Hasegawa must be on crack...

[Stoo]

CHUFF!

I like the way Hannants say "even at this price we expec t this to sell out. It is "Limited". "

ha ha ha

Yep - they've got the stock though, the 20+ stock level is usually somewhat deceptive - the hase sea king AEW2 is listed as 20+, and they must have at least 100 kits on the shelf last time I looked..

[denstore]

I can't see that a sprue for the torpedo and a new decal sheet is going to cost that much Magnus. If it is then it is Hasegawa's own fault for their boxing strategy. Whatever faults the likes of Airfix have in comparison, they offer multiple decal options and plenty of stores. That means lots more research, usually by a factor of three or four per release as Hase only ever do one option per box. Also because Airfix usually provide plenty of stores, they don't have to go through the process for the odd kit here and there that needs ordenance. Now they have a german topedo if it gets used on another kit, it will be interesting to see if that kit's price goes up proportionally less than the Fw190 has.

I really do think that the "updating" costs usually are as high as the initial cost. Usually it means a whole new project, and a lot of time invested. Such things cost more than we usually think.

Finally this is going to impact on the hobby suppliers. How long can even Hannants sustain buying kits that people can't afford. They are not going to continue having stock gathering dust tying up a lot of cash, to then flog off at a loss. Be interesting to know how many Sea Kings they have sold for example.

My guess is that they have sold better than people think. Neither Hannants or the Hasegawa importer are going to set prices that will stop sales completely. This is the free market in action. The prices that they ask for the Sea Kings are exactly what they expect to get.

[The wooksta V2.0]

Academy, Fujimi and Hobbycraft all do late 109s and they're not that difficult to find either.

[AnonymousFO98]

Sorry Magnus, but I find that hard to believe that a sprue with hard point and aerial torpedo will cost as much to develop as the rest of the kit.

But even if it is correct, as I say, the fault is all Hasegawa's. They have a policy of not normally having stores for the subjects. So when they do have to provide one for a specific boxing then they incur the costs.

Will they never use the parts again because the He111, for example, used different torpedoes? So it is a one of cost, was the investment for a limited use worth it?

If they do use the same parts in another kit then the costs will be spread, but I bet they still whack up the price.

Airfix have just tooled the AEW dome for the venerable Sea King kit. Extra parts for the upgrade and new decals. What is the premium they have placed for the new parts? Doubt if it is anywhere near that for this torpedo.

Again, the elastic is about to snap imho. If they think that they can charge those sorts of prices and get away with it, suggests arrogance that deserves what it gets.

Personally even if I was rolling in cash, I still wouldn't buy one at these prices.

[Darren Rhodes]

I suspect there must also be a bit of Hasegawa adding a premium for being first to the mainstream market with an 'out of the box' F-16I. I saw the boxing in Modelzone today and thought £30 was good value against the bits I've assembled for a F-16I and as usual not even started before a cheaper option comes along, grr:

Revell 1/72 F-16B: £10.99

Isracast F-16I conversion: £20

Isracast F-16I decals: £16.80

Total £47.79

Of course that probably gives me better decals and more decal options, but in that context the Hase kit doesn't look out of touch and thus no doubt WILL sell out.

As folks say you pays your money and takes your choices!

Darren

[Murdo]

D'ye know...

I don't think I've ever built a Hasegawa kit and I don't believe I have a single one in the stash.

[Armadillos]

Just read the Hannants email newsletter and spied the Hasegawa 1:20 Lotus 79 German GP winner 78 for £44.99!

I`m sorry but thats just rediculous when all they`ve prob done is cobble together some different decals for this boxing!

Even more rediculous when you think that Revell GP car kits retail at £18 at most ok they`re 1:24 not 1:20 but come on Hasegawa me thinks someones taking the preverbial don`t you!

[jbank]

Interesting thread. Interesting enough to make me register an account and de-lurk.

Who imports Hasegawa kits into the UK? into Europe? I ask because the repeated accusation here is that Hasegawa has drastically raised prices without any regard for their consumer. I find this hard to accept because the price of Hasegawa kits in Japan has remained constant and Hasegawa is very well regarded in Japan for the quality of their customer service.

That overpriced F-16I cost me yesterday ¥2180, not any gouging there. Their recently released Ju-188 runs around ¥3000. Incidentally, Revell's Hunter FGA9 also runs around ¥3000, yet I'm very reluctant to blame Revell for pricing that kit somuch more than it'd go for in London.

Edited July 25, 2010 by jbank

[Alan Kelley]

Itb isnt just Hasegawa that are putting their prices up, look at Italeri now as well. Recently seen the Typhoon on sale at £17.99, I paid £10 for it 2 years ago, and the funny thin is it isnt even very good.

[Master Zen]

That extra sprue might have cost Hasegawa as much as the whole kit did back when it was initially made. And they will not have the ability to sell as much of this kit as they did with the original kit.

Add to that new box and new decals. With todays development, production and wage costs, I would say that the raise isn't that strange.

