Denatured Alcohol

[mollythedog]

I have just got my delivery of Bare Metal decal paper,and contacted them about using their Liquid Decal Film as a finishing coat. (Despite being fairly happy with the Revell matt varnish I already tried,I have a bottle of this stuff and want to try it out).

I contacted Bare Metal yesterday,and Randy said I should use denatured alcohol to clean the airbrush out afterwards. What is it? Where can it be obtained? As I am in France I have no idea,but atleast if I know what it is and where I can get it in England it would be a start.

As with any plastic type liquid I want to be sure I can get it OUT of the airbrush once it has been put in! As for brushing it, I have tried that but I have quite a large decal I want to seal all in one go,and spraying is the way to go.

Any ideas?

Thanks in advance

mtd

[andym]

I have just got my delivery of Bare Metal decal paper,and contacted them about using their Liquid Decal Film as a finishing coat. (Despite being fairly happy with the Revell matt varnish I already tried,I have a bottle of this stuff and want to try it out).

I contacted Bare Metal yesterday,and Randy said I should use denatured alcohol to clean the airbrush out afterwards. What is it? Where can it be obtained? As I am in France I have no idea,but atleast if I know what it is and where I can get it in England it would be a start.

As with any plastic type liquid I want to be sure I can get it OUT of the airbrush once it has been put in! As for brushing it, I have tried that but I have quite a large decal I want to seal all in one go,and spraying is the way to go.

Any ideas?

Thanks in advance

mtd

It's another name for methylated spirits. Isopropyl alcohol would probably work too.

HTH,

Andy

[Muller]

Methylated spirts. Alcohol with additives to make it undrinkable apparently.

[mollythedog]

Ah hah! Thanks to you both! I'll have to try a wee dram of the stuff. After I have cleaned the A/B....

THe other reason I asked what is was,is because I have several air brushes,and keep each exclusively for a type of paint-acrylic, enamel, or top coat varnishes. I suppose I could put this stuff through the A/B I keep for normal Humbrol without damaging anything.

Thanks again,will give it a try.

Cheers

mtd

[Muller]

I use 100% IPA (isopropyl alcohol) when spraying tamiya acrylics and for clean up afterwards. With humbrol enamels, I use white spirits to thin the paint and clean the AB. Never had any problems.

That liquid decal film must be water-based, 'cos for me, IPA does nothing to clean enamels. And for a real good clean of the AB I use cellolose thinners (Satans toilet cleaner!)

[mollythedog]

S'funny,but I contacted Bare Metal to ask how to thin this Liquid Decal Film so that I could airbrush it. The answer was,you can,but then you'd need to use more of it to get the same effect-in other words,if you trying to be cheap...don't. I was actually asking the question because,to my eyes,the liquid in the bottle looked far too thick to spray as it was.

Guess what-it is. I poured some in my trusty Iwata HP-C,that I use only for varnish finishes this morning,and got nowt out.Regardless of trigger setting nor pressure.Tipped it out in the end,as it looked like it was trying to gel in the A/B, and quickly flushed it out with cellulose.

Plan B calls for a bottle of Meths,sold here as Alcool a Bruler ,but as it all seems to be tinged in mauve I think it could affect the clear colour of the Liquid Mask. I suppose I could use a brush,but I want to coat a large decal (6"-150mm long) and don't want any chance of the ink lifting off of the paper by physical contact,hence the use of an A/B.

I only mention this in case anyone else plans to go this way. In the meantime, I used some of my remaining Micro Mark Last Step,which stinks a bit and is difficult to coat evenly without runs. Having the patience to draw the artwork,source the paper,work out print and colour settings and finally print the thing is one thing,but to have to wait while I work out how different decal coatings work (or not) is beyond my endurance.

Onwards and sideways...

mtd

[Muller]

PM me if you want some 100% IPA, I can send you a bottle. Don't know if there might be an issue sending a flammable liquid in the post though. Maybe someone here might know the rules & regulations??

[ptcruiser]

PM me if you want some 100% IPA, I can send you a bottle. Don't know if there might be an issue sending a flammable liquid in the post though. Maybe someone here might know the rules & regulations??

You got it in one Muller. IPA has a flash point of <10°C putting in the highly flammable category - not a good idea to smoke nearby either! Lots and lots of packaging regulations aroud shipping hazardous materials: the primary packaging (that is in contact with the liquid) secondary packing (that you put the bottle in) supporting documentation, package labelling. That's just for starters...

