Condor Mig-25P 1/72

[AleTar]

Hi guys!
A short introduction. My name is Alexander. I live in Ukraine and English is not my native language. Fortunately, there are “crutches” - Google Translate. But still, I may be inaccurate regarding termenology and model slang. So, you can correct me and give clarifications, this will improve my knowledge of English. Unless, of course, this forum thread will be of interest to anyone at all.
 

And so I will build a kit from Condor 72016, Mig-25. This is a very old set, this plastic was sold in “Eastern Express”, “zvezda”, “IomKit” boxes, you can see all this on https://www.scalemates.com/ru/kits/condor-72016-mig-25pd--137575
As well as review of what's inside the box, for example on youtube. 
This kit is no longer relevant today. I cannot recommend this set to anyone. It is not very accurate geometrically, very low quality and poor detail. And I didn't plan to buy this kit. I got it as a prize at a scale model exhibition that took place in Mariupol in the autumn of 2021. And I tried to sell it, exchange it, or even just give it away. But in the end I decided to build it. Despite the fact that my box says Mig-25PD, and even added some parts, this set corresponds to the Mig-25P (Миг-25П) version. P(П) literally means "Interceptor". This is interesting because no one else has released this version. If you want to build the “P” version, it is much easier to conversed it from the ICM set, even though the ICM also has many shortcomings. The Mig-25 “red 31” flown Belenko, hijacked to Japan, was from version P. This modification was exported only to Libya. And I absolutely do not want to build anything with red stars. For this reason, I will build a Libyan Air Force aircraft.
 

[AleTar]

Fortunately, I don’t have to assemble a Mig-25 using only Condor parts. A couple of my friends bought kits from ICM, and decided to improve them with resin parts from RESKIT. And I asked to give me the extra plastic parts.
I received: Exhaust nozzles, wheels, two P-40s and a drogue cap. I also took the ejection seat KM-1 from the old zvezda Mig-21PFM kit. Actually, I have better ejection seats. But I'm going to make the canopy closed.

The plan is as follows.
I won't be adjusting the geometry. I plan to improve the detail. Engrave the panels correctly and accurately. Make an imitation of rivets. Add more small details.

And it all starts from the cockpit. Since I plan to the cockpit canopy is closed, there is no need to do super precise detailing. It is enough to do something very similar to the original:

[IPMS19]

- SLAVA UKRÄINI

[Vultures1]

I will follow along, if that's ok. Like you, I have some parts left over from an ICM PD that I built with resin after-market, and was planning to use them to improve a Condor P; however, that build stalled 

 

I didn't know that Libya used the P variant, which is useful information 

[AleTar]

5 hours ago, IPMS19 said:

- SLAVA UKRÄINI

Geroyam Slava!
Thanks for your support!


And so the next stop.
So far everything is simple. I painted the cockpit. And I transferred the decal to the dashboard. The color may look more blue in the photo, but in reality it is quite similar to the real aircraft. I mixed the color from Tamiya XF paints. I added imitation seat belts from painted Tamiya tape. I added an imitation of the handles of the catapult mechanism. I found a different, more suitable control knob and redesigned the base.
It seems to me that for a closed canopy, the cockpit finish is more than adequate.
 
 

I'm not sure about the color of the panel covering the instrument panel. Logically, it should be black. But on the Internet there are many people who think that she is turquoise. Before installing the cockpit canopy, it is not difficult to repaint it.

 

[AleTar]

1 hour ago, Vultures1 said:

I will follow along, if that's ok. Like you, I have some parts left over from an ICM PD that I built with resin after-market, and was planning to use them to improve a Condor P; however, that build stalled 

 

I didn't know that Libya used the P variant, which is useful information 

I must warn you that you have a lot of work ahead of you. But I hope that my build will be useful for you.

