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Nakajima B5N2 Kate Fuselage color under Canopy


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I am assembling the Airfix Nakajima B5N2 Kate 1/72.  Most references indicate that the fuselage areas under the canopy (around crew positions, outside) should be the same color as the cockpit interior (the green color varies according to what source you consult, but ok, lets say Nakajima interior green).  My question is, is there a picture or source that confirms that all the area under the canopy was actually same green as the cockpit?

 

i1Sjhtj.jpg?1

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Hi Marco;

 

I made the same query to Nick Millman at the Aviation of Japan blog and he advised that as the fuselage was built as a unit and the canopy added on at the end of construction the area under the canopy should be the same colour as the exterior, not the interior. I appreciate this contradicts most of your sources but I have no hesitation in recommending Nick's advice to you.

 

Cheers,

 

Stew

 

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I second what Stew just wrote; Nick Millman and his blog, are the best sources for the colours used by the IJNAAF and IJAAF.

Joe

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As a complete novice as far as Japanese aircraft is concerned Nick's blog and friendly advice is a godsend.

 

Cheers

 

Dennis

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Thank you for this definitely “revolutionary” input.  I felt highly oriented to think that way, i.e. same color as the rest of the fuselage.  In this case, a Pearl Harbor B5N2, the fuselage color was IJN Gray-green, so that is what I am going to use.  The only area where I feel inclined to use same green as the cockpit, is the panel under the windshield.   Thank you very much!

 

Marco

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Marco, for the forward part of the internal fuselage under the windscreen I'd recommend the blue-black colour that covers the cowling up to the windscreen, not the cockpit interior green :)

 

Cheers,

 

Stew

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Thank you, Stew, that is an area that is shown in a B&W picture of a captured B5N2 Kate (it is a late model radar equipped Kate).  A long shot from the Dec 1941 Kate that I am assembling, but haven't got anything else.  The instrument panel is black, but the panel above it, under the windshield, and the inner windshield frame, seem to match cockpit green color (not black, definitely).  This is the only clear picture that I know showing the cockpit, and I guess it might have varied.  Notice as well that on the sides of the cockpit, above the canopy sliding rail, the color might match the cockpit color.  

 

uosqA87.jpg

 

Marco

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I will never be mistaken for the estimable Mr. Millman! But for whatever it's worth, the old but excellent "Maru Mechanic" issue on the B5N shows the front decking in the cockpit color.

 

BTW, have just this week been reading Nick's "Combat Colors" issue on the A6M Zero. "Highly recommended" hardly seems adequate!

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Yeap, front decking would be interior color.  Does "Maru Mechanic" show the areas behind the pilot, around the bomber and gunner?

 

Marco

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59 minutes ago, Marco1965 said:

Yeap, front decking would be interior color.  Does "Maru Mechanic" show the areas behind the pilot, around the bomber and gunner?

 

Marco

Marco,

 

I have the Maru Mechanic and the FAOW (Famous Aircraft of the World) vol. 32, as well as Japanese Aircraft Interiors, 1940-45, by Robert Mikesh, and after looking through all the Kate photos and text, there's not much more to what MDriskill has posted. The color interior drawing in the Maru Mechanic only covers the cockpit, not the observer's or gunner's positions. The Mikesh book has detailed photos of the cockpit and rear positions, but they are of a late production Kate that was equipped with ASV radar, so might or might not be representative of the one you want to do. That being said, all of the crew positions appear to be in the same interior green; Mikesh commented in the brief  paragraph on interior colors that all interior crew positions were in a green color on the captured Kate, which looks pretty light in the photos, so might be FS34151 or thereabouts. There were no photos in any of  my references that showed the decking in front of or behind the cockpit, but I would think they would be the same color as the uppersurface of the fuselage, with the exception, as has been noted, of the coaming above the instrument panel. IIRC the Kate captured on Saipan that Mikesh photographed might still be in storage with the Smithsonian.  Nick Millman would be your  best bet to know the answer, or you could go to the forums on the JAircraft website and search the discussion and references on colors and paint schemes. it is an excellent website for IJA/IJN modelers. Sorry I couldn't be more helpful; I'm a babe in the woods when it comes to IJA/IJN aircraft.