The newest boxing of the F/A-18C is retailing for the same as the F-16I. No new sprue. Just a new set of different crap decals on a kit that used to cost less than half that a year ago.

My guess is that they have sold better than people think. Neither Hannants or the Hasegawa importer are going to set prices that will stop sales completely. This is the free market in action. The prices that they ask for the Sea Kings are exactly what they expect to get.

That is, of course, a very flawed assumption on the effectiveness of free markets, and centuries of bankruptcies due to pricing errors speak for themselves

[Master Zen]

Interesting thread. Interesting enough to make me register an account and de-lurk.

Who imports Hasegawa kits into the UK? into Europe? I ask because the repeated accusation here is that Hasegawa has drastically raised prices without any regard for their consumer. I find this hard to accept because the price of Hasegawa kits in Japan has remained constant and Hasegawa is very well regarded in Japan for the quality of their customer service.

That overpriced F-16I cost me yesterday ¥2180, not any gouging there. Their recently released Ju-188 runs around ¥3000. Incidentally, Revell's Hunter FGA9 also runs around ¥3000, yet I'm very reluctant to blame Revell for pricing that kit somuch more than it'd go for in London.

That's because there hasn't been a change. People react to changes in prices, not the price itself (this, actually, is a huge flaw in standard neoclassical economic theory). You are used to Revell prices being so high and therefore see no reason to complain that it's high - you expect it. Furthermore, Revell's distributor is probably making a killing because now they are getting many more euros for the same yen price given the currency fluctuations in the last year or two. It is true that Hasegawa's importer in Europe doesn't have that luxury - the exchange rate change is forcing it to raise prices to maintain its profit.

My critique is not that, though, it's that the change is 1) too drastic and 2) not in line with what the currency has changed. Furthermore, if we expect the Pound to strengthen at least marginally in the next year (a possibility), we WON'T see a drop in prices. We're stuck with £30 1/72 F/A-18C pretty much for good.

[Giorgio N]

That is, of course, a very flawed assumption on the effectiveness of free markets, and centuries of bankruptcies due to pricing errors speak for themselves

Very true ! Although I can't remember this happening to any manufacturer of overpriced japanese kits, while I remember it happening to a few european names...

[denstore]

The newest boxing of the F/A-18C is retailing for the same as the F-16I. No new sprue. Just a new set of different crap decals on a kit that used to cost less than half that a year ago.

That is, of course, a very flawed assumption on the effectiveness of free markets, and centuries of bankruptcies due to pricing errors speak for themselves

Flawed in what way? I would say that the model kit market is one of the least flawed free markets, since it's international, there's a lot of actors, actors come and go, the products arn't necessities, and it's not geared towards a single consumer group.

And that bancruptcies occurs in a free market doesn't in any way fault the theory. Rather it proves it, since if an actor continues to keeping prices above what the consumer thinks is reasonable, he will surely go bancrupt.

[magwitch]

This probably has quite a lot to do with it...

http://uk.finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=GBPJPY=...&q=l&c=

We need almost twice as many pounds to buy the same amount of Japanese Yen as we did two years ago.

[jbank]

That's because there hasn't been a change. People react to changes in prices, not the price itself (this, actually, is a huge flaw in standard neoclassical economic theory). You are used to Revell prices being so high and therefore see no reason to complain that it's high - you expect it. Furthermore, Revell's distributor is probably making a killing because now they are getting many more euros for the same yen price given the currency fluctuations in the last year or two. It is true that Hasegawa's importer in Europe doesn't have that luxury - the exchange rate change is forcing it to raise prices to maintain its profit.

My critique is not that, though, it's that the change is 1) too drastic and 2) not in line with what the currency has changed. Furthermore, if we expect the Pound to strengthen at least marginally in the next year (a possibility), we WON'T see a drop in prices. We're stuck with £30 1/72 F/A-18C pretty much for good.

Used to & expect high price from Revell? Not even close. I won't buy Revell kits here. Their high price doesn't meet my expectation of value. The point is that I understand that imported kits cost more that domestic kits. When I lived in Europe I bought Revell kits. I didn't buy Hasegawa kits then. I really like Hasegawa kits. I really like Revell kits. But I won't buy a kit if its price exceeds the point of value.

You mentioned a recently released F-18C. I suspect you are talking about the "Golden Dragons CAG 2009" release. If this is the kit you are referring to, this is a release aimed specifically to the Japanese market. Hasegawa releases many, many kits of CVW-5 schemes. Planes based at NAF Atsugi are very popular with Japanese modelers. Hasegawa has had 3 separate decal releases of VAW-115 Hawkeyes in the 12 months. This F-18C release in particular should be popular and not available for long as VFA-192 recently transferred from Japan back to the US and their planes won't be seen in Japanese skies.

