JohnT Posted November 23, 2024 Posted November 23, 2024 33 minutes ago, Farmer matt said: The old saying about there being no such thing as bad publicity is not without foundation. Matt But often wrong. Ask Gerald Ratner. He who crashed a national business with a couple of badly judged sentences. For those who might not know what doing a Ratner is. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerald_Ratner#:~:text=People say%2C "How can you,last longer than the earrings". The Jaguar buyer demographics are that their loyal base won’t be amused by their in house advertising team antics headed up by Santino Pietrosanti from the US. I suspect the buyers they are looking to attract are more interested in other car marques. The Guardian newspaper seems to like it but that may more about the paper than anything else. Either way I can not see Ferrari demoting their prancing horse, Mercedes’ their star, BMW their propellor logo, etc etc etc any time soon but time will tell.
cmatthewbacon Posted November 23, 2024 Posted November 23, 2024 But they don’t want “Jaguar buyers”. Jaguar buyers didn’t buy enough Jaguars to keep the company afloat. Their range was made up of a cool niche sports car that had to compete with Porsches, some nice company cars that have to compete with BMW, Mercedes and Audi, and some decent SUVs that have to compete with all the above, the Italians, AND their own big brother IN THE SAME COMPANY. The company could have been shuttered by Tata, but they’ve got one more throw of the dice. And whatever the rest of us may think (especially those of us who see ourselves as Jaguar buyers but have something German on the drive), that throw is on radically styled premium luxury GTs powered by electricity. The bet is that they can sell 50,000 units in competition with a Rolls Royce Spectre instead. Which means performance, luxury and premium design*. I dunno, you might call the recipe “pace, space and grace…” best, M. (*) and prices most “Jaguar buyers” can’t afford 2
Farmer matt Posted November 23, 2024 Author Posted November 23, 2024 It would appear that the buyers they are seeking to attract are those not interested in car marques at all, just whatever snake oil they feel aligns with their vision. Do those people exist in greater numbers than current buyers? At least Ratner simply put his foot in it of his own accord, rather than paying an agency to do it for him though. Matt 2 2
keefr22 Posted November 23, 2024 Posted November 23, 2024 9 hours ago, cmatthewbacon said: I dunno, you might call the recipe “pace, space and grace…” My daughter has owned an F-pace from new in 2020. I find the thing totally underwhelming in all three departments - Ok it's fairly quick but it's incredibly cramped inside for a car with the external dimensions and wherever the grace is I've never seen it! And it's had numerous niggly mechanical and electrical problems since new, that the dealer was particularly unhelpful with trying to sort. She now has it tended to by a local Land Rover independent who specialises in classic Landies and is much more clued up on a modern Jag than a main dealer...... Keith
Anteater Posted November 23, 2024 Posted November 23, 2024 I worked at Ford's during the time of Jacques Nasser and PAG. Much later, Mrs_Anteater had a secondhand Jag for while, an impressive looking 3.0 S-Type that cost pennies to buy due to the usual catastrophic depreciation. Despite these two claims to fame, there's no reason why Jaguar would care what I think because I won't be stumping up for a new one. The "Copy Nothing" media announcement leaves me alienated, confused and shaking my fist at clouds. However, the worst thing they could do now would be to reveal a generic faceless EV appliance. They have one shot left and need to show us something really radical. There's no way I'll be their customer because it won't be fossil powered, but that's not the point. Most likely though, they are sunk. 2 1
Spiny Posted November 23, 2024 Posted November 23, 2024 9 hours ago, cmatthewbacon said: But they don’t want “Jaguar buyers”. Jaguar buyers didn’t buy enough Jaguars to keep the company afloat.... I think there is a lot of truth here, particularly in the second sentance. I would be a classic example, I really like the way Jags look and love the idea of owning a Jaguar car (not an SUV though), but until about 10 years ago I've never really been in a position to afford one. I did consider an XE back then, but what did I buy? A Fiesta as I couldn't justify the bigger car. Unfortunately, I guess I'm fairly typical of those who are potential "Jaguar buyers" - I like the cars but when it comes to spending my own hard cash I went elsewhere (and don't regret it ) And it's for that reason I won't bleat on about weird adverts with people dressed in fluorescent colours, nonsensical phrases and child-like mixed cases of letters, because ultimately I would be asking a company to do what I want but not then responding by buying said product. 1
