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Killingholme

1/72 Hurricane prototype?

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Hi all,

Does anyone make a 1/72 conversion kit for the Hurricane Prototype? If not, what would be the best way of making one? I am leaning towards the AZ models Hurricane Mk.I which includes the fabric wing and 2-blade prop. That leaves me with [only] sorting out the canopy, tailwheel, mainwheel covers+ exhausts right?

Any advice appreciated.

regards,

Will

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Aeroclub did a vac canopy for the prototype, item number C068. Try Joe's Models in the US for one, or just maybe John Aero on BM could help you..

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As with most prototypes, what it looks like depends on the date of its existence that you wish to represent. In addition to the other changes I believe there were at least two different radiator baths on K5083. The early one at least is a lot smaller than the production item. I believe the prototype in its early stages also had the flaps running continuously underneath the centre-section, rather than having the central cut-out behind the rad bath. I don't have full references to hand but believe the rudder may have changed slightly too.

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As with most prototypes, what it looks like depends on the date of its existence that you wish to represent. In addition to the other changes I believe there were at least two different radiator baths on K5083. The early one at least is a lot smaller than the production item. I believe the prototype in its early stages also had the flaps running continuously underneath the centre-section, rather than having the central cut-out behind the rad bath. I don't have full references to hand but believe the rudder may have changed slightly too.

Reading again about K5083 in the Macdonalds Monograph (F K Mason) (highly recommended) you are quite correct as is MilneBay and Graham (both above). In addition, the rudder mass balances were exposed, main gear doors had lower extensions just like K5054 (Spit), tailwheel was retractable and the aircraft looks unarmed but ballasted for 8 Brownings ,provision only given for two each side, plus provision for a single Vickers gun each side of the cockpit (a factory photo is shown with one installed). The latter were probably not flown. The centre flap section was later deleted as it interfered with radiator airflow and tailplane struts also removed early on. I believe that the canopy was modified too early on since the sides 'panted' in flight. Radiator bath also changed as stated above.

Have fun. Any luck with the canopy?

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Checked my rather dated file of Hurricane references, believing that somewhere many years ago I saw drawings of the Hurricane prototype. Sure enough, MAP No. 3015 by Arthur Bentley includes a full page of his drawings which detail K5083.

Aeroplane Monthly for August 1985 reproduced an article dedicated to the prototype, originally published in Flight magazine on May 12, 1938.

Aircraft Modelworld magazine (September 1988) had a two-page article on a simple conversion using the Matchbox Hurricane Mk.IIC and a Watts prop from the Matchbox Hawker Fury biplane or from Aeroclub. I think you're miles ahead by starting with the AZ Hurricane Mk.I kit - modelbuilding standards have changed a lot since 1988!

The Bentley prototype drawing page is probably the only thing I've found which might be useful to you - PM me if you want me to e-mail you a scan. Or I can post it here if it's not going to get me into trouble - that at least would allow the more knowledgeable on this forum to comment on its accuracy - "For discussion purposes" is, I believe, the relevant phrase which excuses such behaviour... ;)

Hurricane_dwg.jpg

John

Edited by John Thompson

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Hi Will

the Bentley plans are considered the Gold Standard in Hurricane drawings.

some more info in in this thread,

http://www.britmodel...pic=64364&st=20

I'm going to quote me here as I think info like this can be 'buried' in a thread, so I hope the cross reference is handy for other folks.

The AL Bentley drawings Edgar mentions are updates of his original set done in 1979 and published in Scale Models.

Bentley mentions in the notes that as he wanted to show the internal details he used the production drawings, used to actually build the planes, even though there were some very detailed general arrangement drawings available in the files.

After completing the basic framework, he checked these against the existing drawings, and got a shock. They didn't match.

After more checking he found that the drawings that had been given out in good faith were wrong in various areas.

His drawings were then taken from production blueprints and are as good as you will get.

The revision Edgar mentions is a to do with a detail of the rear fuselage decking.

the reprints were printed in 1/48 in Model Aircraft Monthly vol4, no 11, though a quick check of the SAM sites shows this is now sold out.

Given the history of inaccurate Hurricane drawings coming directly from Hawkers, if you want to be sure, get the Bentley drawings.

they are theoretically available from his site, http://www.albentley...ne.htm though when I have contacted him I have not got a reply.

Note, for the purposes of checking the basic outline, the lo-res preview drawings in the link above can be saved and using a graphics program, correctly scaled and printed out, they will be fuzzy, but good enough to see the correct outlines.

Though if it's just the nose you want to check, the drawings posted by Edgar will do that just fine.

note, while the Bentley drawings are for the MkI, but add on the II cowling and deeper radiator and you have a IIA, add the outer gun postions, you have a IIB.

