EMB 190 Master patterns

[Derek Bradshaw]

Hi Guys,

Just a little teaser for you here. I have just completed a set of 1/144th scale patterns of a Embrere EMB 190 for Welsh Models...I thought that I'd let you all have a sneak preview before they go for moulding. For further information on the availability of this kit, go to the Welsh Models website.

Regards

Derek

Edited May 12, 2008 by Derek Bradshaw

[keefr22]

Thanks for sharing the pics derek, that's a great look at the master builders art! I do wish I could do that sort of thing - I'd never buy another model!!

Could you say what the masters are actually made from?

All the best

Keef

[Derek Bradshaw]

Hi Keef,

Thanks for the comments. The master patterns are made almost entirely from plastic card (laminated) and Milliput filler. You can just about scratch build anything from plastic card and filler! (it does take a lot of time and effort though). Making a master pattern for a complete kit is totally different (and more difficult) than just scratch building a 'one-off' model for your own collection. It is much easier to hevily convert an existing kit into what you want, rather than start from scratch (unless there is nothing close available, of course).

Cheers

Derek

Thanks for sharing the pics derek, that's a great look at the master builders art! I do wish I could do that sort of thing - I'd never buy another model!!

Could you say what the masters are actually made from?

All the best

Keef

[Mike]

Looks good Derek - especially those engine pods

[Derek Bradshaw]

Thanks Mike - your Cavalier is pretty awesome as well!

Derek

Looks good Derek - especially those engine pods

[GreenDragon]

That is truly excellent work, hope you get well paid for that kind of craftmanship and effort! Is it really just Plasicard and Milliput?

I tried the laminating process once for a sci fi project and didn't leave it long enough between laminates and the resulting mess was just horrible. I don't think I've got the patience for it.

PS Any idea how much the Welsh Models kit is going to be as the web site only has TBA on it?

[Derek Bradshaw]

Thanks Green Dragon. I don't know how much Densil will charge for the cpmplete kit, but existing airliners of a similar type in his range should provide you with a rough guide. Yes, it really is only plastic card and filler! The fuselage is made up of about four or five pieces of 2mm thick plastic card (glued to a piece of 0.5mm plastic card backing, which has the fuselage shape already cut out). The wing/fuselage fairing is made of Milliput.

Don't give up on trying yourself, just make sure you use cynoacrylate (superglue) when gluing the card together, and put something heavy on top of them immediately to keep them compressed and flat (you'll probably end up sticking your fingers together as well!) - DO NOT use polystyrene cement, as this never really dries properly, and leaves the plastic soft for months.

Regards

Derek

That is truly excellent work, hope you get well paid for that kind of craftmanship and effort! Is it really just Plasicard and Milliput?

I tried the laminating process once for a sci fi project and didn't leave it long enough between laminates and the resulting mess was just horrible. I don't think I've got the patience for it.

PS Any idea how much the Welsh Models kit is going to be as the web site only has TBA on it?

[Derek Bradshaw]

Thanks Jay, comments of appreciation from guys like yourself mean a lot to me. This is one of several patterns I am trying to complete, as I am sure you already appreciate. This particular model was a lot more difficult to complete than it appears. It is a very modern airliner, with a supercritical aerofoil wing section, complete with with complex underwing fairings. The fuselage shape and cross section was also challenging. I only had a very basic 3-view GA drawing to work from, the rest of the details being interpreted from whatever internet pictures I could get my hands on.

Cheers

Derek

Looks superb Derek!

I am not much of a fan of airliners but I certainly am a fan of your work and the craftmanship that has gone into this work here is inspiring.

Cheers mate,

Jay

[jcote]

Hi Derek, I am truly awe-struck by these patterns of yours. This is the first time I've seen anything completed by you - not intended as a dig..well, not really . But seriously, if you're spending most of your time producing gems like this one, no wonder the Spit, Phantom et al are taking a back seat. At some point an illustrated tutorial would be a real treat, even if it can't be at the other place for reasons of scale.

Yours in admiration,

Jean

Edited October 29, 2007 by jcote

[Derek Bradshaw]

Hi Jean,

Nice to see you here friend. Thank you for the kind words. I find your model builds just as inspiring. I have several other patterns (differing scales and subjects) that I have got behind with completing. I shall try and dig out some earlier WIP nshots of the EMB 190 when time permits (they are on one of my old CD's). One model that I do intend to complete one day (for myself) is a 1/48 Bristol Sycamore HR.14 that I had partially completed some time ago.