TonyW Posted November 23, 2024 Posted November 23, 2024 Were Airfix to release a range of Christmas decorations, modellers would be horrified and desert them. The great unwashed would be taken by the nostalgic, multicultural, green advertising and buy in at once, but only once. They would then be off to the next big thing once the advertisers had told them to shift, and the brand would be dead in the water and deservedly so. Substitute Jaguar, Lotus, Ferrari or any other of the lost in space old names and you would have todays situation. Yesterday I was stuck on the M25 and saw a great big hideous off lilac coloured gigantic SUV next to me. It passed me and the badge on the back said LOTUS. The game is well and truly up. 1 1
keefr22 Posted November 25, 2024 Posted November 25, 2024 Well, veering off on a tangent whilst still talking Jaguar, I would certainly like one of these cats in the garage...!! Cheap too at only a quarter of a million quid.... Keith 6
GiampieroSilvestri Posted November 27, 2024 Posted November 27, 2024 On 25/11/2024 at 14:51, keefr22 said: Well, veering off on a tangent whilst still talking Jaguar, I would certainly like one of these cats in the garage...!! Cheap too at only a quarter of a million quid.... Keith That is not bad at all and the best thing is that it makes Brummmmmmmm! Saluti Giampiero 1
The Unknown Modeller Posted November 27, 2024 Posted November 27, 2024 Aston Martin, Bugatti Veyron, Honda S.2000,
mdesaxe Posted November 28, 2024 Posted November 28, 2024 The one that got away! When I had a series of Lancias, whenever I had a problem with them that I could not deal with myself, I took them to a marvelous elderly Italian mechanic who ran his hole-in-the-wall shop on Pentonville Road near the Angel. We became good friends (dinners together with him and his wife and so on) and he would let me use his personal 250 GT Lusso as a loaner if he had to keep my car for any length of time. When he decided to retire (he was well into his eighties) he offered to sell it to me for about the same price as I had paid for my flat in Islington. We agreed and set it up to conclude the sale when I came back from a two-week business trip to Tokyo. Unfortunately, when I returned he told me the deal was off because his two sons, who had absolutely no interest in his business or the car, wanted him to keep it in the family. So that’s how it got away! The only good thing that came out of it was that we remained good friends (not so much with his sons) and he very shortly afterwards put me onto a rather nice red Maserati Mistral Spyder, which is the only car from that time I kept and I still have it here in Provence. Maurice 2
Noel Smith Posted December 1, 2024 Posted December 1, 2024 As Matt said Jaguar are not looking for Jaguar buyers with the new EV's being launched. So why call it a Jaguar at all? Toyota created the Lexus brand in order to create a different car identity for its targeted buyer market. Maybe Jaguar needs to do the same, as most contemplating looking for an actual Jaguar would expect to see their traditional cat logo somewhere on the car.
PatW Posted December 10, 2024 Posted December 10, 2024 In the 1960's a full blown Morris Mini Cooper 1275S bored out to 1293cc, lowered and widened track. Having seen these in saloon car racing they were the thing to have. Or even a Minisprint , tested by Sir Stirling Moss as seen here with Neville Trickett the designer/builder!! 3
Noel Smith Posted December 17, 2024 Posted December 17, 2024 If Ford had anything to do with it they would have persuaded me to buy their early Capri that they advertised as 'The car you always promised yourself'. Their first Capri was based on the Ford Classic. It was their second where they used that advertisement slogan. Airfix did a 1/32nd scale kit of it way back from what I can remember. Nice looking motor in its day. Not sure if anyone ever made a kit in 1/24th of one. 1
Spiny Posted December 18, 2024 Posted December 18, 2024 22 hours ago, Noel Smith said: If Ford had anything to do with it they would have persuaded me to buy their early Capri that they advertised as 'The car you always promised yourself'. Their first Capri was based on the Ford Classic. It was their second where they used that advertisement slogan. Airfix did a 1/32nd scale kit of it way back from what I can remember. Nice looking motor in its day. Not sure if anyone ever made a kit in 1/24th of one. Monogram did one which occasionally pops up on Ebay. Only one small problem - it's the American version with horrible bumpers 😖
cmatthewbacon Posted December 18, 2024 Posted December 18, 2024 I’ve always been surprised at the lack of a decent Capri kit. There are a couple of terrible ones, and the Tamiya silhouette racer, though even that’s hard to find these days. You’d have thought that Matchbox/AMT might have done one, or even Finecast at a pinch. I think our best bets now would likely be Chris at C1 Models (Professionals version anyone?) or the guys at Ukrainian Scale Car Production… best, M. 1
Noel Smith Posted December 18, 2024 Posted December 18, 2024 The controversial advert for the new Jaguar that does not show the car at all reminded me of Amstrad hiring a PR company to produce an advert for their new commercial PC back in the seventies (I think). It was very arty in a way that the new Jaguar is being marketed. When the ad was presented to Alan Sugar he hit the roof and asked 'Where's the (expletive) computer? I want people to see what I am selling, what it costs, and what benefit of will be to them. Some advertising creators really miss the plot sometimes and just either confuse their target audience of set themselves up to be an expensive laughing stock.