Also note the Hurricane type rotol spinner and Sea Hurricane fittings are on the Bentley drawings.

And they do show the C wing, so if you use the cowl drawings posted by Edgar with those wings you get the IIC.

The C wings was the basis for the 'D' and IV wing as well, there are threads on here about the differences of those, for example this one, which links to others

http://www.britmodel...topic=234927188

scans of plans are in the links, or photos.

So, with a bit of cross referencing you get plans for all the Hurricane variants. ;)

The only bits missing from what I have given links for are the IIB outer gun postions and the IV armoured radiator, and the MkII type tailwheel. These are in the old PSL book 'Classic Aircraft No4, Hawker Hurricane, their History and how to model them.' which I should scan and post at some point, having scanned the IID wing and rocket mountings ones.

[The book has been out of print for 30 years now.]

As for the Hurricane prototype, it really depends WHEN you want to model it, as changes were brought in to fix faults...

The drawings do make a concise list of what changed when.

Note, the very short exhaust stubs, and and easily missed detail the gentle curve behind the canopy, production planes have an angle behind the cockpit 'doghouse' where the plywood stops.

Also, nose cowl bumps, different panel lines for nose and fuselage access panels.

In this pic the smaller rad bath can be seen. The things on the wing is a temporary thermometer to measure air temperature.

Not mentioned on the drawing is that the wheels were the 5 spoke type as fitted to early Hurricanes.

hurr1-3.jpg

Initial wing had no armament access hatches fitted as can be clearly seen in this pic.

Edit, the pic below is before the pic above, as it has the smaller 25" fuselage roundel, later enlarged to 35" as in the other pics. Useful for working out when the pic is from BTW.

hurr1-1.jpg

later with gun access hatches added, but note, production hurricane fabric wings were metal covered to outboard of the gun bays, they appear to be surrounded by fabric here.

Actually a detail I only just noticed, [i don't have the books to hand, but there might have been a production type wing fitted later. ]

Also, added landing light, and aerial post.

This pic shows the formed bulge in the top nose cowl panle to accomodate the cylinder heads on the Merlin.

hurr1-5.jpg

Later on the prototype sported a large black 1 at it's first public apperance IIRC.

The interior framework is black enamelled tube.

How accurate do you want to be? changing the fuselage panels is easy enough on the nose but tricky on the fabric bits.

Given the amount of little changes, you might as well start off with the old airfix Hurricane Mk I, good shape, raised panel lines, which are easier to remove, especially on the fabric bit than engraved.

You would have to add the rib tapes to the wing, which while fiddly is not impossible.

2 blade Watts props are available, or certainly were. 5 spoke wheels might be harder, they are the same hubs as fitted to the Spitfire, but Spitfire tyres are not as deep.

If I think of more I'll edit it in later.

HTH

T

Edited by Troy Smith

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Wasn't the turtledeck behind the canopy different betweent the prototype and production aircraft? I have a vague memory that the turtledeck on the prototype curved gently to the fin but it was hard to produce efficiently so a decision as made to add the dog-leg profile on production airframes. Like I said...vague memory so don't quote me (but feel free to correct me!).

DOH!! Just noticed that Troy mentioned this feature. Ah well, at least my memory wasn't playing tricks on me...now I'm worried about my eyesight/reading comprehension skills!

Edited by mhaselden

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Wasn't the turtledeck behind the canopy different betweent the prototype and production aircraft?

That's how it's portrayed in the Bentley drawings reproduced by John Thompson above.

/Joachim

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Wow- I didn't realise it was so different in the early days. I'll consider making the conversion, but I don't think I've got enough spare time to devote to the wings especially at the moment. Thanks for the info guys. Bookmarked!

regards,

Will

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There was a beautiful 1:72 pewter kit of K5083 by C. A. Atkins, some time in the '80s. I have it in my stash somewhere, along with Mr Atkins' K5054. Unfortnately I'm away from the loft, so I can't dig for it and make any comments on its aherence to the Bentley drawings, but my recollection is that it's pretty much spot-on.

See also: http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=75593

Perhaps an eBay search might turn up an unexpected find?

Kind regards,

Joachim

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There are two small pictures of prototypes in 'British Flight Testing Martlesham Heath 1920 - 1939'

 

K5083 showing a fixture above wing.  There is a note about cockpit shape in the plans belonging to #7

L1696 in camouflage colours and streamlined exhaust.

 

There is a description of the trials so not sure it answers any burning questions

 

Was there an article with plans in one of the Airfix Annuals?

Edited by MigModeller

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