72modeler Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 (edited) On 8/22/2018 at 3:27 AM, Graham Boak said: That would certainly help, but I don't think that's enough. I believe that you have to flatten the lower surface, either by adding filler underneath the leading edge of the droop or (my favourite approach) simply bending it down on both lower and upper halves (and then sanding). I have to admit that I haven't seen a good cross section of this area to confirm the exact shape, but the visible droop is greater than just the depth of the upper moulding of the extended leading edge. It's not just the kit makers that can't seen to get the leading edge wing extension and droop of the early Mustangs correct. Look at this restoration; you would think if they were going to spend that kind of money and effort, they would fabricate the correct wing section; there are certainly enough restored original examples to examine. It is pretty, though. I think I have some very good closeup photos of a restored Mustang that were the best I had seen to show the droop of the leading edge extension- I will try to find them and post a link to the site. Having said that, don't get me wrong- it is a gorgeous Mustang and the restoration team did a tremendous amount of work to get it back very close to its original configuration. It is amazing that both 1038 and 1039 have been saved and preserved. I saw the EAA's 1039 fly several times and it was a sight for the eyes and ears. I hope I can do the same for 1038. I will be watching the progress on the Mustang III they are working on- that's going to be something to see! Mike http://vintageaviationecho.com/xp51a/ Edited August 24, 2018 by 72modeler added additional text 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Boak Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 30 days seems too brief, given loss rates in 1944, but perhaps they were extrapolating from the worst of 1943. It makes an interesting comparison with a study I did from information in Shark Squadron, the history of 112 Sq by Robin Brown. I worked out that the average stay of a P-40 with 112 Sq was a month - though of course this was not only losses, but included aircraft that would be overhauled and return to service with either a training unit or another front line squadron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andre B Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 (edited) I took att closer look at the Master Craft P-51B/J-26. https://www.scalemates.com/kits/204198-mastercraft-c-57-j-26-early It did really have an P-51D Wing. More or less an copy of the Hasegawa wing but with four guns. Even the idf-lights where in the correct place for an P-51D. Concerning the fuselage it was shorter than the Revell kit. Lots of cleaning to do as well. And the antenna must have shared familybands with Airfix P-51D. This kit had one of the best instructions I ever seen. Sad that it was spoiled on an bad kit based on bad research. And that goes for marking and painting as well... /André Edited August 23, 2018 by Andre B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
72modeler Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 50 minutes ago, Andre B said: I took att closer look at the Master Craft P-51B/J-26. It did really have an P-51D Wing. More or less an copy of the Hasegawa wing but with four guns. Even the idf-lights where in the correct place for an P-51D. Concerning the fuselage it was shorter than the Revell kit. Lots of cleaning to do as well. And the antenna must have shared familybands with Airfix P-51D. This kit had one of the best instructions I ever seen. Sad that it was spoiled on an bad kit based on bad research. And that goes for marking and painting as well... /André Tell me about it, Andre! You would think, as significant an aircraft as it was; with the variety of colors and markings that it wore; as popular a subject with modelers of every scale, but especially 1/72 as it is, and with the references available nowadays, the number of original restored aircraft to examine, and the incredible scanning and mold-making technology that the hobby enjoys, that SOMEBODY would be able to give us an accurate Allison/Merlin early Mustang....Jeez, Louise! (Whew- did I say that?)🤬 Mike 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantome Posted August 24, 2018 Share Posted August 24, 2018 (edited) I'm a fan of the Academy, despite its inaccuracies. It looks good, has a nice interior, and has excellent fit. The Hasegawa kit has slightly inferior detail and is also not readily available. Having said that, one issue to note on the Academy kit that nobody seems to have mentioned is that the closed version of the early canopy has some fit issues: it's wider than the fuselage. The Malcolm Hood has perfect fit, however. I have not built the KP but it looks a bit over-engineered from what I see from the manual. I really don't want to spend 4-5 hours building a cockpit in 1/72 scale, and KP's small cockpit parts tend to be quite fiddly and with poor fit (I speak about the Bf 109s). Don't want to sound like I'm dissing KP, the 109s are lovely little kits otherwise (especially the Friedrichs)! I suppose the Mustangs are not too shabby aside from this. Edited August 24, 2018 by Phantome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDriskill Posted August 24, 2018 Share Posted August 24, 2018 (edited) Where might a fellow obtain a copy of the fabled CJ Neely P-51B drawings? Seems like those would be a major asset in bringing focus to this discussion. My impression is that they are only available to a privileged few? 😁 Edited August 25, 2018 by MDriskill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gingerbob Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 I don't think Charlie (Neely) is selling them at the moment, but (as I recall) the wheels are turning toward making them available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Schilhart Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 On 8/24/2018 at 8:06 PM, Phantome said: I have not built the KP but it looks a bit over-engineered from what I see from the manual. I really don't want to spend 4-5 hours building a cockpit in 1/72 scale, and KP's small cockpit parts tend to be quite fiddly and with poor fit (I speak about the Bf 109s). Don't want to sound like I'm dissing KP, the 109s are lovely little kits otherwise (especially the Friedrichs)! I suppose the Mustangs are not too shabby aside from this. Hello Phantome, I have so far built three KP Mustangs, and in my opinion, they are pretty easy to assemble - for a short run kit the fit is excellent. Sorry to disagree with you on that point! May I present two of my finished KP Mustang models here: 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denford Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 Nice pictures, and nicely built models, but they illustrate perfectly how wrongly tapered the upper portion of the cowl is. Also the somewhat more 'correctible' inner leading edge. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
72modeler Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 For those of you interested in building an accurate 1/72 P-51B/C, I offer this link to detail photos of a beautiful P-51C being restored in the markings worn by Don Lopez. If you look at the various update sections, you can find the best photos I have discovered so far that show the nose contours and especially the leading edge extension and droop of the inner wing. I hope you will all find this useful and enjoy seeing an incredibly restored Mustang! Mike https://www.aircorpsaviation.com/project/p-51c-lopes-hope-3rd/ 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantome Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 On 8/28/2018 at 11:44 AM, Roman Schilhart said: Hello Phantome, I have so far built three KP Mustangs, and in my opinion, they are pretty easy to assemble - for a short run kit the fit is excellent. Sorry to disagree with you on that point! May I present two of my finished KP Mustang models here: I thought they were not short run, but actually steel molds... but I'll take your word for it regarding fit since I haven't built any myself! Having said that, absolutely phenomenal work on your NMF Mustang. Loved the weathering on it (post-shading with smoke I presume?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Schilhart Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 13 minutes ago, Phantome said: I thought they were not short run, but actually steel molds... but I'll take your word for it regarding fit since I haven't built any myself! Having said that, absolutely phenomenal work on your NMF Mustang. Loved the weathering on it (post-shading with smoke I presume?) Thanks for feedback, Phantome. Yes, it's Alclad lacquers with post-shade Gunze H95 Smoke Grey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
72modeler Posted September 3, 2018 Share Posted September 3, 2018 About to throw more 130 octane avgas on the P-51B/C fire! Here is an excellent collection of photos of a P-51C restored in the markings of 4th FG ace Duane Beeson's P-51B, the 'Boise Bee.' You can see the shape and contour of the drooped leading edge extension in some of the photos. it is a subtle and difficult shape to photograph, but I think these photos show the contours very well. I hope you find these useful. Mike https://www.cybermodeler.com/aircraft/p-51/p-51_walk5.shtml Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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