Dave Swindell

The models shown above illustrate a modelling fad that bears no resemblance to reality. If it's a look you like it can be achieved in a number of ways as you suggest. You're not tied to scale effect because it's fictional. Personally I hate the look, a full hull model looks far more aesthetically pleasing mounted on a couple of finnials in my opinion, but each to his own. If you want a proper drydock look, it will take a lot of small blocks arranged correctly on the base. I'd sand the tops once located to ensure a flat mounting for the ship, and dril through at least a couple of the blocks into the base and pin through into the hull to ensure a solid mount for the model. There's more on drydock blocks in one of my earlier posts here:-

Hi Steve The new lines drawing looks much more like a working ship than before, however some of the detail layout doesn't look quite right to me, the boiler in particular looks too far forward when compared with the archealogical drawing of the wreck on the seabed. I think thre could be a lot of useful information in this drawing and other records from the "dig" to help with creating the best estimate for the drawings. If you'll excuse me covering some ground you've most likely already covered yourself, I'll have a go at explaining how I'd approach this. Ships drawings are usually referenced agains either the fore perpendicular or the aft perpendicular (frame 0), with a large part of the known dimensions being at the aft end I'd take the AP as the reference. We have some as built dimensions, and others after conversion, from which we should be able to work out the overall key dimensions of the vessel. She was converted from paddle to screw, and also lengthened. The paddle machinery would have been around midships, and the easiest method of lengthening is to insert a parallel section in the middle, so I'd sugest it's most likely she was cut in two amidships to ease removal of all the paddle machinery and a new section was inserted here to lengthen her. From original build, LBP = 101.3' LOA 121' and fore rake 6', which would give an AP-stem of 107.3', and an AP - stern of 13.7' From the registration details, stern post (AP) to fore part of stem =116.3' which gives an increase in length of 9', and a new LBP of 110.3' and a new LOA of 130' We can now plot stern, AP, midships, FP and stem from these. The above drawing clearly shows the shafting intact, does the museum have a total length for the shafting? (it appears to be in two sections, which would allow the tailshaft to be withdrawn inboard after removal of the forward section and propeller) The shafting would have enough clearance between it's aft end and the sternpost (AP) to allow the propeller nut to be removed, so add say a foot to the shafting length and that will give you the position of the aft end of the engine. As this is in the museum you can get the basic overall dimensions of this and plot this in. Next we have the aft mast. The masts would usually be stepped on the keel, which means this mast has to be between the engine and the boiler if this is the case, as it's the only space on the centreline in this area, and I'd suggest close up to the engine as access to the boiler front is needed, and this wouold give the maximum clearance between the mast and the funnel, as this is also at the aft end of the boiler. The "dig" records should give some indication of the space between the engine and the boiler (and position of the mast if there was any indication of it's remains), in any case I'd expect this to be at least the boiler tube length to allow for cleaning and raking the furnace You've then got the length of the boiler, and forward of this I'd expect 2-3 feet for access to the forward side of the boiler for inspection/maintenance between the boiler and the cargo hold bulkhead. From the drawing above there is what appears to be the foot of the forward mast to the left of the cargo winch, and an anchor windlass just aft of the stem which should allow relatively accurate placing of these if the record show measurements for their location. The position of what I take to be the fore mast, and a reference to a fore hatch during the account of the sinking suggests to me that although there was only one hold, it was served by two hatches, one forward of the mast and one between the mast and boiler. I'm curious as to what the large objects are outside the hull below the engine and boiler. One item of equipment which may have survived and the location is quired above is the galley stove, it's location in the wreckage would give an indication of where to fit a flue pipe. Another item is the coal bunkers, you mention galena being found in the hold; as she was just setting out on her voyage when she sank I'd expect a reasonable amount of coal still in the wreckage in the region of the bunkers. The logical place would be either side of the boiler space, with hatches in the deck for coaling. The boiler would be raised above the keel a foot or two to allow a bilge space and for bottom drain fittings etc. If this places the top of the boiler above the deck then there will be a deck house of some form covering it, it wouldn't be open on a sea going ship. I'd expect the large ventilators just aft of the funnel feeding air down to the boiler front and the poor old stoker(s), with the skylight just aft of these over the engine. If this area is a continuation aft of the raised deckhouse over the boiler, I wouldn't expect portholes in the side as lighting would be via the skylight. I'd put the wheel further aft, behind the mast, but forward of the rudder, this would be a normal positon for a sailing vessel (and she's rigged to sail from what has been said), the helmsman would steer from the weather side of the wheel so he could read the set of the sails and have a good view to windward. All this will leave very little room for any sort of cabin at the aft end, the only possibility would be something semi-recessed into the space above the shafting with the upper portion being in an extension aft of the boiler deckhouse. This doesn't fit though as the wheel is referred to as being over the engine room, and not a cabin/deckhouse. I've not seen any reference to the number of crew she carried, I wouldn't expect it was very large, and they could all conceivably been quartered in a cabin/messroom forward of the hold. There would have been some sort of forepeak space forward of this as well, including chain locker and stores/sail lockers no doubt. It seems a bit curious though in reference to the sinking, there is reference to the mate being unconcerned about the leakage of water into the fore parrt of the ship through the deck - if this was where the cabin was I would have thought there would have been a bit more concern, and again later, the whole part of the foreship was flooded, and no mention of cabin or messroom. Again, the "dig" reports could be useful here, look for position of domestic type small finds, cutlery, pottery, glassware etc would give some indication of cabin location(s) If the crew was quite small, say around half a dozen, I wouldn't expect more than one boat, and that no more than a dinghy 14-16ft, easy enough for a couple of men to manhandle, and it should fit on top of the boiler room, possibly upside down. Once the position of everything is located, then the lines can be worked out to give the volume necessary for the equipment (especially at the aft end). As the original build most likely had some length of parallel section around midships, then the rebuild will have had considerably more, with the extra 9' added in it could have been in the region of twice that. Well that's my random thoughts for today. I do think there would be some milage in taking a closer look at any archealogical reports for the recovery, little finds can give an insight into the bigger picture.