cmatthewbacon Posted December 19, 2024 Posted December 19, 2024 Well, to be fair, it wasn’t an “advert”, in that it wasn’t intended to sell a car — there won’t be any _to_ sell for more than a year. It was a short film for “the socials” to make a point, which it did. Much like the most famous computer ad ever made doesn’t show a computer at all… best, M.
galaxyg Posted December 19, 2024 Posted December 19, 2024 (edited) On 11/23/2024 at 8:40 PM, Anteater said: the worst thing they could do now would be to reveal a generic faceless EV appliance. They have one shot left and need to show us something really radical. I agree. But will they? And will people buy it even if they do, I wonder. Many people are amazingly conservative in their car choices because they have no interest in cars at all. If the next production car from jaguar is an EV appliance (great term!) then it'll be a commodity like all the other blobs out there, and when it comes to commodities, people will just go for low price. i.e Chinese. If it's radical - people won't buy it either because it's radical or because it's radical and expensive. I'd like to be wrong but I don't see a winning scenario for jaguar here. In other industry news I see stories that there might be a Honda-Nissan merger, with Honda having the upper hand. Not surprising, I was in a Nissan dealer a few months ago for work and the choices were a small SUV, a medium SUV, a large SUV, a large electric SUV, an expensive EV hatchback and a van. Not a line up to inspire anyone - again they've turned the *entire* European range into bland commodities. There's no compelling reason to choose one or even to choose that bran based on some unattainable halo model. Not that Honda have a lot to offer right now either but at least they have the Civic Type-R and a new Prelude on the way. A Prelude of which I'll assume Tamiya will make a kit since there are slim pickings for new Sports Cars these days and Tamiya have had to reach into the past for 50% of 2024's releases - the 240Z. Edited December 19, 2024 by galaxyg corrected typo
keefr22 Posted December 19, 2024 Posted December 19, 2024 15 hours ago, cmatthewbacon said: You’d have thought that Matchbox/AMT might have done one, They did - well one appeared in their boxes, don't know whose plastic it actually is. I've got an 'American' spec Mk2 with hideous impact bumpers. And not sure if it's 1/24 or 1/25, and I have no interest in measuring the thing to find out!! I also have a Doyusha ''Nostalgic Heroes'' 1/24 Mk1. This was originally motorised so has the corresponding terrible interior. The roof line looks a bit low, but I've been carefully trimming away some of the window trim and to my eyes at least it now doesn't look too bad - that means it needs new 'windows'. but as the kit glass is in horrible dark smoke plastic, that would have to be done anyway. Other than that it looks like a Capri to me.... Decalcas had announced a new tool Mk1 RS2600 but that was cancelled - hopefully one day they might pick it up again? A C1 models kit would be good though! (as would a C1 Ford Anglia....!!) Keith
cmatthewbacon Posted December 19, 2024 Posted December 19, 2024 I wonder if we’ll see Academy coming into the the 1/24 model cars market: the only companies really innovating in the electric market (or at least which make an electric vehicle today that I actually want that isn’t a Renault 5 or the Alpine version thereof) are Hyundai and Kia… Especially now this is going into production… best, M. 3
Jochen Barett Posted December 19, 2024 Posted December 19, 2024 Remember those days, when it was OK to have balls and to have fun?
keefr22 Posted December 19, 2024 Posted December 19, 2024 6 hours ago, cmatthewbacon said: Especially now this is going into production… That looks fantastic! Shame it isn't petrol.... 🤣 Keith 1
cmatthewbacon Posted December 19, 2024 Posted December 19, 2024 54 minutes ago, keefr22 said: That looks fantastic! Shame it isn't petrol.... 🤣 Keith Well, THAT one is a hydrogen and electric hybrid… not so very far away from a Mr Fusion… Though I suspect the production version will ride on an existing all electric platform… ;-( best, M. 1
Noel Smith Posted December 19, 2024 Posted December 19, 2024 (edited) Wishful thinking.I The car I always promised myself is a Tamiya 1/12th Scale Jaguar E Type Roadster kit..........(If only it existed ! LOL) Maybe. Just maybe, that could be the definitive E Type kit. It is such an iconic car that it is surprising that Tamiya have never done one. Even in 1/24th scale ! Edited December 19, 2024 by Noel Smith
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