1/72 Mirage III RAAF

[Guy with a Beer]

G'day,

 

I'm looking to build an RAAF Mirage III O in 1/72 scale and wondering if anybody has any kit suggestions.  I don't need PE, resin, et al, just a basic kit that can be built into a half decent representation out of the box (decals I can source easy enough).

 

So far I've found one from High Planes Models,  ( https://www.hpmhobbies.com/high-planes-dassault-mirage-iiio-raaf-75-76-79-sqns-revised-tooling-bundle-1-72/ ) does anybody know if they are decent kits.?

 

Cheers

 

 

 

[tempestfan]

IIIRC the High Planes were received well when released, you should be able to find a couple of reviews on Hyperscale. I don’t think Eduard have downsized their beautiful 1/48 kit yet.

If you’re looking for a canvas only, there are older IIIE kits by Frog, Heller and Revell, with Heller the pick of the bunch in my opinion. All should be available relatively cheaply on the second hand market.

[Giorgio N]

It is a very good kit, with good detail out of the box. The previous HPM mould suffered from wide panel lines but the revised mould is much better.

Shape is good but fit can be tricky. With patience you can get a very good model without having to use after market parte. 

Moderna alternatives are the RV kit, that is IMHO inferior, and the brand new Modelsvit kit, that looks even better than HPM's in the box. None is cheap unfortunately.

Special Hobby is working on a new series of Mirage III kits but they are not out yet.

[Andre B]

I always had good experiences with the Revell kit compared to the Airfix and Frog kits. Think I have the engine still somewhere...

 

 

Cheers / André

[Graeme H]

I have built and completed about 5 HPM Mirages, with about 6 in the build pile and another dozen in stock, just love them, got an RV one, it is covered in unrealistic divots, that are very off putting, the older kits are a mixed bag, the Frog is reasonable accurate, but quite simple, the Airfix is a "C" model so not appropriate for an RAAF one , the Revell one suffers from being a bit undersized.

As said above, the Heller one is the best of the older kits, but raised panel lines, if that matters to you 

[Nigel Bunker]

4 hours ago, Guy with a Beer said:

I'm looking to build an RAAF Mirage III O in 1/72 scale

You'll build one, then another, then another, then another...................  There are lots of great colour schemes for the RAAF Mirage so one is never enough.

[72modeler]

On 5/31/2019 at 1:36 AM, Giorgio N said:

It is a very good kit, with good detail out of the box. The previous HPM mould suffered from wide panel lines but the revised mould is much better.

Shape is good but fit can be tricky. With patience you can get a very good model without having to use after market parte. 

Moderna alternatives are the RV kit, that is IMHO inferior, and the brand new Modelsvit kit, that looks even better than HPM's in the box. None is cheap unfortunately.

Special Hobby is working on a new series of Mirage III kits but they are not out yet.

Didn't AML do a Mirage III? Was it a new-tool or a rebox of somebody else's? I have seen one in the box and it looked pretty good to me, but I agree with Giorgio in hoping that that Special Hobby will do one to the same standard as their excellent Mirage F1's!

Mike

[Giorgio N]

6 hours ago, 72modeler said:

Didn't AML do a Mirage III? Was it a new-tool or a rebox of somebody else's? I have seen one in the box and it looked pretty good to me, but I agree with Giorgio in hoping that that Special Hobby will do one to the same standard as their excellent Mirage F1's!

Mike

They did but it was a III-C, so not useable for an RAAF machine. It was AML own tool and was issued in several subvariants but all based on the III-C

[Ed Russell]

No doubt that the Hiplanes one is the best for your purpose. The latest one has very fine panel lines but the earlier version has panel lines that are not really that wide and deep but more so than the later one. A camouflage finish does make them inconspicuous. You may well pick up the earlier one second hand for a reasonable price. As  @Giorgio N said you don't need after market. And as @Nigel Bunker said. you need more than one...............

https://www.redroomodels.com/high-planes-models/hpm-raaf-mirage-iiioiiid-twin-pack-172-scale/

Edit - out of stock but we will get more of them.

[72modeler]

8 hours ago, Giorgio N said:

They did but it was a III-C, so not useable for an RAAF machine. It was AML own tool and was issued in several subvariants but all based on the III-C

Oh, great! I thought I could do an Aussie IIIE with it, so I bought one a while back...what are the differences, Giorgio? I'm not very well-versed on French lawn darts, I'm afraid. Guess maybe I will have to wait until Special Hobby gets around to doing one. (I've got the AML, Revell, Airfix, and the PJ Productions IIIE- I'm guessing that one is the pick of the litter until something better comes along?)

