Early Hurricane I, fabric covered wing

[Tomas Enerdal]

Thanks Troy,

I wasn't aware of that the book I recommended was that "bad". Your words of warning are important. I soon realized that the information therein couldn't be trusted so I kind of "put the text aside".

To me it has been, and still is, useful as it is a rather handy collection of detail close-up pics that shows detail while I'm building. True, pics can be found on the net, but then they have to be collected. (which I, of course, also do). Sometimes a pic from a carelessly restored a/c can yet be useful anyway.

Later on a number of overall pics will become useful as inspiration during the painting stages. Like; paint sheen, how wide/narrow is the overspray, wear of the paint, dirt from exhaust, oil spill at the nose, etc. The pics are normally well reproduced and well printed.

Also, the modelling portion may be useful, mainly from an inspirational point of view. How other modellers have approached the painting as such can be interesting. (And also show  how not to do it..)

 

Will look into that Czech book immediately..

Best regards,

Tomas

 

[galgos]

Here’s one of my favourite pics:

 

 

and

 

 

[Troy Smith]

5 hours ago, galgos said:

Thanks for all of that Troy, definitely one to steer clear of. So in your undoubtedly jam-packed Hurricane library what would you say are your top three “go to’s”? 

Ooh, that's a tricky one Max.

It depends of what you want?   

You likely have my recommendations already.

 

From a modellers point of view,  the Wingleader Photo Archive is superb, and does a very good job of unravelling the Hurricane Mk.I,  I certainly learned some new things, and is the best recent book.

https://wingleader.co.uk/books/hurricane-mki-wpa3/

I don't know of a equivalent for later marks, or Canadian production, or the Sea Hurricane, but I'd not be surprised if  they appear in time.

 

Old but still a great foundation is the Ducimus Camo and markings monograph, long OOP, but scanned here

https://boxartden.com/reference/gallery/index.php/Camouflage-Markings/Hawker-Hurricane

 

the old Hurricane at War vol 1 and 2 are still excellent for their large clear photos and good captions, and can usually bought very cheaply via used book sellers, often for essentially the price of postage.

https://www.abebooks.co.uk/9780711005648/Hurricane-Bk-1-Bowyer-Chaz-0711005648/plp

https://www.abebooks.co.uk/book-search/isbn/9780711015746/

 

F.K.mason's original 1962 Hurricane book

is still a good intro to the overall history, and was the first serious book on the Hurricane AFAIK,  and led the 8 year me astray when it turned up in a box book books bought at the end of the day from the village jumble sale....   It should be noted that most subsequent books are based on Mason's work.

 

 

After that you then end up with a list of titles that have useful bits in them,  or cover specific aspects. 

 

I have been collating and posting up threads on her over the years of what I found to be interesting and not covered,  I really should do a post that collect links to these.

 

Yes..  it has been suggested i do a book....  unfortunately I tend to procrastinate....    But at least some of my witter had been put to to good use by Arma Hobby which is flattering and rather surreal.

 

Apologies if this wanders off too much @Tomas Enerdal   but some of the above maybe of interest/use? 

 

cheers

T

 

 

 

[galgos]

Thanks Troy, and it’s all grist to the mill because I think those of us involved in and following Tomas’ excellent thread are Hurricane enthusiasts. I have the Wingleader book and Hurricane at War, excellent as you say, but I must try to find Mason’s book.

[Tomas Enerdal]

Have all but the Mason book, will try to track that one down!

 

Been busy with the airbrush lately. I'm rather pleased so far, although it's still all too neat and shiny. Happily enough, there is no glaring lack of craftsmanship that slaps you in the face, yet. I know, those push-pin marks on the walls, but they cannot be seen later (I hope).

The funny thing is that they are painted with the Vallejo metal paints, which I shouldn't be able to handle at all. Am all for lacquers and enamels and have never been able to handle, even less master the acrylics.

I used two shades, Aluminium for the outward and upper sides of things, the slightly darker Duralumin for the walls, under the floor and undersides. I doubt if the difference can be seen, perhaps it will add some depth in the end?

(For the Gray Green I will use Humbrol 120, according to @Paul Lucas it's the closest to the wartime MAP colour.)

 

 

 

(The little star-wheel in front of the pedals turned out nicely.)

 

To be continued,

[2996 Victor]

On 13/12/2023 at 15:37, Tomas Enerdal said:

Have all but the Mason book, will try to track that one down!

Hi Tomas,

 

I have a spare copy of the Mason book if you'd like it. The jacket is as bit scruffy but the binding and book itself are in lovely condition. 

 

I'll drop you a pm 

 

Cheers, 

Mark 

[Troy Smith]

53 minutes ago, Tomas Enerdal said:

To me it has been, and still is, useful as it is a rather handy collection of detail close-up pics that shows detail while I'm building

Good. It's not totally useless, and does have a few handy bits, like the image of psychrometer for the Met Flight Hurricane, that was pointed out to me. 

I must confess i tend not too look at it dispassionately and find the good bits as it can get me to me very cross in a short time.....

[Tomas Enerdal]

If ARMA had the very good taste to ask for your advice, I sincerely hope that Kotare will do the same, if and when they will design their 1/32 kit..