Regards

Derek

Hi Derek, I am truly awe-struck by these patterns of yours. This is the first time I've seen anything completed by you - not intended as a dig..well, not really . But seriously, if you're spending most of your time producing gems like this one, no wonder the Spit, Phantom et al are taking a back seat. At some point an illustrated tutorial would be a real treat, even if it can't be at the other place for reasons of scale.

Yours in admiration,

Jean

Edited October 29, 2007 by Derek Bradshaw

[keefr22]

I only had a very basic 3-view GA drawing to work from, the rest of the details being interpreted from whatever internet pictures I could get my hands on.

Cheers

Derek

Well, I was impressed enough when I first saw the pics, but to do that work from a basic GA drawing is just brilliant! Does that mean that you didn't actually have fuselage sections to work from on the drawing? I think interpreting shapes from photos is in itself a black art - one you seem to have mastered!

I'd really like to see some more w.i.p. pics of your work if you get the chanec to post them. And an on-line tutorial like Jean mentions would be absolutely fantatstic!!

Keef

[Derek Bradshaw]

Keef,

You are absolutly correct, I had only one fuselage cross section to work with, and that was the front view of the aircraft! Generally, I only use plans and drawings to get the basic shape, dimensions and geommetry correct for the subject (assuming that the drawings are fairly accurate to start with). The best drawings are by A.L. Bentley, which are accurate throughout. I then rely almost soley on photographs to shape and detail the model.

Sometimes, I have to extrapolate and modify some areas of a drawing in order to obtain correct geommetrical positioning of a feature shape, in order to match the photographs. For example, on the side profile drawing of the EMB 190, the fuselage to fin fillet is little more than a triangular shape. Photographs of this same area reveal just how complex this fillet shape actually is. Two dimensional drawings can't accurately portray the subtle shapes and curvatures of the full size aircraft, so you need photographs as well - this subtlety is what I try to capture in my master patterns. I have made these type of patterns for over 20 years now (a lot of them for Welsh Models), and you are also correct in judging that you get an 'eye' for interpreting aircraft photographs - it is essential if you are to capture the feel and character of any subject.

I can always tell when someone has done his/her homework on a subject and really 'got it right' - if you find a detail on a model that makes you think 'I have never noticed that detail or shape on the aircraft before?', only to check it out and find that it really does exist, then they have got it spot-on!

A tutorial of a 'live' pattern would be difficult (if it's not one of mine), as it would take much to long to journal (plus some producers may not want me to post WIP pictures of their patterns!). However, when I can, I shall post pictures of completed patterns, and their previous WIP pictures (if any) - should anyone is interested (I can certainly post pictures of my own products). I shall be only too happy to explain any of my techniques should anyone wish to know how to do something.

Regards

Derek

Well, I was impressed enough when I first saw the pics, but to do that work from a basic GA drawing is just brilliant! Does that mean that you didn't actually have fuselage sections to work from on the drawing? I think interpreting shapes from photos is in itself a black art - one you seem to have mastered!

I'd really like to see some more w.i.p. pics of your work if you get the chanec to post them. And an on-line tutorial like Jean mentions would be absolutely fantatstic!!

Keef

[keefr22]

..should anyone is interested (I can certainly post pictures of my own products). I shall be only too happy to explain any of my techniques should anyone wish to know how to do something.

Regards

Derek

Thanks for the reply Derek - and I for one would certainly be interested in more photos! Do you find you have to make allowances for different focal length lenses used when interpreting the shapes for your models from photographs - or is that again something that comes with practice? Or do you deliberately look for photos that appear to have been taken with what looks like a 50 mm lens or similar?

Thanks again

Keef

[Derek Bradshaw]

Keef,

Not sure about the depth of field as far as pictures go, I just go with whatever pictures provide the detail/angle I am looking with regards to a specific detail or area (photographs taken looking along the length of a fuselage from either front, or back, are particularly useful). For good, clear detail pictures, Airliners.net is good.

Derek

Thanks for the reply Derek - and I for one would certainly be interested in more photos! Do you find you have to make allowances for different focal length lenses used when interpreting the shapes for your models from photographs - or is that again something that comes with practice? Or do you deliberately look for photos that appear to have been taken with what looks like a 50 mm lens or similar?

