Varnished Plywood Effect / Seat Belts

[NORTHDUK]

I am working on an Airfix DH-4 kit and have now almost completed a scratch-built interior.  This will have to be painted to represent plain varnished plywood.  I know that this will involve painting everything in a "wood" colour and applying a thin coat of a darker brown but I would like to know what colours people here use for this and what their preferred method is for applying the top coat to give a wood grain effect.

 

In addition, I have not yet made the seat belts as I have no clear idea what they would have been like.  My guess is that the pilot's belt would have been a simple lap strap but the observer sat on a circular stool like a piano stool and would have had to stand up, move about to fire the gun, operate the camera and face forward or aft as needed.  Does anyone know what the belt would have been like and where it was secured to the fuselage? I can find no photographs of the cockpit interiors that show the belts.

 

All suggestions or sources of information would be greatly appreciated.

 

Best wishes,

 

Gordon McLaughlin

 

 

[Paul Thompson]

        These days I use a base coat of enamel, usually Humbrol 93 or similar, or if feeling attention span challenged the base will be any yellow/brown acryllic by Citadel (because they dry fast, cover well, and are tough enough). For a grain effect I drybrush with a darker brown, or for sheets of flat plywood I draw a suitable pattern with a watercolour pencil. In all cases I follow up with a translucent orangey yellow coat. I used to use Tamiya clear orange mixed with clear yellow, but now use one of the Citadel ink type washes, Seraphim Sepia by choice, which has a longer working time. With the watercolour pencil this dissolves it a little, which in 1/72nd to my eye is more realistic than sharp grain. A final coat of gloss may be needed, but not for internal woodwork.

 

        Some swear by oil paint for the grain, and it can look good. I've tried it but haven't the patience, particularly for bits that will be hard to see later. I did do it once for a Lloyd type for the plywood skinned wings, and it looks quite good, but TBH for me at least isn't worth the extra effort.

 

Paul.

[Brandy]

I use acrylics and start with a light tan such as cdl or radome tan. Then brush a thinned coat of leather using a wide, flat  brush and keep strokes to an absolute minimum, preferablyjusg one one stroke from end to end. A couple of very thin coats is preferable. Finish with a light coat of clear orange.

 

Ian

[NORTHDUK]

@Paul Thompson,

 

Paul,

 

Thank you for your prompt and very helpful reply.  I've never tried any of the Citadel paints but there is a Citadel shop in the town so I might give them a go.  In fact, I've never used acrylics except for some Tamiya Smoke, so it'll be interesting to see how I get on with them.

 

Thanks again for your help.

 

Gordon

[NORTHDUK]

@Brandy,

 

Ian,

 

Thanks for your reply.  I've been surprised by the use of such pale shades for the first coat but it seems to work so I'll see how I get on with them.  Thinning the darker colour makes sense and I've seen the use of clear orange recommended for struts to give a wood effect so I'll certainly try it for this job.

 

Thanks again for your help with this

 

Gordon

[Seawinder]

2 hours ago, NORTHDUK said:

@Brandy,

 

Ian,

 

Thanks for your reply.  I've been surprised by the use of such pale shades for the first coat but it seems to work so I'll see how I get on with them.  Thinning the darker colour makes sense and I've seen the use of clear orange recommended for struts to give a wood effect so I'll certainly try it for this job.

 

Thanks again for your help with this

 

Gordon

Raw, untreated lumber is often a very light tan. I'm pretty much with Paul and Brandy, although I usually start with a base coat of Mr. Color and overpaint with Model Master enamel Burnt Umber, which is pretty close to Leather. The Mr. Color is impervious to the Model Master, so the darker color can be worked as necessary for the desired effect without eating through the base. Using acrylic for the base will accomplish the same thing; I just don't have much in my stocks. I'd recommend the often sited 50-50 mix of clear orange and clear yellow to simulate the varnish (I use Tamiya) rather than straight orange.

[NORTHDUK]

@Seawinder,

 

Thanks for your reply. I see what you mean about the risk that the thinned paint will dissolve the base layer.  In the 1970s, I used to weather AFV models with washes of thinned enamels over an enamel base coat without any problem. Some of the washes were little more than slightly dirty white spirit (mineral spirits) but didn't seem to affect the paint underneath them.  Paint formulation was different then, though, and I may just have been lucky.  I'll go along with your suggestion to use a 50-50 mix of orange and yellow; it sounds as if it would cool the final colour a little.

 

Thanks again for your help.

 

Gordon

[RC Boater Bill]

Like others, I use an acrylic base - a light tan of some sort.  I used to use oils as the top coat, but like Paul, I tired of waiting for them to dry.  These days, I just use an old, old tin of Humbrol enamel instead of the artist oils.    (A medium-dark brown color.)   I mix it gently, so it is “mostly blended”.   I have an old paint brush I use with it-  I cut the bristles down so they are 2-3 mm long.

 

If you are heading to the Citadel shop anyways, pick up a pot of their bright silver. It is great for brush painting  little shiny bits on a model, such as oleo struts.

[NORTHDUK]

@RC Boater Bill,

 

Thanks for your reply.  I've been trying out various techniques and my nearest approach so far has been to use a short bristled brush to dry-brush the top colour onto a matt enamel base coat (Humbrol 103 Matt Cream).  If I can get this to work consistently, I'll let it dry for several days and then apply a 50-50 mix of Tamiya Clear Orange and Clear Yellow.  This is acrylic so it shouldn't interfere with the enamels underneath.