Mike

 

http://www.j-aircraft.com/

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Thank you, Mike, I already combed all the j-aircraft forums, HA!  The radar-equipped Kate is the same one from which I posted the pilot´s cockpit above, that one is pretty clear.  I have checked the pictures of the Kate at the Pacific Air Museum in Pearl Harbor, but there is not much of a paint remaining on the fuselage to conclude anything.  I will paint the fuselage below the canopy the same IJN grey green as the exterior color, and the panel under the windscreen interior green, sounds reasonable. 

 

Marco

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Mikesh says (p.194) that after evaluation the Saipan aircraft was scrapped "somewhere in the northwestern United States".  He also says (same page) that, apart from the black metal instrument panel, "a dark green of some undetermined shade appears to have been used throughout the rest of the cockpit areas".  To be honest, FS 34151 isn't the colour that would first leap to my mind from such a description.

 

Think Nick actually wrote the painting instructions for the interior of the Airfix kit so suggest that, with due allowance for use of Humbrol nearest equivalants, they will be pretty reliable - in an area where hard information is scarce.

Edited by Seahawk
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2 minutes ago, Seahawk said:

Mikesh says (p.194) that after evaluation the Saipan aircraft was scrapped "somewhere in the northwestern United States".  He also says (same page) that, apart from the black metal instrument panel, "a dark green of some undetermined shade appears to have been used throughout the rest of the cockpit areas".  To be honest, FS 34151 isn't the colour that would first leap to my mind from such a description.

That's what I thought, too, but in the photos, the interior color looked pretty light to me, not a dark green. I know there were a few different light green interior colors used on IJN/IJA aircraft, but not being an authority and not having good references, that's why I posted the 34151 guess; although IIRC, there was an interior color that was allegedly close to RAF grey-green or the Israeli green, 34227, which would appear light in a b&w photo. That's also why I suggested Nick Millman as a resource. I think the Kate that was scrapped postwar might have been the same one that was  displayed outdoors at NAS Anacostia, along with several other Japanese aircraft for many years.

Mike

 

http://captured-wings.wikia.com/wiki/C/n_2194

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The Kate at Pearl Harbor has still the original cockpit color, and it looks like it has a mix of two greens, I would say a Dark Green and an interior green.  I don´t know the wherabouts of this Kate, could have been repainted, I don´t know.  What I don´t see is the very pale cockpit green anywhere.  I am satisfied with Airfix recommendation of using Forrest Green (FS34127), but I chose to lighten it a little bit with 20% white.

 

nXD7o9S.jpg

 

WlElzHm.jpg

 

Marco

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This is from Monogram Close-up No. 14 Japanese Cockpit Interiors Part 1.

 

 

42377914574_d9992478a3_b.jpg

 

Oh! I see now that it's the same picture Marco posted. Sorry!

 

 

Chris

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Better more than less, Chris!  I wonder, as this Kate was tested by the USAAC, there must be some more pictures somewhere.

 

Marco

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1 hour ago, Marco1965 said:

Better more than less, Chris!  I wonder, as this Kate was tested by the USAAC, there must be some more pictures somewhere.

 

Marco

I think I see what you mean, Marco. In the second color photo you posted, it looks to me like the darker Mitsubishi cockpit green as well as some structural members in Aotake. Just one more reason why I tend to avoid IJA/IJN projects like the plague. Thanks for posting the photos- they are very useful.

Mike

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  • 4 weeks later...

Hallo,

 

IMHO, Japanese aircraft decking (as opposed to cockpits) were seldom if ever in the "interior colour" (that is, unless it was the same as in the exterior -not an uncommon occurrence). A6Ms were Black in the early overall Light Olive Green scheme or Black/exterior colour in the Dark Green uppers painted ones. Excuse me for not quoting the exact Japanese name for the former (be it Ame-iro, Hairyokushoku, or something else -not getting in to that debate) So I would go safely with the exterior colour.

 

Fernando

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Photo from the US National Archives taken Dec. 7 1941 over Hickam Field.

 

air_b5n_5.jpg

 

Sure is awful bright under that canopy !  😎

 

No idea what the colour is.

 

Garry c

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