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Jamie @ Sovereign Hobbies

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About Jamie @ Sovereign Hobbies

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  1. I'm just applying logic and using the colour coordinates quoted. I appreciate that most don't understand colour coordinates. The above coordinates are miles away from anything in FS595. As a model paint manufacturer, I am infact fairly conversant with the various colour standards used around the world. There's only so many different ways I can say the same thing though. There is nothing in FS595 close to that Pantone blue. I'm out of this now. Not my pig, not my farm.
  2. With respect, I disagree with you re FS595. FS15044 is typically named "Dark Blue" or "Aircraft Insignia Blue" and equivalenced with ANA502 FS35048 is typically named "Post office Dark Blue" or "Insignia Blue" FS25048 is typically named "Insignia Blue" FS35044 is typically named "Aircraft Insignia Blue" and equivalenced with ANA608 FS35048 is typically named "Insignia Blue" Irrespective of your photograph of a jet, the published colour coordinates for all the above as well as FSx5050 Blue Angels Blue according to the Federal Standard 595 are both lighter and less intensely blue than the coordinates on that file above. One or the other logically must be wrong. I will reiterate that Pantone is an ink printing system, not a paint system.
  3. You should probably try our existing ones with our thinner - it's hard to imagine anything easier to clean up or better for mixing, and speaking purely for myself I couldn't make use of anything faster drying - I can mask and move on to the next colour by the time I've flushed through the airbrush. It does need a certain technique of repeated mist coats rather than spraying it on like wet concrete into a mould admittedly!
  4. By 1944, the camouflage AFOs no longer had much to say on deck colours and indeed nothing is recommended or prescribed for Scheme A. I believe Nelson left the US east coast in January 1945 with bright teak decks. This photograph is often captioned as being taken in 1943, but I believe that is wrong as Nelson still wore a distinctive disruptive pattern camouflage scheme which is clearly absent from the turret sides and the superfiring B turret barbette - hence I believe this was taken some time in 1945 after the refit and, by implication, when she was wearing Scheme A. The turret tops can be seen to be painted dark grey non-slip paint. This is probably either G10 coloured or possibly BS381C-32 Battleship Grey (now BS381C-632 Dark Admiralty Grey and has been since the 1960s).
  5. Is this for paint or for electronic / marketing materials? Those colour coordinates are nothing like anything available in physical paint form. They convert to L20.74 a1.89 b-34.99 which is both very dark and very intense blue. Blue Angles blue in FS595 is L31.6 (so a lot lighter) a-1.91 (green hint rather than red) b-14.56 (less than half the intensity of blue). There are several Insignia Blues in FS595 but all have L values of around 30 and b values around half or less the blueness of the corporate branding above. I strongly suspect their paint colours are something else. Pantone is pretty useless for paint - it's a system designed for ink printing.
  6. If this enhances confidence further, the formula for G45 was first promulgated to the fleet in Admiralty Fleet Order 2106/43, the '43' denoting the year and it was in the month of May specifically. It was republished several times in other AFOs over the remainder of the war. Not only is G45 and G10 stated to be the same as 507C and 507A respectively*, but the formula for making 1 cwt of A1/G.45 was: Pattern 409 White Lead Oil Paste - 50lb Pattern 371 Blue Black Paste - 7lb (this was the same black, ultramarine and inert (colourless pigment extender) stiff oil paste used for 507C since 1936 and came in 7lb cans) Pattern 104 Zinc Oxide White - 28lbs (also a paste) Raw linseed oil - 11 pints White spirit - 10 pints Pattern 773 Liquid dryers - 3 pints You'll note that it's hard to mix white, ultramarine blue and black in any proportions and end up with an earthy green! B20 first appeared not in this AFO but later in AFO3113 in 1944: "A1/B.20 Obtained by mixing equal parts A.1/B.15 and A.1/B.30." That requires knowledge of what B15 and B30 were made from, so: A1/B15 Pattern 409 White Lead Oil Paste - 61lb Pattern 371 Blue Black Paste - 14lb Pattern 8P Blue Paste - 11.5lb (8P is known to be Ultramarine blue going back to its introduction to the RN in the mid 1930s) Green Paste - 1lb (most likely chrome green / mid Brunswick green based on peripheral discussion elsewhere) Pattern 110C Black Paste - 1lb Raw linseed oil - 11 pints White spirit - 10 pints Pattern 773 Liquid dryers - 3 pints A1/B30 Pattern 409 