We were still using a specialised "wind & wave" paint on a strip approx 2 metres deep above the antifouling on container ships well into the 90's. This paint was supposedly more resistant to the harsher environment encountered in this region of the hull, and as suggested, was much more expensive. It wasn't really noticable on our ships though, as it was the same colour as the upper hull, there was a subtle difference when new but that soon wore off.

Judging by the draft marks on the photo above, the boot topping is between 7'6" - 8' deep which gives 6.5-7mm at 1:350

Ahh, that explains why the white bits on the decal don't show up in the photo. The wings and fuselage are all the same grey on the doves, but I've not been able to work out whether the wings are the standard ggrey or not, they appear to be a bit lighter than normal.

Well that's disappointing, not a single RAF example

I'd suggest that the timing of any cancellation of the show will largely be decided by the T's & C's of the contract with TIC. As a member of IPMS(UK) I'd hope that the committee would do their best to minimise the society's risk to cancellation fees. I don't know the details of the contract, but I would expect an early cancellation by IPMS would incur significant costs which wouldn't be incurred if the centre was unable to host the event. Whilst safety will undoubtedly be a high priority, the deciding factor will undoubtedly be financial. There may come a point where to host the show safely is going to incur greater costs than cancellation. I'm sure that there are committee members in close contact with TIC and this is being monitored, along with the number of traders planning to attend, and if the point where the show becomes unviable is reached, an announcement will be made.

Which grey did you use? Racking grey? I've got a set of these decals to do a dove one day, you've done a great job with yours.