So, I think it’s worth paying attention to the issue of Libyan Mig-25P. I don't know everything, and my conclusions are based on studying photographs. Although I have a friend who worked at a factory that was involved in the services and modernization of these aircraft. And he had business trips to service and train technical personnel in Libya.
The Libyan Air Force had various versions of the Mig-25. And yes, among them there were P versions. Then later Libya received more modern Mig-25PD. I have seen the designations Mig-25PE and Mig-25PDE, where “E” meant “export”. Sometimes it can be difficult to distinguish the P version from the PD version. On the Internet you can find photographs of the events of 2011, when the Libyan opposition seized sealed hangars, and there were quite a large number of Mig-25Ps there. Of course, they were all in an “abandoned” state and had not flown for several decades. And it is no longer possible to restore them.
 

If you open any monograph on the Mig-25, for example the Polish publication “Mig-25 Stalowa blyskawica” (Steel Lightning), then the distinctive features of the Mig-25P are as follows:
1) I don’t know what this is called correctly in English terminology, I’ll give a literal translation. "Anti-flutter weights" on the ends of the wings. For version P they had the shape of a spindle. But in Libyan P they have a cylindrical shape, both on PD and PDS. Possibly the result of modernization

2) Early Mig-25Р had a smaller, more pointed drogue cap.

I have never seen such a drogue cap on any of the Libyan Mig-25s. All of them had a standard or late type drogue cap.
Otherwise, Libyan P do not differ in appearance from Soviet ones.


A distinctive feature of the P version is a different bow, up to the beginning of the cockpit canopy. Another form of panels. The right vertical fin is the same as the PDS version, which is logical. PDS is PD obtained by modernizing P.
Literally: P (П) is interceptor (Перехватчик), D (Д) is modified (Доработанный), and S (С) means combatant (Строевой). And PD are new-built aircraft. P used only R-40 missiles. If you see a block of twin P-60s, it's a PD or PDS. I'm not sure about the technical feasibility of using an external fuel tank. But in reality, neither P, PD, PDS ever used an external fuel tank. The PD and PDS had a black spot on the bottom of the nose and a protruding “heat direction finder” block.
So, there could be various minor differences associated with the antennas, for example on the fins, various convexities. This depended on different batches and periods of aircraft production. For this reason, it is best to use photographs of a specific aircraft.

[Vultures1]

That's really helpful, thank you 

[AleTar]

And so in a week I made a little progress.
I decided to work on the tails. In my kit they fit the fuselage parts very poorly. But everything will become clear only when I glue the halves of the fuselage together.
I filled in the wide and irregular panel lines. I use superglue as the main putty. Superglue adheres perfectly to the plastic, quickly polymerizes, and most importantly, it does not decrease in size during polymerization. I fill small scratches and depressions with gray Tamiya putty and white Gunze putty. I made an imitation of riveting. Unfortunately, I had not wheels with a fairly large pitch, so I had to putty the rivets one at a time.
I made bulges on the sides. I don’t know exactly what it is, but it’s probably the stabilizer control drives. I used Tamiya epoxy putty, great stuff.
  

And I cut a couple of "turbines" out of a beer can. I didn't stick to any specific sizes. I plan to cut rectangular holes in the front wall of the fuselage where the air intake ducts should be located. And I plan to place these "turbines" inside the fuselage.

I almost never use drawings, since they are all quite old and have inaccuracies. I am guided by the photo and model from ICM, so that the same elements have the same dimensions. There is a nuance, my ICM kit is a RB version, and the reconnaissance were very different from the fighters.

But if someone needs it, I can post the drawings that I have.


Alex.

