Battleship Bretagne - France - 3D realisation - 1:200 scale

[Serkan Sen]

I will repeat myself. Jaw dropping work!

Serkan

[Iceman 29]

Thanks all! 👍

 

Drawing and printing the garbage chutes:

 

There are 4. I have good detail photos of the chute. They could be slowed down with canvas to avoid soiling the hull too much, later in the 1930s black stripes were painted on the hull to visually mask the soiling.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Steve D]

When I've seen these on drawings before, I thought they were ash chutes for use when cleaning our the boiler fire grates so the ash doesn't blow all over the ship etc., not kitchen slops.  They seem present on coal fired ships but absent once oil took over.  I may, as ever, be wrong on this point.

 

Anyway, it looks great of course, you have to maintain this standard for ever now

 

Cheers

 

Steve

[Iceman 29]

Good remark, Steve.

 

Both probably. 

 

During the 1924 refit, the ship converted some of its boilers to oil-fired, and during the 1930 refit, all boilers were replaced by oil-fired boilers.

 

After refit 1924-25, only the front ones exist.

 

 

On 1940, as you can see, this equipments still exists forward.

 

[Dave Swindell]

19 hours ago, Steve D said:

When I've seen these on drawings before, I thought they were ash chutes for use when cleaning our the boiler fire grates so the ash doesn't blow all over the ship etc., not kitchen slops.  They seem present on coal fired ships but absent once oil took over.  I may, as ever, be wrong on this point.

Most larger ships with coal fired boilers would have had ash ejectors to eject the ash direct from the boiler room overboard - http://www.titanicmodel.net/uploads/4/1/6/0/41607523/titanics_ash_ejectors.pdf

 

Gash chutes were fitted to RN ships well after WWII - there's one aft of the whaler on HMS Victorious here:-

 

NEW NAVAL STRIKE AIRCRAFT IN HMS VICTORIOUS. JUNE 1959, ON BOARD HMS VICTORIOUS, DURING LANDING TRIALS FOR THE BLACKBURN NA-39, A TWIN-ENGINED AIRCRAFT THAT CAN BE USED ATTACKS ON SHORE TARGETS OR SHIPS CARRYING CONVENTIONAL OR NUCLEAR WEAPONS.. © IWM (A 34192) IWM Non Commercial License

 

 

 

[Steve D]

29 minutes ago, Dave Swindell said:

Most larger ships with coal fired boilers would have had ash ejectors to eject the ash direct from the boiler room overboard

Thanks for the clarification David, much appreciated.  My comment came from the as-built drawings of HMS Medea where an identical chute was identified as an ash chute.

 

For interest, I looked this topic up in Sennett and Oram's "The Marine Steam Engine" published in 1916. 

 

Various types of pressurised ejectors are included, both above and below the waterline.  However, the book makes it clear that not all Naval vessels at that time were fitted with pressurised ash ejectors.  Instead they make the statement this is only normal practice where it is not advisable to move ash across the deck as would be the case with a liner like Titanic.  .

 

The attached extract (which looks like a heavy cruiser or battleship from the sloping armour deck in section), shows the means of lifting ash to the deck for disposal overboard down an ash chute

 

 

So potentially we're both right 

 

Cheers

 

Steve

 

[Iceman 29]

Thanks for the very interesting information, guys! 👍

 

Searching the plan:

 

"Manche à détritus" : Garbage chute

 

 

[Dave Swindell]

55 minutes ago, Steve D said:

Thanks for the clarification David, much appreciated.  My comment came from the as-built drawings of HMS Medea where an identical chute was identified as an ash chute.

Various types of pressurised ejectors are included, both above and below the waterline.  However, the book makes it clear that not all Naval vessels at that time were fitted with pressurised ash ejectors.  Instead they make the statement this is only normal practice where it is not advisable to move ash across the deck as would be the case with a liner like Titanic.  .

So potentially we're both right 

Very interesting Steve, I was under the impression ash ejectors were in common use by the RN, obviously not! The Titanic reference was simply the first good one that came up when looking.

Whatever went down them, the chutes remained long after the need to dump ash ended

[Iceman 29]

Digging a little deeper into the bilge plan in the Battleship Bretagne's boiler room, we can probably see the ash ejectors in the fore and aft boiler rooms.

They are called "Escarbilleurs" in French, a name derived from escarbille:

 

"Fragment of incompletely burned wood or coal that escapes from a furnace."

 

Escarbilleurs:

 

"Grate under the firebox that collects the poorly burned particles (escarbils) and separates them from the ashes, in a boiler using solid fuel (usually coal).