Best part of 40 years at sea, and circumnavigations round both capes into double figures. I've also run rescue boats on Ullswater for over 30 years whilst on leave. Now retired with a tree in the garden.. If Crisp will excuse a bit of swinging chainblocks for a minute, the photos of focsles and poop decks awash with the oggin brought back some memories My first east-about circumnavigation was pretty uneventful out and round the Cape of Good Hope to Australia and New Zealand, however leaving New Zealand heading for Cape Horn we had a quite heavy following sea. The ships we used for this service handled this quite well, and although they would roll about 20-25 degrees each side of the vertical it was a long slow roll and not uncomfortable. The one run I did on these back from Australia via the Cape of Good Hope heading into the weather was most unpleasant. The weather you had when you left NZ would pretty much stay with you all the way to the Horn, so if it was grot when you left you had two weeks of it til you got round the corner and started heading north. The poop deck was below the upper deck, and open at the rear and sides through cut-outs in the hull, and it also extended forwards either side of the aft hold, again with cut-outs in the hull, until you reached a watertight door with access into the side passageway, and thence to the engine room. Access to the steering gear was via another watertight door on the centreline of the forward bulkhead of the poop deck proper. I'd already had best part of 2 months wandering down to the steering gear from the engine room via the side passageway and poop deck every duty day, it was a pretty routine job. My first duty day after we left Port Chalmers, with the ship rolling nicely, I set off from the engine room as normal to check the steering flat, down the starboard passageway and out through the watertight door as the ship rolled well over to port. I had a cracking view out over the top of the following rollers and the soaring Albatross we always had following us. The sky was a deep dark grey and the deck was wet, I didn't think anything of it and itched my boilersuit up so the leg bottoms didn't get wet before stepping out of the door, which I conscientiously shut behind me, and I strolled aft as the ship started to come upright and roll to starboard. The stern was also just coming out of the bottom of a trough as the next roller slowly overtook the ship. With brain in neutral and admiring an albert peering into the cut-out just off the starboard quarter I rounded the corner onto the poop deck proper, slowly realising that all was not well - I think the giveaway was the albert having a good snigger as it could see what was about to happen. I turned to see where I was going and was faced with a view not unlike that posted by @Our Ned earlier:- I managed to grab hold of a nearby scupper pipe before being completely engulfed in a wall of none too warm water. As I'd come this far and was just as likely to get another soaking on the way back I made a hasty inspection of the steerring flat before heading back in a rather bedraggled state to the control room to provide the morning's entertainment for the rest of the troops. Venturing out onto the poop in these sort of conditions needs careful planning and impeccable timing to ensure you move from one safe "dry" spot to the next when you're on the high side, and keep yourself sheltered during the periods on the low side. This was shortly after the Falklands War, and we always got an RN "escort" and RAF flypast or two as we passed, there wasn't much in the way of traffic down there then, so I guess they were keen to have a look at anything new. We had twin 8 cylinder engines, the rumour was that the submarine patrols could never get an identifiable sound signature from us as we usually had at least one leg of an engine hung up, and never the same one. I never heard of anyone getting anything worse than a good soaking down on the poop deck, but sadly, up on the focsle (different ships and runs) we lost 2 shipmates killed and a couple badly injured when they got caught out taking water over the bow. One of those we lost had survived the Conveyor sinking. The sea can be very unforgiving, no matter how much experience you have.

Same reason there's only one Monopolies Commission?

Best cure for seasickness - sit under a tree....

Cue Johnny Nash....

I've bought 4 (Ark Royal, Vindictive, Chitral and Jervis Bay) but I haven't started any of them. Quality looks excellent. The resin casting looks a lot like Combrig stuff, and the comprehensive etch similar to Flyhawk. There's a few lengths of wire and a small decal sheet for the likes of flags and draft markings. Instructions are comprehensive multi stage computer generated drawings. The only minor drawback is the colours are only quoted as lifecolour paints with no indication of what the actual colours should be.

Every time @Troffa!

If the bit you've already done holds it's shape after bending, yes it should. You might want to check with a smaller length before committing the whole coil though!