Mike

[Wez]

9 minutes ago, 72modeler said:

Oh, great! I thought I could do an Aussie IIIE with it, so I bought one a while back...what are the differences

Essentially the fuselage length is the major difference, look at this photo of a IIIC, you can see that the intake is level with the canopy.  Now look at this picture of an Aussie Mirage IIIO (which is based upon the E model).  You can see the intakes are behind the canopy

 

The distance between the front of the intake and the start of the wing root forward edge didn't change (e.g. the intakes aren't shorter), there was a fuselage plug inserted behind the canopy.

 

There are numerous other differences, the IIIO doesn't have a kinked leading edge to its fin, the IIIC does, then there's things like the doppler antenna on the IIIO.  Bottom line is you can't make an E based Mirage from a IIIC, the fuselage is too short.  You could, if you were feeling masochistic, convert an E based airframe into a C based airframe but life's too short.

 

I too am looking forward to SH's Mirage III/5 kits.

[72modeler]

Thanks, Wez! Do you know if the PJ Productions IIIE is an accurate kit? I don't have any scale drawings that I trust. Not in my immediate plans, so I can wait until SH gets around to doing III's- hope they start with the IIIE/O first and don't keep us waiting! I can just see  Aussie A3-11 on my shelf! Check out these videos I just found.

Mike

 

https://hars.org.au/gamd-cac-built-ca-29-mirage-iiio/

[Wez]

12 minutes ago, 72modeler said:

Do you know if the PJ Productions IIIE is an accurate kit?

Do you mean these ones?  In which case, these are the same mouldings as the High Planes kits with different decals and some resin.  All the comments made about the High Planes kit apply here.  As far as I can tell they're accurate, I've got one to finish up as a 5F when I get time...

[72modeler]

34 minutes ago, Wez said:

Do you mean these ones?  In which case, these are the same mouldings as the High Planes kits with different decals and some resin.  All the comments made about the High Planes kit apply here.  As far as I can tell they're accurate, I've got one to finish up as a 5F when I get time...

Yep- I have 721026....but I still think I  might wait a while for a SH IIIE, as it will probably be even better, if their Mirage F1's are any indication! Thanks for the reply.

Mike

[Romeo Alpha Yankee]

7 hours ago, 72modeler said:

Thanks, Wez! Do you know if the PJ Productions IIIE is an accurate kit? I don't have any scale drawings that I trust. Not in my immediate plans, so I can wait until SH gets around to doing III's- hope they start with the IIIE/O first and don't keep us waiting! I can just see  Aussie A3-11 on my shelf! Check out these videos I just found.

Mike

 

https://hars.org.au/gamd-cac-built-ca-29-mirage-iiio/

You have great taste Mike! 2OCU was my first posting out of Tech Trade school and I worked on A3-11 for a round 4 years while at 2OCU and 77SQN. I have yet to build an OCU jet for my collection. Must get around to using one of my High Planes kits for it.

[Guy with a Beer]

Thank you all for the replies.

 

Sounds like the High Planes kit  might be the best option currently available to me, so I will start with one from them I think. 

I'll be going with the green+grey camo pattern on it, but might later get a second for the orange and white ARDU aircraft. But that is for a time after I've done up all the other RAAF fast jets I have in my stash waiting for a start.

In the meantime I can finish the abysmal Roden LaGG-3 I am currently working on.

[Guy with a Beer]

17 hours ago, Ed Russell said:

No doubt that the Hiplanes one is the best for your purpose. The latest one has very fine panel lines but the earlier version has panel lines that are not really that wide and deep but more so than the later one. A camouflage finish does make them inconspicuous. You may well pick up the earlier one second hand for a reasonable price. As  @Giorgio N said you don't need after market. And as @Nigel Bunker said. you need more than one...............

https://www.redroomodels.com/high-planes-models/hpm-raaf-mirage-iiioiiid-twin-pack-172-scale/

Edit - out of stock but we will get more of them.

I'm in Melbourne also, so buying locally makes more sense than importing from Singapore.

What kind of time frame are we looking at before you have more in stock?

[Romeo Alpha Yankee]

9 minutes ago, Guy with a Beer said:

I'm in Melbourne also, so buying locally makes more sense than importing from Singapore.

What kind of time frame are we looking at before you have more in stock?

Are you going to Model Expo at Sandown this weekend? You might find one on the traders stalls or at the Swap and Sell on Monday. I shall be looking for another HP kit among a few others as I wander around the display hall.

[Graeme H]

42 minutes ago, Romeo Alpha Yankee said:

Are you going to Model Expo at Sandown this weekend? You might find one on the traders stalls or at the Swap and Sell on Monday. I shall be looking for another HP kit among a few others as I wander around the display hall.

Hmmm, sounds like I need to get in early then  😀

[Guy with a Beer]

42 minutes ago, Romeo Alpha Yankee said:

Are you going to Model Expo at Sandown this weekend? You might find one on the traders stalls or at the Swap and Sell on Monday. I shall be looking for another HP kit among a few others as I wander around the display hall.