[Tomas Enerdal]

Not much progress, I'm afraid, nothing to show.

Cockpit getting details painted on. And in these times it's more family than modelling. (But the IIb from ARMA arrived today, just in time!)

Merry Cristmas & a Happy New Year!

Edited December 23, 2023 by Tomas Enerdal

[Tomas Enerdal]

A little progress, perhaps.

With emphasis on little. The holidays come with other priorities than modelling. And detail painting is slow. A little black here, a little gray-green there, some silver needs to be touched up. And all the time paint has to dry in between (I'm an old-fashioned Humbrol dinosaur, remember?)

The seven small bolts on the head armour was fun! It's 0.2 mm brass rod inserted in holes and glued from behind. then carefully sanded to even height.

Some careful dry brushing has been done, but no wash yet (except some brown on the footboards). Yahu instrument panel and reflector sight are waiting in the wings.

 

 

To be continued,

Edited January 5 by Tomas Enerdal

[Tomas Enerdal]

Wash added. I'm now beginning to get that simply marvelous feeling, that things are beginning to come to "life". But to be honest, the level and "clumsiness" of detail makes it clear that it's "only 1/48". I'm getting seriously curious about what can be done in 1/32... 

The wash I'm using is something I've learnt from Roy Sutherland, of Cooper Details/Barracuda. It's 1 part future, 1 part water and a small amount of acrylic dark gray/a little brown. The result should look like slightly dirty water. The future makes the wash draw to the corners while drying and the paint does not flock. The result is very subtle, just let it dry and add more layers as and if needed. The future also add a little sheen to an otherwise dead finish. If you think it's too glossy, spray on a flatter clear afterwards

 

 

I'm quickly getting nearer to closing the fuselage off.

 

 

Just showing the details that will be under the floorboards and interior. I'm simply trying to add some further detail, to make also the bottom of the cockpit look busy and to give further depth.

 

To be continued,

[galgos]

Interesting notes about the wash Tomas, and very timely! If you’re thinking about 1/32, I’m working on a PCM metal wing (plus Fawcett correction sets + AIMS prop) at the moment. The kit is not the easiest but is quite well documented on many modelling forums including BM. I’m at the painting stage too and thinking about the war weary Battle of Britain finish so may try your method. A couple of recent shots:

 

 

 

[2996 Victor]

Tomas, don't under-sell yourself - those cockpit details are looking superb! Wonderfully clean and neat assembly and detailing. Thank you also for reminding me about Roy S's wash recipe, as I need to "do" my Tamiya P-47D wheel bays soon  

 

Max @galgos - that's a lovely looking 1/32 Hurricane! With Tomas' indulgence, can I just offer my tuppence-worth on weathering, please? Would a BoB Hurricane actually be heavily weathered? It's my understanding that turn-over of aircraft was fairly rapid due to attrition, and although the Hurricane's design made it more "repairable" than the Spit, I wouldn't think there would have been much opportunity for paint fading or more than minimal chipping. Happy to be corrected, but perhaps @Troy Smith could offer some insight?

 

Cheers,

Mark

[galgos]

Thank you Mark for your observations, and I agree 100%, not “heavily” weathered but certainly looking dull from being outside most of the time. My model is based on this “still” from the famous Pathe News 56 Squadron scramble:

 

If you’re at all interested the build log to date is here. 

 

[Troy Smith]

1 hour ago, 2996 Victor said:

Would a BoB Hurricane actually be heavily weathered? It's my understanding that turn-over of aircraft was fairly rapid due to attrition, and although the Hurricane's design made it more "repairable" than the Spit, I wouldn't think there would have been much opportunity for paint fading or more than minimal chipping.

How long is a piece of string? 

Difficult to generalise.

Some BoB planes were quite old,  as they may have been with 10 or 12 Group, and not in the frontline.

Early Gloster built Hurricanes had notable issues with paint adhesion, and can look very shabby.

example LK-G P2829

 

The Pilot , Sgt Laurence A "Rubber" Thorogood  was a keen photographer, and it's his photos you often see of 87 Sq late BoB, including the inflight images of LK-A.

There are a few more of LK-G about.

This is seen on some other Gloster built planes.  but not others. 

Usual thing, if this is of interest, work from photos and any supplementary information,  like airframe history.  This is more indepth, I have a Hurricane production list sent to me, which has production/delivery dates,  and if a machine is couple of weeks old, it should not be tatty.

There are older airframes, 

L1926

seen here in spring 1939  as OP-M

and then in Oct 1940,  niot has either been repainted or possibly refabriced as now has a 8 inch serial

 

Ended up later with 55OTU, there is a pic of it nosed over, still with a fabric wing.

 

etc etc.

HTH

 

[Tomas Enerdal]

Thank you for the kind words!

 

I can only chime in Max @galgos, what a lovely Mk.I !