White Lead Oil Paste - 58lb Pattern 371 Blue Black Paste - 20lb Pattern 104 Zinc Oxide White - 9lbs Pattern 8P Blue Paste - 0.5lb Green Paste - 0.5lb Raw linseed oil - 11 pints White spirit - 10 pints Pattern 773 Liquid dryers - 3 pints The Yagi antennae are used on several types of radar. There are those fitted above the HACS tubs (round things on top of the bridge, and there's one at the extreme aft end of the superstructure), plus a pair were fitted like TV aerials to Nelson in that refit sticking out either side of the bridge. *(A2 type paints, slightly different glossiness compared to A1 type paints - but for modelling purposes forget about it since the A2s were never mentioned again after this AFO. Also, the preamble to AFO2106 explains that A1 or A2 is a specific paint type, whereas G45 is a colour - so as modellers we can safely just talk about G45 but I include the "A1" stuff here for completeness)
  7. Indeed there's at least one published author who portray and describe those colours as such. Unfortunately that individual has obviously never seen the Admiralty Fleet Orders, Confidential Admiralty Fleet Orders or Confidential Books relating to camouflage. If you want any proof on my part just shout and I'll point you to it, but shall avoid ramming it down throats until it's requested
  8. I'd need to check back through my files but I think we could date the Prince of Wales photograph to within one week or less - the activity of deck darkening was recorded in the ship's log. It was within a couple of weeks of heading out with HMS Hood to the Denmark Strait. Most of the capital ships would have had their decks darkened.
  9. That's easy peasy - she left the USA wearing Standard Scheme A in January 1945.
  10. Nice work. What time frame are you aiming at? I probably have some information that could be useful to you regarding how she was painted and when...
  11. You have my sympathies here Rob. Household damage has no upside.
  12. Hi everyone, my ears were burning. The geometric scheme shown above I don't think was worn outside the dockyard, or for sea trials at most. HMS King George V commissioned into the Home Fleet wearing the same Dark Grey, Home Fleet Shade as all other capital ships in the Home Fleet. She wore "Home Fleet Grey" through the Bismarck action, with her wooden decks stained dark (possibly using a turps-thinned Japan Black stain to effect an overall very dark greyish appearance). She received her first Admiralty Disruptive Pattern camouflage scheme in summer 1942, and there are both colour photographs of various parts of that scheme on the Imperial War Museum website and also aerial observation reports from Scapa Flow conducted by some of the individuals who designed the camouflage schemes to learn about their effectiveness. From those photographs and observation reports, we know for certain that Roger Chesnau who's book the above colour illustrations come from got the schemes wrong. A pity, as they're nicely drawn. Prince of Wales is believed to be wrong too. Here's how we understand HMS King George V looked from commissioning to summer 1942 Here's how she looked from summer 1942 until some time later - her paints probably were overpainted with the G&B series some time after April 1943, but we've no proof. For 1942 though, we have a good degree of certainty that we're correct with this one: When she went for refit and lost the catapult and gained the new deckhouse between the funnels to serve as a boat deck, freeing up the aft superstructure for more AA weapons, she left the drydock wearing the 1944 Admiralty standard scheme A as follows:
  13. Bad news I'm afraid - the RAF Museum chip which Troy showed above is very blue with CIELAB coordinates L43 a-2.7 b-7.9 (so a bit greenish of neutral and very bluish from neutral).
  14. Chrome yellow pigment is just weak. Ochre yellow is far denser covering. You'll get millions of contradictory secret undercoat tricks and it's all irrelevant. You just need lots of coats of chrome yellow to build up coverage - end of. A uniform basecoat will make differences easier to hide, but it doesn't matter a toss what colour the undercoat is if you want to finish up with a yellow exactly the same colour as the paint is supposed to be.
  15. From what I heard the UK has fallen out of love with the gun as a close air support weapon since it's a non-precision, unguided weapon and almost everything we're doing now is precision based with friendly or civilians in close proximity to the target area. Hosing down areas with cannon fire isn't something we do from fixed wing aircraft very much or, when it is appropriate, it's usually better delivered from an Apache which can take its time confirming it has the right target at the other end of the gun barrel before opening fire.
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