and that is worse. No photo of an airplane looks like that! I wash certain things like control surface hinges, and access panels.  But these rivet complainers should be worried about wash before the rivets!

 

Usually at this point someone uploads a photo of a museum exhibit that has been standing outdoors for thirty years to show that you can see all the rivets and they are black 

But you're right, it's dousing the whole kit with black panel liner that gives such a ridiculous effect. I call it dousing with liquid manure because that's more or less what it looks like. We have many colours of panel liners on the market, giving a much softer and almost invisible effect, but black is the best seller. I don't know if this is an influence of Hasegawa's 1980s catalogues or the so-called 'Spanish school', but it doesn't matter, this has been the trend for several years.

 

I don't like this finish, I think such a model doesn't look good, but in the end it's not my model and not my problem. From my point of view, if afterwards someone still wants to take a bath in black panel liner himself, I won't stand in his way.

 

20 hours ago, Masinissa said:

I eagerly anticipate the release of Eduard's New Tool P-51B/C. Looks like a very fine kit that compares well with their 1/48 P-51D/K Mustang.

 

It remains to be seen how many versions they will make and how many options there will be with different details. The pictures of the first sprues suggest an interesting family of models.

[Mycapt65]

12 hours ago, IanF said:

I think what’s clear in this discussion is that everybody has their own opinion, which is great and has generated healthy discussion. However,  just because you don’t like rivets on your kits, it doesn’t mean those that do are wrong. 

Personally, I love kits with fine, recessed rivets, I can’t tell you why, I just do. What I do know is that I think kits with minimal surface detail look like toys, but that’s just my opinion, doesn’t mean I’m right. It does mean I will still  buy a kit with minimal surface detail though, if it’s a subject I’m into, it’s not a deal breaker. 
 

Clearly this isn’t a kit for you, but who knows, maybe another manufacturer will produce a kit better suited to your tastes.

 

Ian 

Ian we're beating a dead horse here. You as everybody else took it as I said it was wrong for them to like rivets. I wish before you and everyone else jumped on me find where I said it was wrong to like rivets. I never said that I was right and they were wrong. I simply said that the rivets are over scale and wouldn't be visible at scale distances. I said that scale is mathematical and not debatable. Everyone took that as they were wrong for liking them. Again I never said it was wrong for them to like rivets. Yet that's what everyone proclaims in all their endless rebuttals.

 

Let's get over this stupidity. If anyone has the right to be offended it's me. I'm the odd man out and everyone has treated me like I insulted their mother and children. I think at some subconscious level modelers feel they have to be accurate. When I came along and said the rivets are inaccurate, their psyche took it as a personal assault. For that they came after me.

 

I never said  it wrong for anyone to like the rivets. I only said they're over scale and I don't like them. For that I've been attacked as if I don't have a right to have my own opinion. Let's get over this and move on.

 

Be well 

Ron 

Edited February 23 by Mycapt65
Grammar, of course. And now spelling😒

[The_Lancaster]

Is there any info on potential schemes yet? I’ve seen there’s the potential of ‘Lou III’ from the 361st FG, but I was wondering if any other info has been released? 
 

I’d personally love to see a 339th FG airframe or even 353rd. Of course, that’s me being biased towards the 8th but when you live in East Anglia… 😂

[Tokyo Raider]

I dont want to offend or hurt any feelings.  I very much enjoy talking models with you guys...

 

Just to put it in context, the modern eduard rivets are so fine you have to look for them.  Incidentally, the Tamiya p51 kit has rivets that are much deeper...

[IanF]

6 hours ago, Mycapt65 said:

Ian we're beating a dead horse here. You as everybody else took it as I said it was wrong for them to like rivets. I wish before you and everyone else jumped on me find where I said it was wrong to like rivets. I never said that I was right and they were wrong. I simply said that the rivets are over scale and wouldn't be visible at scale distances. I said that scale is mathematical and not debatable. Everyone took that as they were wrong for liking them. Again I never said it was wrong for them to like rivets. Yet that's what everyone proclaims in all their endless rebuttals.

 

Let's get over this stupidity. If anyone has the right to be offended it's me. I'm the odd man out and everyone has treated me like I insulted their mother and children. I think at some subconscious level modelers feel they have to be accurate. When I came along and said the rivets are inaccurate, their psyche took it as a personal assault. For that they came after me.

 

I never said  it wrong for anyone to like the rivets. I only said they're over scale and I don't like them. For that I've been attacked as if I don't have a right to have my own opinion. Let's get over this and move on.

 

Be well 

Ron 

Well, Ron, I was trying to be nice about it, but you’ve just attacked me for my opinion so we’ll leave it there. 
 

Happy modelling my friend. 
 

