Erwin Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 (edited) Hi all, I have Finnish leftover decals from the 1/48 th Classic Airframes fabricwing Hurricane kit (with Belgian decals). I found profiles of the plane with those markings in the Finnish camouflage of 1942. http://wp.scn.ru/en/ww2/f/79/78/0/4 Was this Mk1's still the fabricwinger or the metal one ? Edited October 9, 2009 by Erwin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spitfire Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Hi Erwin, had a quick look through my Hurricane references and it would appear that the 12 Hurricane Mk I's supplied to Finland came from existing RAF stocks, so I should imagine that they were metal winged by this date. But who knows, I can only find photos of a couple of them and they do not show the wing type, have to wait for an expert ! Cheers Den Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heraldcoupe Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 (edited) The 12 Hurricanes supplied to Finland were from the first batch built by Gloster. This company started building Hurricanes from October 1939, whereas the metal wing was introduced in April 1939. What I can't find out is when the fabric wing ended production, as there may have been some overlap, but it's unlikely that a new manufacturer would have started making the obsolete wing. Incidentally, HC-452 survives in Finland, and still wears camouflage applied in 1942/3. There are a few images online, which appear to show the metal wing, Cheers, Bill. Edited October 9, 2009 by Heraldcoupe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsrjoe Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 (edited) there were definately a few of the Hurricanes supplied with fabric outer wings fitted, theres not too much in the references tho as to which ones and when they were swapped with metal as attrition avaliability allowed. A Finnish colleague has compiled a cross reference as to serial and wing type re the aircraft as delivered, ill check and see what i can get posted on here! One snippet tho is if the inboard fabric panel at the wing root was stil there or reskinned in metal by Gloster when refurbishing the aircraft? (my thinking is the area would have been reskinned) another is that the Finn's did look at possibly reskinning the fabric examples themselves but due to the avaliability of metal wings from damaged or undergoing servicing examples there was no need to proceed! cheers, Joe PS. HC-452 definately has the standard metal wing fitted, altho as mentioned above, the inboard panel which may have been fabric covered on the original airframe as delivered to the RAF. does appear to be attatched using a different technique to that of the other skins? again possibly a sign of the Gloster refurbishment? Edited October 9, 2009 by Tsrjoe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonymousA667 Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 There are a couple of photos in Profile 111 and these appear to be metal skinned wing machines. Fabric wing machines were in the serial batch prefixed 'L', whereas the first Gloster batch were prefixed 'P'. peebeep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kari Lumppio Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 (edited) Hello! This question has been asked before at other forums. A colleague has made archive research on the FinnAF Hurricanes (too) and there were both fabric and metal winged here. He provided a list of all the indivduals, IIRC only one or two had unknown wing covering material. I do remember that one FinnAF Mk I got later Mk II metal wings installed. One of the fabric wing Hurricanes crashed because the fabric covering failed inflight. Unfortunately don't have the FinnAf Hurricane list handy here and I have too much to do for next few days to response. Perhaps Tsrjoe is able to provide the info? I guess the source is the same. Cheers, Kari Edited October 9, 2009 by Kari Lumppio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 I came across this page some time ago when I was doing research into Grangemoth airfield. http://www.saunalahti.fi/~fta/hu-fin-1.htm I know it isn't definitive, but the crashed aircraft looks to me like it has a metal wing. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drdave Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 I think only a couple were rag wingers. I have the serials in a suomen historia book somewhere. I have done 452 and can confirm its a metal winger with a DH prop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drdave Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 (edited) Here we are... " of Finnish a/c only HC 451,455,456 and 462 had fabric wings" p 7 suomen 25 Hurricane I think they all had the early straight aerial mast and most had the flat bottomed armoured windscreen that wasnt faired in like the very earliest Hurris, so a mixed picture of early modifications Edited October 9, 2009 by drdave 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted October 9, 2009 Author Share Posted October 9, 2009 Hi, Thank you all for the good info. It