Edited July 27, 2010 by jbank

[dancho]

It's not Hasegawa that's on crack. It's us. We're addicts--addicted to plastic kits--and we'll pay whatever they ask (up to a very high point). I suppose that the secret got out during the "economic crisis" when the prices of kits from Japan doubled. They must have thought "Oh noes! Our sales will plummet!" But I have a hunch that they DID NOT plummet! So the Japanese kits makers must have said "Holy crackle-finish Batman--WE'VE BEEN UNDERCHARGING! These poor unfortunates will pay MORE. MUCH MORE! Ready all boats--prepare to launch proton torpedoes--and raise all kit prices to previously unheard-of levels!!!!"

Or something like that...

[CPNGROATS]

As the Obi-Wan said....." use your stash addicted jedi, use your stash.." So if we don't buy the prices may come down...

Cheers,

ggc

[smackers]

CHUFF!

I like the way Hannants say "even at this price we expec t this to sell out. It is "Limited". "

ha ha ha

Julien

Amazing how this thread could still be pretty relevant nearly 2 years later. And as for that "Limited" kit, it's still in stock

http://www.hannants.co.uk/product/HALTD1

Edited March 27, 2013 by smackers

[Selwyn]

The Hase F16, Looks great on the LMS shelf, where its going to stay!

I vote with my feet.

Selwyn

(Now where is that fantastic Airfix Vampire T11kit I got yesterday? Superb kit, state of the art, accurate as hell. and I got change out of a tenner!)

[Julien]

Amazing how this thread could still be pretty relevant nearly 2 years later. And as for that "Limited" kit, it's still in stock

http://www.hannants.co.uk/product/HALTD1

Good eh!

[Mozzy19]

Amazing how this thread could still be pretty relevant nearly 2 years later. And as for that "Limited" kit, it's still in stock

http://www.hannants.co.uk/product/HALTD1

A limited kit and Hannants still have over 10 in stock! Very limited indeed (my rear end!)

[denstore]

A limited kit and Hannants still have over 10 in stock! Very limited indeed (my rear end!)

I believe that they had 50 or something to start with, so it would mean that at least 20 people believe that it is worth the asked price.

[thx6667]

Was it not established some time back that Hasegawa's prices are domestically reasonable, its what happens when they leave their shores that the price starts piling on more pounds than Eamon Holmes at a wedding buffet?

[Moggy]

I thinks its also probably due to demand on Hasegawa kits, most of their kits from what you guys tell me are the most accurate in class so everyone wants them which creates the lets charge more until demand slows then lower price again reaction from manufacturer and distributor. I think Revell will do the same with the 1/32 hawk when it first comes out it will be cheap then it will go up rapidly until demand dies down for it. Its all bout making a quick buck really and if you want Ferrari its going to be Ferrari prices and while non of us in this thread want to pay the high amount there is always someone who will i.e the one kit no one else makes that your dying to build 1/24 mozzie ring any bells its not hase but no one else does it and you all rushed out for it regardless of the price tag

Russ

Hase's F-16 is NOT the most accurate F-16 in 1/72; that honor goes to the Revell kit that came out a few years ago - better shape, full weapons load AND extra parts (since the single seater comes with parts for both the -C and the -A MLU; the two-holer has extra parts too...) The Revell F-16 kits had better decals too and costed less than half the Hasegawa price at the time... Hasegawa's rep is far more impressive that their actual "perfomance". The F-4 are great (I have a bunch of F-4E for IDF/AF use ); I have their Lanc - nice but far less value for money than the Revell - which has far more detail to boot! I have their lovely Hawkeye; I have most of their F-16:s - all of which are underdimensioned in the cockpit/canopy department... and have almost NO weapon loads (another difference with the Revell F-16s...) Yes - all of these are 1/72 since I only build 72 and 32 scales. I also have a bunch of their older kits (P-3 Orions, P-2 Neptunes, B-47 bombers - all belonging to a much earlier class of kit and sold in "new" boxes with "new" prices... far above what those old and undetailed kits (compared to the newer generations) should cost. I suppose it's a case of "you picks your choices and pays yer money"...

The important thing with Hasegawa kits is to know which ones are worth the inflated prices... and which are not! Their He-111 springs to mind - countersunk panelling provided by the Japanese equvalent of the Matchbox Trench digger (!)

[Vlamgat9]

Was it not established some time back that Hasegawa's prices are domestically reasonable, its what happens when they leave their shores that the price starts piling on more pounds than Eamon Holmes at a wedding buffet?

In 2007 £1 bought you between 225 and 250 Yen. Today £1 buys you something like 130 Yen. So the purchasing power of a UK consumer for Japanese exports has almost halved (unless someone else in the supply chain is willing to swallow the difference).

Not really surprising therefore that Has kits have become so expensive in the UK.

The interesting thing will be to see what happens to prices if Shinzo Abe succeeds in devaluing the Yen so people like us Brits get back some of our purchasing power for Japanese goods. Will the price of Has kits drop? My guess is they wont as the supply chain will try and keep the extra profits - just like utility prices go up when wholesale gas etc go up but never comevdown in the same way.