Not sure yet.   I'm on the other side of Melbourne from it, and if I head anywhere near Sandown my wife will want to tag along and drag me through the Ikea that is on the way.

[72modeler]

1 hour ago, Guy with a Beer said:

Not sure yet.   I'm on the other side of Melbourne from it, and if I head anywhere near Sandown my wife will want to tag along and drag me through the Ikea that is on the way.

Create a diversion as you get near the Ikea store- "Look, Luv; it's Mel Gibson!" (I always use Tom Selleck on Mrs. 72Modeler.)

Mike

Edited June 3, 2019 by 72modeler
corrected spelling

[Guy with a Beer]

2 minutes ago, 72modeler said:

Create a diversion as you get near the Ikea store- "Look, Luv; it's Mel Gibson!" (I always use Tom Selleck on Mrs. 72Modeler.

Mike

She can smell köttbullar miles away.

[72modeler]

4 minutes ago, Guy with a Beer said:

She can smell köttbullar miles away.

Forgot about their in-house snacks- you're on your own GWaB!

Mike

[Giorgio N]

On 6/2/2019 at 8:41 AM, Ed Russell said:

No doubt that the Hiplanes one is the best for your purpose. The latest one has very fine panel lines but the earlier version has panel lines that are not really that wide and deep but more so than the later one. A camouflage finish does make them inconspicuous. You may well pick up the earlier one second hand for a reasonable price. As  @Giorgio N said you don't need after market. And as @Nigel Bunker said. you need more than one...............

https://www.redroomodels.com/high-planes-models/hpm-raaf-mirage-iiioiiid-twin-pack-172-scale/

Edit - out of stock but we will get more of them.

 

Panel lines and the like are a matter of taste, IMHO those on the first iteration of this kit were really excessively wide. They show as too wide even under a couple of coat of paints and they pose a problem during the build: the fit of this kit is known to be sometime tricky and it's possible to loose a few lines, rescribing a sharp panel line is relatively easy with the right tool but with these wide lines it's not easy to restore surface detail in a consistent way.

Of course the modified tool has sorted the matter, personally I'd look for this and only consider the earlier tool if offered at bargain price.

What today I'd not consider is the original High Planes kit, the short run type. It was a good kit for a short run of the era, but today there's better stuff around.

 

16 hours ago, Wez said:

Essentially the fuselage length is the major difference, look at this photo of a IIIC, you can see that the intake is level with the canopy.  Now look at this picture of an Aussie Mirage IIIO (which is based upon the E model).  You can see the intakes are behind the canopy

 

The distance between the front of the intake and the start of the wing root forward edge didn't change (e.g. the intakes aren't shorter), there was a fuselage plug inserted behind the canopy.

 

There are numerous other differences, the IIIO doesn't have a kinked leading edge to its fin, the IIIC does, then there's things like the doppler antenna on the IIIO.  Bottom line is you can't make an E based Mirage from a IIIC, the fuselage is too short.  You could, if you were feeling masochistic, convert an E based airframe into a C based airframe but life's too short.

 

I too am looking forward to SH's Mirage III/5 kits.

 

The rear end of the III-C and E also differed due to the use of a different afterburner and exhaust. Israel retrofitted a number of C with the later E exhaust but no E ever had the early exhaust

 

 

On 5/31/2019 at 10:03 AM, Graeme H said:

I have built and completed about 5 HPM Mirages, with about 6 in the build pile and another dozen in stock, just love them, got an RV one, it is covered in unrealistic divots, that are very off putting, the older kits are a mixed bag, the Frog is reasonable accurate, but quite simple, the Airfix is a "C" model so not appropriate for an RAAF one , the Revell one suffers from being a bit undersized.

As said above, the Heller one is the best of the older kits, but raised panel lines, if that matters to you 

The rivets in the RV kit are the kind of thing that some may like and some hate, what is in any case bad is that they moulded the rudder with the wrong shape. All parts are also quite softly moulded, given the choice I'd go HPM anytime.

 

 

[Giorgio N]

One more thought on the Mirage III family in model form...

Both the HPM/PJ and the Modelsvit kits are not cheap. They are very nice kits, well detailed and with interesting options. But cheap they are not, so much that a modeller could start considering a different option: the Kinetic 1/48 kit. The basic kit can be found for prices that are not much higher than the 1/72 kits and the Kinetic kit is pretty nice too.

This is exactly what I did for my RAAF Mirage plan ! Got a Kinetic kit from a dealer at a couple euro more than the price of the PJ kit and then found a 1/48 decal sheet going for around the same price of the HP 1/72 ones. Maybe I was lucky, but I'd say this more for the decals than the kit as the Kinetic kit is often offered at good prices by both European and Asian shops. And already includes an RAAF option.

Of course a lot depends on location, to modellers in Australia the HPM kit may be cheaper while for me it's relatively expensive.