seems I can go with any metalwinger Hurricane Mk 1 kit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Eisenman Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Kari's info on the Hurricanes: Based on the information I have, it appears the 12 Hurricanes received by the Finns were all Rag Wings (remember they had a metal leading edge). Also it appears that many of them were originally intended for the Polish AF. They arrived in Finland Feb/march 1940. By 1941 only 9 were in service and in 1942 it was 6, and remained at that level until 1945. A Mk. IIA was captured in April '44. Here is the serial list and original HU serial number: L2048 - HU450 N2322 - HU451 N2323 - HU452 N2324 - HU453 N2327 - HU454 N2347 - HU455 N2348 - HU456 N2358 - HU457 N2392 - HU458 N2393 - HU459 N2394 - HU460 N2395 - HU461. All were from the second production batch from Hawker. So it would appear that the Hasegwa kit is incorrect as that kit is a metal wing Mk. I Kari Lumppio YES Tue Apr 8 16:31:24 2003 193.229.6.165 Hi! Yes, according the Finnish sources I count as reliable there was both fabric and metal covered wings in FinnAF Hurricanes. For sure fabric covered wing were in HC-451, -454, -455 & -456. HC-455 was destroyed July 30, 1942 when fabric covering of left wing was teared off during take-off. The Hurricanes then left with fabric covered wings (=HC-454 &-456) were called in for inspections. InScale Hurricane decal instructions also point that HC-458 possibly had fabric covered wing. It was shot down already in Sep 1941 (before HC-455 accident). Question marks (for me at least) are HC-453,-457,-459 & HU-461 &-462. The last two never arrived in Finland; HU-462 was destroyed in Norway during transfer flight and HU-461 was left in Scotland (l/g failure during landing at Wick). HC-452 and -460 had metal covered wing. BTW The Mk IIA (HC-465) was captured already in Feb 1942, but the rebuilding took long and the plane was taken use as late as April 1944 and not used much. Mainly flew target flights for AAA. HTH Kari Hello! Information from "mr. InScale" (the decal maker): Hurricane (first HU-, later changed HC-) wings: 451 - fabric 452 - metal 453 - probably metal? 454 - fabric, later may have got metal, but not likely 455 - fabric 456 - fabric, around 1943 got metal wing (Mk II wing?) 457 - ??? not known 458 - possibly fabric? 459 - ??? not known 460 - metal 461 - ??? was left in Wick, Scotland 462 - fabric, crashed in Stavanger Norway during transfer flight 465 was captured Mk II with metal wings. Hope this helps, Kari 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Eisenman Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 (edited) From the Finnish museum, and probably one of the best images or original RAF DE/DG on the rudder Edited October 9, 2009 by Steven Eisenman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drdave Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Tsk... such over the top weathering.... Interesting the tail number outline looks pale blue. I thought it was white, or is it an artefact? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heraldcoupe Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Absolutely fantastic information, and far better pictures of HC-452 than I have seen anywhere else. Cheers, Bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spitfire Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Some great information has surfaced thanks to your question Erwin, all in the memory bank now ! Thanks to all contributors, a very fascinating subject. Cheers Den Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragonlanceHR Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Doesn't that chin intake look weird to you folks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heraldcoupe Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Doesn't that chin intake look weird to you folks? Yes, it's become detached at the front and dropped down, Cheers, Bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragonlanceHR Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Yes, it's become detached at the front and dropped down,Cheers, Bill. Now I see it, the bare metal portion. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p-26luvr Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Thanks for the query, Erwin, & thanks for the photos of HC 452. Everything has helped me to decide how to do one of my Hurricane models. Carl Thurston Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted October 9, 2009 Author Share Posted October 9, 2009 (edited) For sure fabric covered wing were in HC-451Hurricane (first HU-, later changed HC-) wings: 451 - fabric Hope this helps, Kari The info helps. But the decals I have are HC-451. So I can't use them afterall on a metalwinger. Looks like I will need another subject for the "Finnish" groupbuild. Edited October 9, 2009 by Erwin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antoine Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 And here's the linky for the pics above... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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