keefr22 Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 These might fit the bill ; http://www.lycoseshop.co.uk/epages/twosixd...roducts/144-381 Keef Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAC Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 (edited) I'm not sure about Airfix's 707 but certainly their BAC1-11 came with Aer Lingus as an option. You might need two sheets to get enough cheatline length. The Shamrock and titles should be okay though. And you can change the reg from the spares box or get one of those letter decal sheets. Cheers. ***EDIT*** Looks like Keefr22 has found what you need! Edited February 22, 2008 by BAC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Mc Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 Thanks for the replies. I didn't realise Two-Six did a proper 720 set. It might be worth looking at. Unfortunately, the scheme they have chosen to depict is the 1964-74 Irish InternationalAer Lingus colours. I was hoping to complete the model in its original 1960 delivery scheme which had the titles "Irish International Airlines" only on the roof and the same shades of green were used for both the green stripes and the shamrock carried on the tailfin. Regarding models, the Airfix Boeing 707-436 has only carried BOAC or BA colours and is not really suitable for conversion to either a 720 (fuselage too long, incorrect wing plan form) or a 707-348C (the Rolls Royce Conways look nothing like Pratt and Whitney JT3Ds and, again, the wing is very different to that of a 320B/C series 707). The old Frog 707 is a possibility although it is so inaccurate in outline shape that it is hard to work out what version of the 707/C-135 family it is trying to portray. It was the Frog model which was released in Aer Lingus colours. I made the kit way back in the 1970s (I still have the box art somewhere although the model is long gone). I realised after I'd made my original posting that Welsh Models do a very accurate Boeing 720 so that looks like the way to go - even if it fairly expensive and a vacform. That Airfix 1-11 looks nice in the 1960s Aer Lingus scheme. I have an unbuilt one stashed away somewhere. Of course, the Airfix 1-11 needs some cosmetic surgery on its nose to make it look like a proper production 1-11. The model was based on the prototype and early production 1-11. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keefr22 Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 That Airfix 1-11 looks nice in the 1960s Aer Lingus scheme. I have an unbuilt one stashed away somewhere. Of course, the Airfix 1-11 needs some cosmetic surgery on its nose to make it look like a proper production 1-11. The model was based on the prototype and early production 1-11. Two-six used to do a resin correction nose for the Airfix kit too - I'm not sure if its still available, it was about the middle of last year. And it may be worth dropping an e-mail to Ray that runs two-six as he's one of the most prolific decal producers about. He posts on the Yahoo airliner modelling group & sometimes announces 2 or more new decals a day!! I've also seen him respond to specific requests on there & as he already has a fair range of Aer Lingus sheets he may well be happy to add another! After reading your post yesterday & seeing all the A-L sheets he does, I now fancy a sheet to do my S-M Viscount as an Aer Lingus machine - but I'd also like the earlier scheme with the green cabin top ! And I think the Welsh kit is definitely the way to go for a 720! Keef Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Mc Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 I have the Corgi Die Cast Aer Lingus Viscount (I know, the shame) so I will pass up on doing the S&M Viscount in Aer Lingus colours. However, I have a couple of Welsh Model Viscount 700s tucked away and at least one of them may emerge (one day) in Aer Lingus colours. For the moment, I'd better concentrate on finishing off the Minicraft 707. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keefr22 Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 For the moment, I'd better concentrate on finishing off the Minicraft 707. Please post some pics when it's done.... Keef Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Mc Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 Please post some pics when it's done.... Keef Posting pictures on web forums is one of my weak spots. If I work out how to do it, I will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Mc Posted March 20, 2009 Share Posted March 20, 2009 It is amazing that after all the 707/KC-135 models produced by kit manufacturers over the years, so few of them build up into accurate renditions of the Boeings they claim to be. As far as the 720 goes, the only decent model ever has to be the Welshmodels Vacform. I need to get one someday as I have a set of lovely Maxdecal Irish International Airlines sheet to go on a 720. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennings Heilig Posted March 29, 2009 Share Posted March 29, 2009 The Frog/Novo kit is a 707-120. I think it is now an Eastern Express kit with Pan American decals. I don't know about accuracy though.HTH Paul Harrison Frog/Novo kit is a 707-420. The Revell kit is a 707-120/120B (depending on the engines). The Revell KC-135 kit is a 707-120 with a wildly incorrect boom pod, acres of rivets, and a totally incorrect cargo door (but it's still a 707-120). The Revell kit is NOT an E-3 Sentry AWACS (no matter what the box says). The Revell "720" is also a 707-120 (seeing a pattern here?). The 720 can be pretty easily modified from the Revell -120 kit, but it needs the inboard wing section 'glove' on the leading edge (which increased the sweep angle between the fuselage and the inboard engines). The 720 also used much smaller main wheels than any 707 or KC-135 (they look almost comically small). Depending whether you're doing a 720 or a 720B, you may either use the engines from the 720 boxing or the turbofans from one of the other releases. The fuselage of the 720 was 20" shorter fwd of the wing (3.5mm in 1/144 - but the Revell kit is approximately 1/139-ish), and 80" shorter aft of the wing (14.1mm in 1/144) compared to the 707-120 series. You can't start with any other 707 kit, as all of them (Airfix, Minicraft, and Frog/Novo) are all 707 Intercontinentals with a much different wing. I've got scads of information if you need it. Just email me direct ([email protected]) and I'll hook you up. J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Bradshaw Posted March 29, 2009 Share Posted March 29, 2009 (edited) There's but one Boeing 720 kit: a Welsh Models 1/144 scale vacform with jewel-like resin engines and fine white metal landing gear. I have it and it's superb. All other "720s" are wrong, often in a variety of very big ways! Revell is a particular offender. The 720 was indeed a version of the 707 (its official designations were Model 707-020 and '020B) but had small main wheels (actually smaller than the nose wheels!, and here Welsh gets it somehwat wrong). Hi Skip, You are quite correct about the the size of the mainwheels being slightly oversize on the Welsh Models Boeing 720 - that was a compromise on my part when I made the master patterns for the kit. I had also mastered the Welsh Models KC-135 and 707-320 series, so I used the same wheels and undercarriage throughout! Hopefully, this will not have detracted from the rest of the kit too much? Cheers Derek Edited March 29, 2009 by Derek Bradshaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Mc Posted April 10, 2009 Share Posted April 10, 2009 Hi Skip,You are quite correct about the the size of the mainwheels being slightly oversize on the Welsh Models Boeing 720 - that was a compromise on my part when I made the master patterns for the kit. I had also mastered the Welsh Models KC-135 and 707-320 series, so I used the same wheels and undercarriage throughout! Hopefully, this will not have detracted from the rest of the kit too much? Cheers Derek Very interesting replies all round - thanks folks. This project is still very much a long term one so I don't think I'll be producing a 720 any day soon. The 707 was finished quite a while ago and I will post up some pics shortly (I've now sorted out how to do this). Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Aer Lingus Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 (edited) Hi Eric, I may be wrong on this one (memory you know , so forgive if I should lead you astray), and I'm sure that more knowledable modellers shall correct me if I am wrong, but I seem to recall that Airfix originally released their Boeing 707-436(?) in BOAC and Aer Lingus collours back in the early 70's. If this is correct, maybe someone may still have the original kit decals as spares (although it's anyone's guess as to the quality of them by now!). HTH Derek Frog released an Aer Lingus 707 as did Revell both in 144th ish scale. The Frog kit has decals for EI-AMW Revell is spurious EI-AET. Joe Maxwell (MaxDecals) produced a 144th sheet with aer lingus colour schemes for original and white shamrock 707's not sure if its still available though. Welshmodels kit is probably best bet for 720 & Twosix have sheets for Shamrock 720/707 a'c . Edited October 6, 2012 by Team Aer Lingus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F-RSIN Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Also, the 720 has an inner wing "glove" on the leading edge that no 707 or KC-135 ever had. J I beg to differ. When the early 707-120s or 707-138s were converted to "B" standards, or build new as 707-120Bs or 707-138Bs, they got the glove. Laurent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenshb Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Authentic Airliners will be releasing a Boeing 720 too. As it is all resin, it should be easier to build than the Welsh vac/resin kit. Having a few Welsh Models kits, I would say that the detail in this kit will be far better than the Welsh kit too. http://www.authentic-airliners.de/1-144-kits/1-144-720b-kit/ Jens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev1n Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 solid resin I guess? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzn20 Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 (edited) Aurora did a 720 in 1/104th scale,but i doubt if you'd call it that! its a cross between a 365-80 and something with a Boeing shaped nose I cant believe the amount of inaccurate KC-135/707/720 kits. the KC-135 was a completely different aeroplane from the 707-120.The 707 fuselage is 10 foot ish longer.You can shorten it,but then you have to reduce the fuse width.and then the fuselage section is different.The wings are different.The two aircraft were built to a different of specs.So no parts were interchangeable.The cockpit area looks the same but the dimensions are not. The original number given to the 720 was the 707-020.In 1957 the 707-020 became the 717,a bit odd as that number was already spoken for with the KC-135 programme (then used again for the MD95 in '97).I remember reading somewhere that 727 had already given to the next new airliner Boeing was designing.They eventually settled for the 720 model number.American airlines 720's were flying with 707 lettering on the rear fuselage,just to cloud things even further. Aurora issued a 707 American Airlines "Astro Jet" but pictured a 720-023B on the box front (N7527A) In 1958/59 my dad,BOAC 707- 436 flight engineer on one of the 1st flights to Idlewild (now JFK) bought me back the Aurora "707-121" (N707PA).Actually it was a 367-80,probably all they had to go on to rush the model out.it's 1/104th scale ( i just checked!) and as a 4/5 year old i loved it. A few years later......As he was a 707 FE instructor and also took cabin crew for emergency procedures(SEP),he re decorated it in Gold Speedbird colours added emergency exits,wing walkway markings etc.its still around,hanging in the garage over a Super VC-10 FE's throttle box from G-ASGR and a 61 Squadron emblem and skin,taken off one of his Avro Lincolns and a 707 undercarriage emergency winding handle. Edited October 5, 2012 by bzn20 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMChladek Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 I wouldn't necessarily say that 135s were "completely different" from 707s as elements of the wings, engines and landing gear were very close to one another since both were derived from the 367-80 prototype. I believe Boeing also tried to keep several of the sub-assemblies at least close as the original plan was for the 707 to use the fuselage cross section used on the KC-135, but when they got wind that the DC-8 was going to be wider, they redesigned the fuselage for the 707 all together (adding to the financial risk and costs of the project). It is the fuselage that causes the biggest bugaboos (as has been well documented already in this thread and elsewhere). As for the 720 designation itself, it has been reported in a couple magazine articles I've read that it was simply a sales and marketing thing. United wanted to buy airliners, but they didn't want to buy a "707 variant" since they had already committed to the DC-8. So somebody in sales came up with the 720 designation to make United's people happy. Since the 720 had many key differences from the 707 in terms of its primary uses and systems, the designation pretty much stuck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzn20 Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 (edited) As the fuse sections are a different shape,the width is the big changer.That makes it another animal.The KC-135's wing was more 367-80.From a modeling point of view the interchangability of parts between the 707 and all its siblings doesn't matter.The KC-135 cockpit seemed slightly smaller.But the KC-135 is made of different material from the 707 so because of that the frames, stringers,intercostals,cleats and gauge (thickness) will be in slightly different places and sizes.When you walk on a KC-135 its nothing like a 707/720.It doesnt matter how it started out.its how it finished up.The 367-80 DNA is in both.they are as different as brothers and sisters. The 720 is a light weight 707 , again from the modelling angle its just down to shapes and size.but the 2 aeroplanes are quite different,like a smaller brother. It cost Boeing a small fortune to redesign the 707's revised "airline" fuselage,floor height,fuse cross section, wings etc.but the money from 800+ KC-135's paid for it. The only jets in this boeing family i havent worked on including one KC-135 is the 707-120, -400 and -700 series and AWACS and the rest of the many C-135 variants . i've read loads of info like you.What do i believe? I dont know anything about United's imput ,but i can believe that they