[AleTar]

And a little more progress. 
I assembled the nose section of the Mig. 
I added a few small things to the front whill bay, but it doesn't matter since there's not much to see there.
I have my doubts about the nose section of the Condor kit. The radar nose cap looks short. And the section between the radar cap and the cockpit canopy is slightly longer. I took some drawings and superimposed them on photographs of real aircraft. But unfortunately, photographs of the Mig-25P are available in middle and small resolution. My doubts grew stronger. I tried to check how different the nose parts of the Mig-25P and Mig-25PD/PDS are. And it seems the size of the radar nose cap is either the same, or the differences are not significant. Then I asked a friend to measure the dimensions on the ICM model Mig-25PD.
Therefore, it is necessary to move the boundary between the radar hood and the bow part closer to the canopy. And carefully fill the seam from the connection of the parts.
But how to engrave a new border?
I followed this plan:

 

And I engraved all the panels and hatches. And added imitation riveting
 

[SebTartar]

Good job. 
You still have a lot of work ahead of you, though!

[SarmaT]

On 21/04/2024 at 20:40, AleTar said:

I will build a Libyan Air Force aircraft

Looks like their national insignia is not that difficult - you probably won't need any decals?

Had they got any camo or they were just grey?

Interesting buid 

[AleTar]

On 30/04/2024 at 20:24, SebTartar said:

Good job. 
You still have a lot of work ahead of you, though!

Thanks!
Yes, the model kit is very difficult, but I have experience in building such difficult models. This work just takes a lot of time. I don’t deal with just one model, I have about a dozen different models in my work)
But I really want to finish building this kit.

 

On 01/05/2024 at 13:25, SarmaT said:

Looks like their national insignia is not that difficult - you probably won't need any decals?

Had they got any camo or they were just grey?

Just grey. These planes did not have any camouflage. Interceptors, aircraft with only air-to-air missions, did not have any camouflage. But given the “abandoned” appearance, you can have fun with weathering.
And. It is not entirely clear why, for what purpose, some "long nose" - Mig-25BM, 25RBF, 25RBSh, and at least one 25RU were painted in “low-altitude” camouflage.

Of the decals, I planned to use only technical data. I planned to paint the identification marks and even the side numbers using stencils. By the way, the prototype I chose also has non-standard colored elements. I had a contact with a guy from Kharkov who once made excellent stencils for me. But I'm not sure that he can help me, now. The painting and decal stage is still a long way off.




Alex

[AleTar]

And a small update.
I worked with the air intakes. To be honest, I thought that everything would be simpler... But in the end the work turned out to be difficult, because on one side the internal lining was missing, on the other side the walls had an incorrect shape. I used 1mm Tamiya white polystyrene and epoxy putty, also Tamiya. I copied the shape of the thin inner walls from the ICM. In general, it would have been easier to make parking plugs... but I decided to complicate my life and made an imitation of the air bypass mechanism. I spent 3 evenings making an imitation of perforation. Yes, the holes are not perfect everywhere, but I think for 1/72 it will do.
  

I was looking through my archive, collected from images from the Internet, on the topic of Libyan Mig-25s. And I found a photo of 2011, such an interesting ZIL-131

ICM has something similar in 1/72. Perhaps adding a ZIL-131 is a good idea to complement my Mig-25. But first i need to build this Mig))

Edited May 10, 2024 by AleTar

[AleTar]

Hi all! Yes, unfortunately I am not able to post updates as often as I would like. As I said, I build several models at the same time. And now I'm trying to finish Widowmaker, which looks like it's going to test my patience. And unfortunately, we are promised power outages, so that some evenings will be non-working.

I glued the fuselage halves together. There is nothing interesting about this. First, I cut out rectangular holes in the front part and made an imitation of air ducts. Sounds cool). But there's nothing to see there. If you assembled the F-15 model from Hasegawa, then I made approximately the same “imitation”. I made a “mount” from a rod from the frame so that I could “fasten” the nose part without gluing, this is not necessary, I just wanted to see the whole picture).
I started engraving the panels and imitating the fine detailing.
 
 

My copy has an interesting drawback. All transverse lines in the tail section are at an angle to the longitudinal axis. 
Well, you already know what to do)))


As usual, the ICM model serves as a sample. But... As you can see, ICM has many of its own problems:
 
  



Alex

Edited May 19, 2024 by AleTar

[AdrianMF]

As I suspected from the very start, this build is going to be a miracle of modelling modernisation and result in an amazing final model!