Ian

 

[Scooby]

I’m getting a headache reading this thread.

 

I’m happy Eduard are releasing these early Mustangs.

[Paul J]

I'm interested to see if there will be any RAF operated Mustangs. In particular the Polish units.

 

[DominikS]

Just to make clear - these holes are not rivets. These are holes made after removing rivets. So I think they should be "rivets" not rivets. And actually sometimes these "rivets" can be pain...

I personally don't like these holes but if they are there it's fine. I'll live with it. 

But if the technology is so advanced, as Mikołaj said, why don't they do rivets as they should look like? With modern IT designing tech it shouldn't be so hard.

And yes, I know that the term rivets is just an agreement.

So, summing up. Some of us like "rivets", some don't. Let's leave all the fuss about it aside and have fun from modelling. 

 

 

[Phoenix44]

21 hours ago, Mycapt65 said:

Ian we're beating a dead horse here. You as everybody else took it as I said it was wrong for them to like rivets. I wish before you and everyone else jumped on me find where I said it was wrong to like rivets. I never said that I was right and they were wrong. I simply said that the rivets are over scale and wouldn't be visible at scale distances. I said that scale is mathematical and not debatable. Everyone took that as they were wrong for liking them. Again I never said it was wrong for them to like rivets. Yet that's what everyone proclaims in all their endless rebuttals.

 

Let's get over this stupidity. If anyone has the right to be offended it's me. I'm the odd man out and everyone has treated me like I insulted their mother and children. I think at some subconscious level modelers feel they have to be accurate. When I came along and said the rivets are inaccurate, their psyche took it as a personal assault. For that they came after me.

 

I never said  it wrong for anyone to like the rivets. I only said they're over scale and I don't like them. For that I've been attacked as if I don't have a right to have my own opinion. Let's get over this and move on.

 

Be well 

Ron 

Scale is mathematical but the idea we must use "scale view"  to determine what we do is neither maths nor logic because nobody has demonstrated that we can only have on our models only what can be seen at some arbitrary distance. 

[Julien]

Whatever is going on between @IanF and @Mycapt65 ends here and now. Act like Adults, its a model that all.

 

Julien

[Piotr Mikolajski]

On 2/23/2024 at 8:51 PM, The_Lancaster said:

Is there any info on potential schemes yet?

 

If the release is in May, we should know a few by mid-March from the Eduard Leaflet. If the release is in June, then mid-April and so on.

 

20 hours ago, Paul J said:

I'm interested to see if there will be any RAF operated Mustangs. In particular the Polish units.

 

Polish markings? Perhaps one in Mustang I and one in Mustang III, I wouldn't count on more. Techmod has available three 1/48 sets for Polish Mustang IIIs: 48002, 48028 and 48033.

 

20 hours ago, DominikS said:

But if the technology is so advanced, as Mikołaj said, why don't they do rivets as they should look like?

 

Because parts are not created by sputtering atoms onto a surface, so the there are such annoying things in the world as the physics of liquids, variable quality of plastic, technological parameters, manufacturing processes, durability and similar trivialities.

[Tbolt]

https://www.facebook.com/share/XcL9t6mY1urHBZRo/

 

P-51B Mustang 1/48 and differences from P-51D kit

 

In preparing the May release of the 1/48th scale P-51B, we made a number of conceptual changes compared to the P-51D kit we released a few years ago. We will introduce them to you gradually. Today, we're going to take a look at the landing gear bay and radiator with our designer, “Stan” Archman. You can find descriptions in the individual renders as well.

 

1. Simplifying the ceiling of the landing gear well, which is now one piece.

2. A more robust undercarriage leg attachment in the wing. Much better geometry control.

3. Added internal radiator structure.

4. Landing gear cover opening piston is designed complete with mounts so that the part is not too small when glued.

5. Landing gear cover assemblies have been changed.

6. The new landing gear cover assembly made it possible to reinforce a section of the wing skin in the center of the landing gear well that was breaking on the P-51D.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[zigster]

Inner gear doors should be locked UP, as far, as I know.

And I think, they should have a fixed band of steel (?), to prevent tyre damage to the doors.

zig

[zigster]

@Piotr Mikolajski.."Perhaps one in Mustang I and one in Mustang III"

Are you trying to tell us, that Mustang I is "in the books" of Eduard? 🤩

zig

[Tbolt]

3 hours ago, zigster said:

Inner gear doors should be locked UP, as far, as I know.

And I think, they should have a fixed band of steel (?), to prevent tyre damage to the doors.

zig

 

That strip of material is right there in the CAD renders.

 

Why do you think the P-51B had the bay doors "locked" up? They don't seem any different from the P-51D, in that they come down as the pressure decays.