 

Here, these devices are located on the starboard aft and port forward sides of the 2 boiler rooms. I think the term has been hijacked a bit.

 

 

[Steve D]

I love this sort of detail, but I'm probably a little weird 

 

Cheers

 

Steve

 

[Iceman 29]

Me too! 🤪

[Iceman 29]

I'm still going around this battleship to install the railing, there are a few lengths to form and glue! 😓

 

I've also installed the starboard gangway forward. I still have her lifting masts to draw and print. I'm going to replace the aft ones, which don't conform. 

 

I've found a photo that shows me their shape.

 

 

 

 

I still have to install the stantions for the aft mast platform. These are higher. I'm hesitating between resin or piano wire. The fear, as they're high, is that they'll bend over time... Maybe a mix, with one base in resin and the rest in piano wire, would be a good idea.

 

 

 

[Steve D]

Magnificent

[robgizlu]

2 hours ago, Steve D said:

Magnificent

 

ditto

Rob

[Iceman 29]

Tks! 

 

I'm working again on the sailors who will board the "Bretagne".

 

I'd like to reproduce the beautiful scene in this photo, which I like very much, showing sailors on the deck at the port bow of the "Lorraine" in Brest harbour and workers from the Arsenal forging parts.

 

I would place it on the starboard side for the Bretagne, the side that will be displayed in its showcase.

 

I replaced the civilian workers with sailors.

 

 

I'm starting to get a nice crew, but I need a lot more different poses.

 

 

 

 

 

I'm also going to reproduce this one, the sailors with their lunch tin queuing up outside the galley door on the port side of the C turret.

 

 

This scene also shows the 340mm shells being loaded into the ammunition bay.

 

The shells were loaded by this removable mast at A and D turret level, through a hatch in the deck.

 

 

 

[Courageous]

Figures now, is there end to your talent. 

 

Stuart

[Steve D]

Seriously Pascal, this is incredible work.

 

I may need one Victorian RN sailor for Havock, any chance 

[Iceman 29]

Have you an exemple?

[Iceman 29]

I made some officer today! 

 

Well, it's a general's outfit, but it only shows sailors at 1/200 scale. 

 

No shoes in this new character and his outfit, strangely, too bad, but it's not serious. I'll have to get them for myself.

 

 

 

[Iceman 29]

Two more sailors on food duty, and I've still got one to do with a crate.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Steve D]

13 hours ago, Iceman 29 said:

Have you an exemple?

Below a couple of ratings images from 1890.  The working dress seems very similar to the French navy, without the bobble on the cap.  To my eye, It is more obviously made from canvas than WW2 uniforms.  I just like to place a single figure on the boat to help people understand the scale.  They can be just loafing or doing something simple.

 

I know I should follow your lead any get into that software, but if you could help with some inspiration that would be very kind.  I can of course print it myself. 

 

The white canvas uniform shown here is most common in images of the time, the blue seems to be kept for best.  I will use the white

 

Rum (grog) ration queue, looks like a cruiser to me

 

Early minelaying

 

Stokers resting after maintenance on a torpedo boat around 1900, that kit needs washing before anyone gets shore leave.....

 

 

Cheers and thanks

 

Steve

[Serkan Sen]

12 hours ago, Iceman 29 said:

Two more sailors on food duty, and I've still got one to do with a crate.

Wow! I am totally speechless...

Serkan

[theskits62]

On 10/6/2023 at 6:17 PM, Iceman 29 said:

I'm starting to get a nice crew, but I need a lot more different poses.

 

This project gets more amazing by the day ! What software are you using to create those figures they look brilliant ??

[Iceman 29]

Thank you. 👍

 

I use Daz Studio, the software is free with free characters (Genesis series), but addons are paid for outfits etc. ... The prices are minimal in the DAZ store, but it's a small investment.

 

Of course, it pays for itself very quickly if you have a resin printer, given the price of resin miniatures on the market. 

 

What's more, the postures are perfectly suited to your project.

 

https://www.daz3d.com/

 

https://www.daz3d.com/install-manager-info

 

 

[Iceman 29]

1 hour ago, Steve D said:

Rum (grog) ration queue, looks like a cruiser to me

 

Steve

 

Ok, i will see that. 👍

 

It reminds me of this documentary found on "Images Defense", a French government archive of photos of the armed services and navy.

An English film with French commentary extolling the power of battleships.

At 4:09 we see the daily ration of grog being served, with the proportions of rum and water indicated. 1/16 litre of rum diluted in 2 times its volume of water...  😜