 

When you talked about "spare P-40s" I did wonder for a moment how it would fare with two Kittyhawks dangling under the wings....

 

Looking forward to the rest of the build.

 

Regards,

Adrian

[AleTar]

1 hour ago, AdrianMF said:

As I suspected from the very start, this build is going to be a miracle of modelling modernisation and result in an amazing final model!

Oh, thanks for your feedback! I hope this happens. The scale of the work scares me). There are a few technically complex questions that might trip me up. But if everything goes to hell, I'll just take ICM)) 
 

1 hour ago, AdrianMF said:

When you talked about "spare P-40s" I did wonder for a moment how it would fare with two Kittyhawks dangling under the wings....

Haha, this is really funny! Neither I myself nor even anyone watching this forum thread paid attention to this error. All due to the differences between the Cyrillic and Latin alphabet. In Russian, "P" means "R" in English. Literally "Rocket-40"
I remembered the excellent British series about Poirot. There is a episode in which Poirot discovered a cigarette case with the initials “BP” and at first read them as “Bi” and “Pi”, but in fact they were russian “V” and “R”....

 But speaking of the R-40. I'm not sure I'll use them. I'm thinking of taking the "easy way" - buying a set of pylons from RESKIT and leaving them empty. This way I won't have to make the pylons myself. Condor pylons are not even suitable as a base. And the R-40 missiles themselves have a rather complex coloring

But I will return to this issue later, when I have assembled the entire “body” and it becomes clear that this project can be completed.

Alex

[IPMS19]

- I would have been happy to see your helpfull work when I built mine a few year ago .......

 

[AleTar]

On 24/05/2024 at 10:31, IPMS19 said:

- I would have been happy to see your helpfull work when I built mine a few year ago .......

Excellent Mig-25PDS! Looks like this is an old kitt of ICM.
I haven't used this kit, but I think it's better than the Condor.

From the very beginning, I planned to make a PDS out of this kit. Because I have the correct shark mouth and bort number "red 49".
 
 The decals by Begemot were completely wrong. But then I decided that since no one produces “Р”... And PDS, I can someday build from an ICM kit. Although, given the size of the Mig-25 model, even in 72nd scale, I’m unlikely to want another Mig-25)). I absolutely don’t understand those who build models of this monster in 48th scale.

[IPMS19]

1 hour ago, AleTar said:

Excellent Mig-25PDS! Looks like this is an old kitt of ICM.
I haven't used this kit, but I think it's better than the Condor.

From the very beginning, I planned to make a PDS out of this kit. Because I have the correct shark mouth and bort number "red 49".
 
 The decals by Begemot were completely wrong. But then I decided that since no one produces “Р”... And PDS, I can someday build from an ICM kit. Although, given the size of the Mig-25 model, even in 72nd scale, I’m unlikely to want another Mig-25)). I absolutely don’t understand those who build models of this monster in 48th scale.

- You're right those big monsters are very impressive in 48  but they take a lot of space in our show case...What's about this one ? I could'nt resist to her paint scheme

 

[AleTar]

Great model! 
Is this a new kit of ICM?
This is definitely not a Condor)))

This very bright Mig-25PU belonged to the Migremont aircraft repair plant. Used to maintain pilot qualifications. This plane was the one that remained at the aircraft repair plant the longest, I'm not sure if it was eventually scrapped, maybe it's still there. But unfortunately, he has not been flying for a long time. Already in 2007, it was parked on place for aircraft awaiting disposal. But in 2010 he was still there, while most of his “buddies” Mig-25PDS were by that time disposal.