would/could have got the model number changed.i have 3 books here next to me that mention quite a bit of everything else apart from United Airlines,i'd have to get it from a boeing man.Its like arguing what the weather is going to be when you watched BBC and your mate watched ITV.Its chucking it down here btw,they said it was going to be dry aswell. Edited October 5, 2012 by bzn20 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennings Heilig Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 The KC-135's wing was more 367-80. Externally, other than some vortex generators, the KC-135 wing and the 707-120 wing were identical. The KC-135 cockpit seemed slightly smaller.But the KC-135 is made of different material from the 707 so because of that the frames, stringers,intercostals,cleats and gauge (thickness) will be in slightly different places and sizes. They are structurally identical, and were built on the same tooling jigs. The different alloy made no difference in the size of the parts. I've been on the floor and seen the jigs with my own eyes. They were still being used in the 1980s to build 737 cockpit cab sections. The only jets in this boeing family i havent worked on including one KC-135 is the 707-120, -400 and -700 series and AWACS and the rest of the many C-135 variants . i've read loads of info like you.What do i believe? I dont know anything about United's imput ,but i can believe that they would/could have got the model number changed.i have 3 books here next to me that mention quite a bit of everything else apart from United Airlines,i'd have to get it from a boeing man.Its like arguing what the weather is going to be when you watched BBC and your mate watched ITV.Its chucking it down here btw,they said it was going to be dry aswell. United's insistence on the 720 name is historical fact. Well documented. There is no 707-700 series... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessica Posted October 6, 2012 Share Posted October 6, 2012 There is no 707-700 series... Almost. Except for validating the KC-135R mod, it didn't get anywhere because Boeing was worried about spoiling the sales of the 757 so they quietly killed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garryrussell Posted October 6, 2012 Share Posted October 6, 2012 The Boeing 707-700 prorotype was converted back to a standard -320 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F-RSIN Posted October 6, 2012 Share Posted October 6, 2012 The Boeing 707-700 prorotype was converted back to a standard -320 No. Sorry, but it's important not to confuse the -320 and the -320B/-320C The -320 and the -320B/-320C are not the same aircraft. In this specific case, the 707-700 was converted to a 707-320C. Laurent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev1n Posted October 6, 2012 Share Posted October 6, 2012 Laurent makes a good point there and one that is often missed. I know this is a thread about the 720 but to do the 707's in a quick and cheap way; take the airfix 707-420 and you *can* make a 707-320 out of it. you cannot make a 707-320B or C out of it unless you change the wings. for a 720 you *can* get away with modding the revell 707-120 kit ,maybe that wont satisfy the purists but like I said, it's the quick and cheap way of doing it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzn20 Posted October 6, 2012 Share Posted October 6, 2012 (edited) Historical fact.This is what goes wrong sometimes,someone writes a book/article.thats it,set in the history of what ever the subject is.United named the 720 ( is marketing ) PR or spin.We all believe spin dont we?Thats what i was saying.I didnt say he was wrong. The cockpit roof structure,thats the internal angle/stringers on the 707-320 series is the same as the 727 and 737. And different to the KC-135.Another quirk about working on the Boeing 707 (same for any Boeing) the manual for a -328 cant be used for working on a -351 or any other 707 KC-135 was built to safe life spec.the 707 fail safe spec.built to different spec.is that the same as?The C-135's jigs being used to build civilian airliners?.One of the 1st lumps of tax payers money on a millitary contract is for Materiel and tooling.jigs are tooling and they belong to the United States,not Boeing.they'd get shot with the proverbial if they got caught using them too. after a contract is fulfilled they are scrapped.Its a waste of money,but thats what they do.it goes on here in the UK too. i'm not only going to get rid of all my books,none of them mention the United historical detail and a couple of them have even included a 707-700. Edited October 6, 2012 by bzn20 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzn20 Posted October 6, 2012 Share Posted October 6, 2012 Forgot to mention this kit conversion article i found. http://www.airlinerc.../page.php?id=73 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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