The wash method I learnt from the BarracudaStudios homepage, where Roy S shows us how to paint resin seats, here. Note that he warns that it's not as good for panel washes. I have made some early testing, though, and I believe it will work perfectly all right also for panel lines and exteriors. Your US-U looks nicely semi-gloss, seems like perfect conditions. (But considering Roy's warning, some testing first?) What's so great with that method is that you can make the wash so thin, that it can be carefully built up with successive layers. And one can use different shades of colour in the washes, to generate fine variation over the surface. Variation gives life to a model! I'm really looking forward to use the method more on this Hurricane. Carefully, less is more.

It doesn't show too well in the pics, but the wash worked a little like a filter on the surfaces of the cockpit interior. It suddenly gave life to an otherwise dull and "dead" surface.

 

Mark @2996 Victor, I'm not under-selling myself. On the contrary, I'm very pleased (perhaps even just a little proud..) with the results so far. It's just that the scale clumsiness shows in the parts, even though I've added details and aftermarket. (The overly thick cockpit frames have been noted earlier). I believe that a much finer cockpit could have been made with the Revell 1/32 Mk.IIb as an example, with the same effort. Only because the cockpit parts are so much finer and to scale. However, I'm also looking very much forward to the ARMA 1/48 Hurricane family! Whose cockpit details are just wonderful, too.

 

Finally, @Troy Smith's advise, to always work from photos is so important. What makes it so fun is that each real a/c has some kind of "spirit" to its looks. To hunt for that spirit, and to try to replicate it, is just sooo rewarding!

[Tomas Enerdal]

Sorry for the delay.

My interior structure, frame/floor/back/seat/IP  was getting near to completion. Surprisingly it all seemed to fit very nicely within the fuselage. I was just about to write a progress report, when:

Some days ago disaster struck.

A lamp above my modelling desk fell down, striking the interior. Result: Five separate major pieces, twisted and torn. Several pipes fitted with CA loose. Joystick broken in the middle, its fragile mounting twisted and broken. The rear bulkhead with seat had not yet been finally glued in place, however, and got away with it without a scratch.

From a mental perspective, the journey from then on has been interesting, to put it mildly. Frustration, sadness, anger. Was I going to bin the model at this stage, after all effort and engagement? A very good modelling friend told me to at least try to save it. (he told me about his feelings when his cat had played with his just finished 1/32 Roden Albatross D.III...)

After one day with just black despair, I could at least look at it and slowly and carefully see if, and what could be done.

This type of modelling is something quite different! It cannot be planned as such. Broken pieces have to mended, while still being attached to others, all very fragile. Small details re-attached in VERY difficult to reach places. Having to carefully but forcibly try to twist things/sub-assemblies back into straight shape. All very humbling, slightly scary, but also rewarding when it actually seems to work. (That joystick almost made me give up...)

Adding up several days of altogether different and difficult work; to my surprise I realize that it may perhaps work in the end?! The very cramped interior is my friend this time. I can see mendings that will in fact not be visible in the end, too far below and/or behind . And if a mending could be done properly, the touch up paint hides it!

This is what it looks like today:

 

It may work. To be continued (even if I doubted it some days ago),  

Edited January 21 by Tomas Enerdal
Better pic

[galgos]

So sorry to hear about your disaster Tomas, I guess in one form or another it happens to most of us! I was building a 1/32 Hawker Fury biplane when it fell off the (tall) jig that it was resting on….result….top wing off, struts all over the place, rigging like spaghetti! Like you, a huge mixture of emotions but mostly my own stupidity! I walked away for a week, but the repair when I returned was surprisingly straightforward, et viola:

 

The moral is, even when disaster strikes, the situation can usually be sorted with patience and determination! Good luck Tomas. 

[2996 Victor]

So sorry to hear this, Tomas, I can certainly empathise with you. But the repairs look absolutely spot-on to me, and when the cockpit is assembled and the fuselage closed, you'll be able to permit yourself a smile and a nod, and say, "Yes, that's good!"

 

Onward, my friend, and upward  And Max @galgos has shown the way! Superb Fury, Max!

 

All the best,

Mark

[Tomas Enerdal]

Thanks for the kind words, and encouragement! Repair work is making great progress, and the feeling of despair being replaced with hope is very rewarding.

That's a VERY nice Fury, in the most interesting scheme too. Alley Cat kit, Montex?

[Tomas Enerdal]

It worked! It fits!

 

To be continued,

Edited January 22 by Tomas Enerdal

[galgos]

AlleyCat Tomas, originally Montex. I have the beautiful spatted version to build too, lots of shiny bits! 

[2996 Victor]

2 hours ago, Tomas Enerdal said:

It worked! It fits!

Fantastic!  

[Tomas Enerdal]

The cockpit is almost finished. The only thing missing are the two harness straps, from the seat to the head armour. And the reflector sight, which will be added after I've closed the fuselage up.

 

-It's funny, but the whole cockpit inner structure is slightly askew, a little twisted after the accident. Yet it fits like a glove and looks just perfect in place...

-And my suspicions have been confirmed. A lot of what I've worked so hard with the last month, cannot be seen in place really, not in detail. But it all looks very busy and crammed just as I believe it should. All very rewarding, I'm so pleased. And most important, I know it's there. And so do you, dear readers!

 

 

 

To be continued,

[galgos]

Looks marvellous Tomas, and yes your fans do appreciate everything that’s crammed in so meticulously!