Thanks again

Keef

[keefr22]

Thanks again Derek,

Reason I asked about the focal length was that I've been working on a long time conversion of an Esci Mk2 Ford Escort back into the earlier Mk1 variant (cars are the second love of my life after aeroplanes - don't tell the wife!) - I couldn't find any drawings so gathered tons of photos, but I don't have 'the eye' yet & looking at different photos from similar angles I often see different shapes!! So I was guessing it was the shape differences caused by tele, normal & wide angle lenses that were confusing me!!

Could I ask you how you get such neat panel detail on your masters? When you say you use laminated plasticard & miliput as your basic materials, do you give the whole master a coating of miliput to get a nice uniform surface that lets you get such nice, delicate scribing?

Cheers

keef

[Derek Bradshaw]

Keef,

Cars are difficult at the best of times...once you have got some definate outline/shape dimensions (size), it is just a matter of picture interpretation and 'feel' for the shape I'm afraid (motorcycle fairings and shapes are the same - not easy).

Once the laminated fuselage has been files to shape, final smoothing was carried out with various wet and dry paper held against a wooden block or flat stick (don't just use your fingers for this, or you'll end up with hollows). A final fine grade sanding with wet and dry, followed by polishing the plastic with denim material was all that was required before spraying with acrylic aerosol primer. Another fine sanding and polish of the paint work left it ready for drawing all the panel lines onto it. I use the Olfa 'P-Cutter' and pin vice, with a needle, for most of the scribing work. When satisfied with the scribing (using CA glue to fill mistakes, followed by rescribing), I give it a final refresher coat - and that's it!

Provided that you use sufficient CA glue for the plastic lamination process, it acts as a filler in its own right (I only had to use additional CA glue on the lamination edges in two small areas). If I were using wood for my patterns (as I sometimes do), I would have built up lots of paint coats, and when fully dried, I lightly scribe the paint thickness only, not the underlying wood surface.

HTH

Derek

Thanks again Derek,

Reason I asked about the focal length was that I've been working on a long time conversion of an Esci Mk2 Ford Escort back into the earlier Mk1 variant (cars are the second love of my life after aeroplanes - don't tell the wife!) - I couldn't find any drawings so gathered tons of photos, but I don't have 'the eye' yet & looking at different photos from similar angles I often see different shapes!! So I was guessing it was the shape differences caused by tele, normal & wide angle lenses that were confusing me!!

Could I ask you how you get such neat panel detail on your masters? When you say you use laminated plasticard & miliput as your basic materials, do you give the whole master a coating of miliput to get a nice uniform surface that lets you get such nice, delicate scribing?

Cheers

keef

[keefr22]

Well Derek, you make it sound so easy, that I'll just have to give it a go!! Seriously, I've long wanted to try scratchbuilding one of the post war British experimental jets, but have often put off starting by wondering how to get the final scribing and panel detailing done. It seemed pointless to put all that work in to fall at the last hurdle! But I guess if you don't try, you don't get anywhere!

Thanks again for such helpful replies

Keith

[Derek Bradshaw]

Keef,

PM me, and I'll discuss more with you about the techniques that you may have to consider in order to complete your model...What jet is it?

Cheers

Derek

Well Derek, you make it sound so easy, that I'll just have to give it a go!! Seriously, I've long wanted to try scratchbuilding one of the post war British experimental jets, but have often put off starting by wondering how to get the final scribing and panel detailing done. It seemed pointless to put all that work in to fall at the last hurdle! But I guess if you don't try, you don't get anywhere!

Thanks again for such helpful replies

Keith

[GreenDragon]

Thanks for the info Derek (and thanks to Keith for asking all the questions I was going to ask!) now I know where I went wrong last time!

Use Cyano and not liquid Poly!

BTW are you doing the masters for the Welsh Models Dash 7, I've been wanting one of those since DHC started building them

Thanks again for the help.

Paul Harrison

Edited October 31, 2007 by GreenDragon

[Derek Bradshaw]

Thanks Paul. For the benefit of Keith, Jean and everyone else, I'll try to dig out some early build pictures of the EMB 190 to give you an idea of how it was developed...not sure where to post it though, maybe in the Tips & Techniques section?

I am not making the Dash 7 for Welsh Models (although I have made a fair few masters for them over the years) - I'm not sure that I shall be making any new ones for Welsh Models, as I have more than enough work at present producing patterns for other companies (as well as my own).

Regards

Derek

Thanks for the info Derek (and thanks to Keith for asking all the questions I was going to ask!) now I know where I went wrong last time!

Use Cyano and not liquid Poly!

BTW are you doing the masters for the Welsh Models Dash 7, I've been wanting one of those since DHC started building them

Thanks again for the help.

Paul Harrison