Dragon No. 6302 1:35 Tiger II advice required

[Kelscale]

I am about to start Dragon's 2007 Tiger II #6302 kit with Zimmerit and would like some advice from Tiger II aficionados as to which early Krupp turreted tanks this could build into without exhaustive modification.

 

I have read a few kit reviews but am still unsure whether OOB it can portray any of the first Krupp turreted vehicles.  I’m not super bothered about 100% accuracy, but I would like to make sure it has the main features represented.

 

What I have gleaned so far is:

 

• Unlike their non-Zim boxing from 2006 it has an odd anomaly with the turret moulding in so far as the bulge on the right side is exaggerated.
• The rear turret hatch plate is undersized and the Zim part in the kit does not have the prominent bolts on it (adding the bolt heads from the non-Zim part in the kit should be an easy fix)
• The rear hull plate is totally covered in Zim when in fact it should be clear behind the exhausts.  (Easy enough fix)
• The first 6/7 production vehicles had no cut out at the top of the glacis below the radio operator’s periscope (at some point a cut out similar to the driver’s side was carried out to provide better visibility) The kit glacis moulding depicts the cut out later plate.
• Only the first few tanks had the earlier type of gun site and the two elongated holes in the turret. (Later models only show the inner one)
• The kit turret has weld lines around the cupola. All the first Krupp turrets had bolted on cupolas.  (Chiselling off and smoothing the turret and raising the cupola with plastic card looks to be an option)
• The central turret roof plate weld lines on the turret moulding are sunk indicating an earlier and thinner plate.
• The kit only offers the Monoblock gun tube. (In both metal and plastic)
• The kit does not provide the early Tiger I type exhaust shields.
• Turret sockets (pilze) are offered as additional parts with witness marks on the turret marking their position. (If and when were these added?)

 

Any assistance would be gratefully appreciated along with any correction to any of my observations

 

Edited September 19, 2023 by Kelscale

[Retired Bob]

2 hours ago, Kelscale said:

I have read a few kit reviews but am still unsure whether OOB it can portray any of the first Krupp turreted vehicles.  I’m not super bothered about 100% accuracy, but I would like to make sure it has the main features represented.

A few years ago I decided to build one of the early batch of Krupp turreted King Tigers that was assigned to 1.s.Pz.Kp. (Fkl) with the large white 11 on the turret.

This was the kit used:

 

The problem with Dragon's King Tigers with the zimmerit added is they have added it to all the surfaces without regard to how it was actually applied, which was after the items like the exhaust shields and tool clamps were fitted to the hull.  Dragon have added most of these fittings on top of the zimmerit.

You have itemised most of the differences, I'll just run through what I found.

Starting at the front, as you mentioned, the cutout in front of the m/g operators periscope was not on the first batch of five tanks, Ser no 280001-280005 and Dragon have put the front mud guard brackets on top of the zimmerit.

 

These were corrected and the m/g mounting bulge and headlight with cable were fitted.

 

The armoured hull ring was not fitted to the turret attachment ring, and as you mentioned the turret cupola was bolted onto the turret roof, not welded, I removed the weld material and added some plastic sheet to retain the correct cupola height.  These early tanks did not have the pilze on the turret roof.  Roof welds were improved and made flush/slightly proud of the roof plates. 

 

 

As you mention, these early tanks had the monobloc barrel fitted and the gun sight was the binocular type with two ports in the turret front face.  Later versions had a monocular gun sight and the outer hole was welded shut.

 

The rear plate needs a lot of work to remove the zimmerit for the exhaust pipe armoured covers, also to remove this cover marked in black, this was for cold weather starting assistance, basically a blow torch to pre-heat the engine block.

 

Here is the rear plate with the zimmerit and cover removed.  Removing all that plastic does weaken the panel, I reinforced mine with some epoxy resin.

 

Besides the exhaust shrouds these early tanks also had angled exhaust pipes and a river fording breather periscope, with an armoured cover fitted.  The engine intake grills had the debris mesh covers fitted but not the forward large mesh protectors that prevented mines/explosive charges being inserted under the turret bustle.

 

These tanks had the 18 tooth sprockets and Gg 24/800/300 tracks fitted.

 

Hope this helps with your build, any further help you need,  just ask.

[Kelscale]

Thanks Bob. Appreciated. I've just ran through your build log.

 

One question regarding this kit in particular is that although it came with a metal barrel, there is no mention of it in the instructions!  It simple shows the split plastic barrel parts fitted directly into the mantlet! Looking at the Scalemates site and downloading the non zim kit 6312, this shows the barrel fitting into two collars before sitting in the mantlet.  The outer (part H7) is a simple collar) but the inner collar (part H8) is moulded with an inner tube that slides only into the non zim mantlet. The metal barrel only fits inside the zim mantlet part.

 

On further inspection sitting both the kits zim mantlet and non zim part upright clearly has the zim part much taller. To get a match in height the non zim part requires the inner tube collar. The outer collar will fit outside either but the crucial visual difference is there is only one step on the zim mantlet and two on the non zim part!

 

Confused I am🫣

 

Now looking at both pre-production and period images of the monoblic barrel it appears there are differences. Tiger 11 from the first production batch looks like it only has the outer collar fitted. I can only see one step. Looking at other tanks I can definately see two steps and an obvious wider collar off the mantlet.

 

Can you enlighten me as to you what you see or know

Edited September 20, 2023 by Kelscale

[Retired Bob]

I avoided the Dragon parts for the mantlet and barrel by using the ArmorScale barrel and resin mantlet with zimm, as you can see it has a slight step at the front that doesn't appear on tank 11.  This barrel set wasn't an easy fit to the Dragon kit, I used a section of plastic rod to attach it to the kit breech part, but the brass muzzle was much better than the Dragon plastic one.  I should have taken a sanding stick to smooth out that step but it has nice detail of the locking screw heads so I left it as is. 

 

As for the turret rear hatch, there are not many clear photos of that area so I left it alone, I have since found a photo that shows the sic conical bolt heads stand proud of the zimm so I will add those to my model.

The tracks I replaced with Fruil ones, heavy, but are correct for this tank.

 

Most of the photos I have and information are coming from this book.

 

As usual, Dragon instructions are a mine field, trying to find parts and if there are any alternate kit parts you are left to find out for yourself which one to use.  I notice in the kit instructions they tell you to fit the spare track hooks for all marking options which is wrong, they and the turret roof pilzen were only appearing on tanks made after June 1944.

Edited September 21, 2023 by Retired Bob
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