Fokker axles - colour

[dad's lad]

Does that aerofoil shaped thing between the wheels of Fokker aircraft have an official name?

 

Anyway, I've always wondered what colour the upper surface of this "thing" would be. Most profiles show an underside view, mainly blue or lozenge coloured, but what about the top side?

 

Specifically I was wondering about DR.1's with  Fokker "streak" colours and D.VII's with lozenge flying surfaces.

 

I appreciate that with the jazzy colours sported by many there may have been repainting but as a general rule of thumb what is the factory fresh colour for both schemes and secondly, would this area have been repainted when individual pilots had their favoured colours applied elsewhere.

 

Hope this makes sense and many thanks, Clive.

[Paul Thompson]

Solid olive green top surface usually, even on the EV/DVIII where the current wisdom about the top wing itself (which was also plywood) is that it was stained with green and brown.  The bit you're talking about is usually called the axle wing AFAIK.  The underside would normally be  light blue (or turquoise) only, not being fabric covered or painted to match.

 

Paul.

[dad's lad]

7 hours ago, Paul Thompson said:

Solid olive green top surface usually, even on the EV/DVIII where the current wisdom about the top wing itself (which was also plywood) is that it was stained with green and brown.  The bit you're talking about is usually called the axle wing AFAIK.  The underside would normally be  light blue (or turquoise) only, not being fabric covered or painted to match.

 

Paul.

Thsnks Paul,

Am I to take any profiles which show a lozenge underside as in error?

 

Clive

[Paul Thompson]

I'm loathe to say it would be imposssible, but if there is lozenge than it must be painted on. Some D.VIIs had a few lozenges painted on the metal cowling panels, but IIRC that was specific to just one or two jastas. it vertainly happened with Hannovers, but the patterns there were approximate and much larger polygons than the regular printeed fabric. TBH I haven't thought about it for many years, so I'll wander off and check...........

 

 

Paul.

[Paul Thompson]

A further quick search turns up the Wingnuts opinion that despite previous profiles to the contrary, no axle wing was ever covered with lozenge fabric (sensible, after all, why would you?) or streaked camo. Any streaking seen would be due to general airfield muck. Tops olive, bottoms blue, and sometimes later the bottoms were also painted olive.  Overpainting with individual colours could happen. All that applies to the D.VII, but the triplane, D.VI and EV/DVIII all had the same style of plywood covered fairing, so those comments should hold true. Same opinion from Ray Rimell in the Windsock Datafile on the DrI.

 

Paul.

Edited November 27, 2024 by Paul Thompson

[dad's lad]

2 hours ago, Paul Thompson said:

A further quick search turns up the Wingnuts opinion that despite previous profiles to the contrary, no axle wing was ever covered with lozenge fabric (sensible, after all, why would you?) or streaked camo. Any streaking seen would be due to general airfield muck. Tops olive, bottoms blue, and sometimes later the bottoms were also painted olive.  Overpainting with individual colours could happen. All that applies to the D.VII, but the triplane, D.VI and EV/DVIII all had the same style of plywood covered fairing, so those comments should hold true. Same opinion from Ray Rimell in the Windsock Datafile on the DrI.

 

Paul.

Thank you again Paul, my original query came because both ESCI and Revell would have the undersurface on Berthold's D.VII as lozenge whereas Eduard show grey green and Roden steel grey which I think is their go-to for Fokker turquoise.

 

Clive.

 

 

13 hours ago, Paul Thompson said:

 

 

Edited November 27, 2024 by dad's lad

[pearl jam]

Hi, I have some 1/48 kits from Eduard (Germans and allies) I wanted to ask you if their coloring versions of the wings and fuselage are reliable. Thanks and sorry OT.

[Paul Thompson]

Depends on the kit. Which ones specifically do you have? Can't guarantee I know the answer, but if I have references for the subjects I'll look them up.

 

Paul.