Would be easier to deliver by hand! Especially to Belle France!

Rich

[mollythedog]

Thanks for the offer-that is very,very kind. But, I think the risk from the postal authorities might not be worth the hassle. I imagine that a great deal of stuff gets sent around the World without any problem,nor the "correct" paperwork,but that might be getting more difficult,what with the security and terrorism regs being enforced now.

I'll work around it,but will try and pick up some next time I'm back in the UK.

Thanks again,this is a really great site and a great community.

cheers

mtd

[Giorgio N]

Denatured alcohol is mainly ethilic alcohol with a small percentage of methil acohol, as such it's chemically different from IPA. While both can be used for many applications, denatured alcohol can't be replaced with IPA for others.

The alcool a bruler you mention is exactly this kind of mix ! The mauve colour is due to the addition of a pigment that makes it instantly recognisable. We have the same stuff here in Italy, tinted pink. The addition of the pigment is required by law to prevent the use of his alcohol in the fabrication of spirits. Mainly, it's a matter of taxation ! Pure alcohol as used in spirits is subject to specific taxation, denatured alcohol is taxed as any detergent.

Back to the modelling uses, I use denatured alcohol to thin tamiya and gunze paints with no problem. Even with clear paints, the pink tint leaves no effect and completely disappears when the paint dries. I also use this to clean the brush after using Micro liquid decal film. I would suggest you give it a try to thin the decal film using some piece of decal you don't need, just to check if the tint disappears as it does with tamiya/gunze paints.

There actually is a way to remove the tint from denatured alcohol: leave a bottle exposed to the sun for a day or two, the dye should disappear.

Alternatively, you can check with a chemist if it's possible to buy denatured alcohol without the dye. This is used for medical purposes. Or you can buy pure ethil alcohol as used in the fabrication of spirits. This will cost more, as it's subject to its special taxation, but a litre probably costs from 10 to 20 euro... that is still less than what humbrol and the likes charge for their own thinners...

Back to modelling uses of denatured alcohol, it's very good to clean remains of acrylic paints and I use this on my airbrush after spraying acrylics. Careful though: it will attack even dry paint, so never use in proximity of a completed model ! This means it can be used to remove paint from old models.

[mollythedog]

Hi Giorgio,

Thanks,this is really useful to know. Annoyingly,I was in my local Mr. Bricolage ( a sort of very expensive B+Q) today,but was shopping for metal tube to make up spray stands for models,and completely forgot about the Meths. I even looked in that section,as has been mentioned elsewhere,Cellulose seems to have disappeared, to be replaced by "diluant cellulosique",which,if my French is up to speed,means cellulose-like,not cellulose.It doesn't even smell right.

I had just had a cortizone injection in my right shoulder so my mind wasn't on it TBH!

I'll give the meths a go,I am sure that you are right,the tint is so slight that when used as a thinner,I would think it would make up about 20% of the mix-the liquid decal stuff is just that wrong side of being too thick to spray,but it won't take much to get it blowing through the A/B.

In the meantime the last step stuff worked fine,and the decal is in place-as it was about 150mm/6" long it took a good coat to cover it. I have a couple of photos on my other PC that I will upload and show it off,when I can.

As an aside,I would add that the last step varnish seals well,but is prone to run and pick up dust and junk floating around,even though I have the luxury of a basement room used only for airbrushing.The pressure in the can is the main culprit. A bigger can,such as those from Halfords,are worse,being bigger and with more pressure.

I use an old oven shelf type chrome coated shelf that is made of thin wire-the sort of thing used to put baked bread and cakes to cool aswell. Mounted vertically,with some small,plastic coated croc clips on it to act as the paper holder-held vertically it can be hung to dry with less risk of dust falling on the decal sheet while the decal seal dries.Excess varnish passes through,and doesn't bounce back and make the surface rough from blowback. It is best held at about 45 degrees from vertical while actually spraying,as you can see where you have sprayed and where you have missed. The oven shelf will also hold any size of sheet up to A3 and of course means you don't get varnish on your hands nor touch the decal sheet.

Thanks again

cheers

mtd

[Giorgio N]

Glad to help !

What are you doing the decal for ? I'm very curious, as I've always done small decals only until now, but I'm tempted to try bigger artworks...