 

Thanks for the tip about Citadel bright silver.  I need to look more closely at Citadel's range of paints but it will have to wait until after Christmas.

 

Best wishes,

 

Gordon McLaughlin

[Robin-42]

Just remember wood grain should not stand out, make them look for it, just like rigging. For the belts you can look at HGW’s efforts for the 1/32 WWI. They will be similar. 

[NORTHDUK]

@Robin-42,

 

Thanks for your reply.

 

I must admit that I've found this grain effect more difficult than I had expected.  You're right about keeping it restrained, especially in 1/72 scale.  

 

For the belts you can look at HGW’s efforts for the 1/32 WWI.  Could you clarify this for me?  Who is HGW and where can I find pictures of this work?

 

Best wishes,

 

Gordon McLaughlin

 

 

[Troy Smith]

On 05/12/2023 at 19:05, RC Boater Bill said:

I used to use oils as the top coat, but like Paul, I tired of waiting for them to dry.

Try zippo type lighter fuel.  Flashes off very fast,  and dried really fast.

On 10/12/2023 at 23:45, NORTHDUK said:

This is acrylic so it shouldn't interfere with the enamels underneath.

One dried, enamels won't easily be affected.

I recall doing gun stock in my youth with oils over enamel, just neat oil I recall, but it was a very thin smear to get the brushstrokes for the wood grain.

You can put oil paint onto cardboard to soak up some of the linseed oil before use as well.

On 26/09/2023 at 17:20, NORTHDUK said:

Some of the washes were little more than slightly dirty white spirit (mineral spirits) but didn't seem to affect the paint underneath them. 

I apply oil paint thinned with lighter fuel over unvarnished Vallejo with no issues, unless I scrub the paint.   Lighter fuel is so volatile it does not have time to attack the paint.

 

HTH

[Paul Thompson]

6 hours ago, NORTHDUK said:

 

For the belts you can look at HGW’s efforts for the 1/32 WWI.  Could you clarify this for me?  Who is HGW and where can I find pictures of this work?

 

Best wishes,

 

Gordon McLaughlin

 

 

https://hgwmodels.cz/en/  

 

Very nice belts, but they don't do 1/72nd.

 

Paul.

[NORTHDUK]

@Troy Smith,

 

Thanks for your reply.

 

I've never heard of using lighter fuel as a paint thinner.  One of these days, I might try it.  I remember reading that it is very effective for separating decal sheets from their cover sheets if they have become stuck together but I've never had to try it. 

 

At the moment, I'm using Humbrol matt Cream as a base colour and applying thinned Humbrol matt 62 Leather as the darker colour.  My wife teaches watercolour painting and has recently bought a set of brushes that she suggests might be useful in producing the grain effect.  They're flat brushes but the bristles are not of uniform length.  Instead, they alternate between long and short so that they look rather like the top of Bart Simpson's hair or a row of miniature battlements.  I'm going to try them out shortly.

 

Best wishes,

 

Gordon McLaughlin

[NORTHDUK]

@Paul Thompson,

 

Paul.

 

Thanks for the link to HGW.  I had a look at the website but couldn't find any WW1 belts.  As you say, they don't make belts in 1/72 but I think that Robin-42 thought they would be useful as a reference for making my own in 1/72.  I'll keep looking at the site to see if they show any suitable belts.  If not, I'll settle for plain lap straps with painted buckles. 

 

Best wishes,

 

Gordon

[Paul Thompson]

10 minutes ago, NORTHDUK said:

@Paul Thompson,

 

Paul.

 

Thanks for the link to HGW.  I had a look at the website but couldn't find any WW1 belts.  As you say, they don't make belts in 1/72 but I think that Robin-42 thought they would be useful as a reference for making my own in 1/72.  I'll keep looking at the site to see if they show any suitable belts.  If not, I'll settle for plain lap straps with painted buckles. 

 

Best wishes,

 

Gordon

 

They're there but I couldn't see them with the search engine so had a look at their 1/32nd belts. Here's a link to what is probably most suitable, for a DH9:  https://hgwmodels.cz/en/132-scale/319-amc-dh9-seatbelts-132-132538.html

Quickest just to get a reference picture is to look under HGW on the Hannants site. Over 800 hits, so be warned.

 

Paul.

[NORTHDUK]

@Paul Thompson,

 

Paul,

 

Thanks for the link to the DH-9 belt.  I've copied the illustrations of the DH-9 belts and should be able to knock up something similar for the DH-4 and the DH-9 conversion that's going to follow it if the DH-4 goes well enough.

 

With my best wishes for Christmas and the New Year,

 

Gordon

[Robin-42]

On 12/16/2023 at 1:06 AM, Paul Thompson said:

https://hgwmodels.cz/en/  

 

Very nice belts, but they don't do 1/72nd.

 

Paul.

You misunderstood, I meant to look at them for design details. Early belts were pretty generic.

[Paul Thompson]

4 minutes ago, Robin-42 said:

You misunderstood, I meant to look at them for design details. Early belts were pretty generic.

No, I did understand that but wanted to make sure he knew in case he got his hopes up. Looking back, I wasn't clear enough, but that often happens when I know what I mean.................

 

Paul.

[Robin-42]

3 hours ago, Paul Thompson said:

No, I did understand that but wanted to make sure he knew in case he got his hopes up. Looking back, I wasn't clear enough, but that often happens when I know what I mean.................

 

Paul.

I should have added for ideas in 1/72 at the end. I think my wife is rubbing off on me, she can think an entire first paragraph, jump in at the second one and treat me like an idiot for having no idea what she is talking about. 🙄😁