[pearl jam]

Well,

Airco dh 2 weekend

Bristol F.2B Fighter weekend

Fokker D. VII (OAW) profi

Sopwith F.1 Camel (BR.1) profi

Albatros DV profi

Fokker E.II/III profi

SE.5a Wolseley Viper profi

Thanks Paul

 

Virgilio

P.S. 1/48 scale

Edited January 24 by pearl jam

[Paul Thompson]

I'll see what I can do tomorrow.

 

Paul.

[Paul Thompson]

Probably do this piecemeal due to several people in the hiouse, including me, being sick with the flusy thingy.

DH2 weekend profipack. If this is kit 8444, then it is 7851 of 32 Squadron, the cover sunject of the Windsock Datafile, with two photos within. Eduard seem to have the scheme about right, including the partial roundel on the top of the lower port wing (which means it used to be a top wing in a former life) with the proviso that the rudder had a lot of castor oil damage to it's finish. I'm not so sure about the camo on the wing tops though, because the photo from the front seems to show the cockades,  ribs and spars showing through very clearly. The ammo drum in the external pocket each side was a double drum as in the instructions, so use a double on the Lewis gun as well. Ailerons should have balance cables, top one running through a fairlead on the fuel tank (which is in the correct place). Tinspection patch and rudder cable exit holes are in the right place for a late 1916machine, which this one is as far as I can tell.

 

As far as I know, being a late one means it's more likely the camo would be PC10 as shown, rather than one of the earler khaki-ish formulations used on earler aircraft.

 

Short  answer, I think it's okay. Perhaps the instrument panel layout should be different.The instructions say use the parts appropriate for an early-mid 1916 machine.  If there's an alternative that goes all the way across the nacelle with the top edge fixed to the bottom of part A16, that would be better. But who knows, there was a lot of chopping, changing and retrofitting going on with the DH2, and I'm pretty sure you'll never find a photo proving one way or the other when it comes to things on the inside.

 

 

Paul.

[pearl jam]

Thanks Paul, I'm looking too, I'm a beginner, only now I realize how much research needs to be done to assemble a kit as faithfully as possible, I don't want to delegate this task to others. My kit is 8443, Robert H.M.S. Saundby, 24 Sqn. RFC.

I would like to transform the kit into the Major Lanoe Hawker one, I also have a 1/48 BlueMax kit, probably the best thing is to watch Wingnut Wings.

 

Edited January 26 by pearl jam

[Paul Thompson]

Ah, that's the trouble you see, Eduard have been doing weekend and profipack kits long enough that there are several boxings for most subjects. Rule of thumb, the older Weekenders have just one decal choice and no PE or masks. Yes, I'd look at the WNW site and download the manual for the Hawker kit, which was a separate boxing. I built it year before last, and as I recall double checked the possible variations at the time, and as expected WNW had done their homework well. If new to all this, the Blue Max kit is very nice but also very hard to build because it's the epitomy of limited run. I've built one a few years ago, and when I tried to improve a second one with an old dedicated PE set I had managed to induce enough faults to shelve it. There's a build log on here somewhere, from about two years ago. I did the WNW, Blue Max and Eduard kits together. Not a brilliantly built but at least there may be a few useful pointers there.

 

The Windsock Datafile no. 48 and much more expensive but also extensive Cross & Cockade book (The DeHavliland DH2 and the men who flew them) are indispensible if you really get into it, but for enough info on the differences between versions (all due to development over the service life of the machine), clearly illustrated with 1/72nd and 1/48th plans, then if the budget stretches and you can find a copy I'd at least get the Datafile. OTOH, since you already know which specific machine you want, then you could get away with the WNW manual. Which is free.

 

Shall I continue to look at the other kits or do you want to take a crack at it yourself? I don't mind, and already have a library, but things would go much faster if you picked out specific airframes, then I could simply check which kits provide enough in the box to do them. OTOH, for me at least, half the fun in WW1 modelling is the finding out.

 

Paul.

[pearl jam]

Thanks, you're too kind Paolo, I'm going to research it on my own, I'm very passionate about the First World War.

 

Virgilio