If you are attracted by the bright colors of Ukrainian Air Force aircraft. Then perhaps you will be interested in the two-seat Su-17UM3, which, like this Mig-25PU, belonged to the Migremont aircraft repair plant. But I don't know if anyone has produced a suitable decal.
http://spotters.net.ua/file/?id=97256&size=large
 
https://www.greenmats.club/models.html/models/172/су-17ум3-r724/

Edited May 26, 2024 by AleTar

[IPMS19]

-This Su 17 UM is very attractive in this dress, these photos are coming too late I built it in the former DDR colors and owing to their cheer size I can't afford building another one, my 25PU is from KITTY-HAWK - I had very few documents on this machine only two photos thanksfully in color and the box notice for the shade of blue it has been much of a guess work

-What's about your own MIG 25 ?

[AleTar]

On 26/05/2024 at 12:21, IPMS19 said:

-This Su 17 UM is very attractive in this dress, these photos are coming too late I built it in the former DDR colors and owing to their cheer size I can't afford building another one

I understand. But the Su-17 can be assembled in 72nd scale. Moreover, Modlsvit produces an excellent model. 😉
Problem with decals.
 

On 26/05/2024 at 12:21, IPMS19 said:

my 25PU is from KITTY-HAWK - I had very few documents on this machine only two photos thanksfully in color and the box notice for the shade of blue it has been much of a guess work

Yes, unfortunately there are not many photos of this Mig-25PU in the public domain. But there is this short video on YouTube: 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=46nn8q8lNSI

 

On 26/05/2024 at 12:21, IPMS19 said:

-What's about your own MIG 25 ?

My Mig-25, in progress) Unfortunately, I cannot build the model every day.

I tried installing rear fins. Without glue yet. And the side parts of the fuselage fit fuselage very poorly. Huge gaps. I'll have to use Tamiya epoxy putty. Or most likely, I will use Alteco two-component putty. Alteco was mentioned on the Plasmo YouTube channel. And several of my friends, very good modelers, recommend this putty. It's much cheaper than Tamiya.
But that will come a little later. I continue to engrave panels and make imitation rivets.

I discovered a problem with the canopy. Firstly, it is noticeably smaller in size than the canopy from the ICM. I already knew about this. But proportionally, the binding frames are too thick. If you then make an imitation of pink sealant, then the proportions are greatly upset. That's why I engraved the binding to imitate sealant around the perimeter.
But a new problem has appeared that puzzles me:
 
If we consider the red lines to be correct. When compared to the photos real mig-25, they are almost correct. The green lines are the binding frames. And the blue lines are where the binding frames should be located. 
I don’t yet know exactly how to correct it. I have several ideas, but I don't know which one is the best.

Funny. I carefully polished the lantern. When I look at it, it seems almost ideally transparent to me. But in macro photography it looks terrible.


 

[IPMS19]

1 hour ago, AleTar said:

I understand. But the Su-17 can be assembled in 72nd scale. Moreover, Modlsvit produces an excellent model. 😉
Problem with decals.
 

Yes, unfortunately there are not many photos of this Mig-25PU in the public domain. But there is this short video on YouTube: 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=46nn8q8lNSI

 

 

- I know the situation for you nowaday is not auspicious to modelling and you must have many more problems far more important , be sure I sympathize with you and your country ; Keep going strong my friend

-For the 1/72, I'm now an old man and it is getting too small for my old eyes , that why the 48  and I begin to look toward the 32.

[SarmaT]

15 hours ago, AleTar said:

But a new problem has appeared that puzzles me:
 
If we consider the red lines to be correct. When compared to the photos real mig-25, they are almost correct. The green lines are the binding frames. And the blue lines are where the binding frames should be located.

I would recomend to ignore it otherwise you'll spend half of your life correcting good-for-nothing canopies while decent models can't wait to be assembled.

15 hours ago, AleTar said:

I carefully polished the lantern. When I look at it, it seems almost ideally transparent to me. But in macro photography it looks terrible

What do you polish it with?

[IPMS19]

- Have a try with teeth paste....But  the plastic is eventually too thick