Bertiee Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Although this topic has come about whilst I'm working on an A400, it's really a general question which covers most (if not all) models. Why do the manufacturers include parts which no one is ever going to see? In the case of the below parts E43 and E44 will be covered not just by the air duct but also by the engine housing itself, so unless you intentionally want to display it in pieces they'll be hidden. I understand that they want the model to reflect the real thing closely, but this sort of thing seems redundant, particularly when the instructions are saying to paint them as well! They're not even structural, as E42 and E45 fit together and hold their shape perfectly well without them. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treker_ed Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 True, but without those parts, which represent turbine blades (I think), you would have a hollow, see through tube. So they would seem to have been put in to stop any daylight being seen through what would be a intake/exhaust for a turboprop engine. Would be the same principle for a lot of jet based aircraft. Stops daylight being seen, or bare plastic if one looks down the intake etc. Most of the time, it's just because they can! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Des Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 To prevent reviewers/critics identifying a 'fatal flaw'. 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davecov Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 It stops a breakout of red-lined pictures appearing all over the web. Dave 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shorty84 Posted March 23 Share Posted March 23 Because this is what people expect today. A lot of reviewers would lambasted the kit if they were missing (because you could still see them at certain angles with a pocket lamp...). Let's face it, today it's a big no no to not to provide turbine faces or complete intake trunking even if you can barely see them. In contrast, some kits (e.g.: Hobby Boss F-84F) still do not provide them although these details could be clearly seen and you now have a glaring hole there instead. Considering how many modelers meticulously scratch interior details which really can't be seen once the fuselage halves are closed one can see that there is a certain 'expectation' for such details to be present. You know, you or me may disagree on this approach but the current trends and emphasis conveyed through reviews point into this direction and companies try to satisfy these demands to better sell their products. Just my 2 Eurocents! Cheers Markus 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Des Posted March 23 Share Posted March 23 32 minutes ago, Shorty84 said: Considering how many modelers meticulously scratch interior details which really can't be seen once the fuselage halves are closed one can see that there is a certain 'expectation' for such details to be present. For standard kit parts I think that the crew toilet compartment detail complete with toilet roll holder provided on the AMT ERTL/ESCI/Italeri 1/72 KC-135 Stratotanker and derivatives is definitely a front-runner when it comes to completely invisible detail . . . . . and of course I painted mine for the feeling of smugness from knowing that it is there. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterburns Posted March 23 Share Posted March 23 I'm with Bertiee on this. The detail that can't be seen is just an added cost to the modeler. When I built the Trumpeter Tu-160 it had a toilet that I never cut off the sprue, much less added to the model. I've got the A400 in the stash, I'll get a laugh when I get around to building it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeejeeZ Posted March 23 Share Posted March 23 4 hours ago, peterburns said: I'm with Bertiee on this. The detail that can't be seen is just an added cost to the modeler. When I built the Trumpeter Tu-160 it had a toilet that I never cut off the sprue, much less added to the model. I've got the A400 in the stash, I'll get a laugh when I get around to building it. Same here! Although I understand the points made by the others above, I hate the trend that models contain more and more parts. I like a basic representation of the subject, using not too many parts. It then is up to me to add self made stuff to where I like it. I am quite anal when it comes to landing gear, but I don't care much about the cockpit interior f.i. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabrejet Posted March 23 Share Posted March 23 A400M; always with the 'M'. The A400 runs from Charing Cross to Archway. 1 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flankerman Posted March 23 Share Posted March 23 5 hours ago, peterburns said: When I built the Trumpeter Tu-160 it had a toilet that I never cut off the sprue, much less added to the model. I added a toilet-roll, a first-aid box and some reading material - just to be a bit whimsical. None of which can be seen of course. 1 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Posted March 23 Share Posted March 23 I'm fairly agnostic about this kind of detail. If I reckon it won't be seen, I don't paint it, but the inside of the forward and aft sections of the trunking probably will be just about visible, as will the front and rear faces of the engine... if you've got very good eyes or an endoscope. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeepSea Posted March 23 Share Posted March 23 29 minutes ago, Mike said: ...will the front and rear faces of the engine... if you've got very good eyes or an endoscope. Do you need to sedate your model before using an endoscope on it? 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shorty84 Posted March 23 Share Posted March 23 1 hour ago, GeejeeZ said: I hate the trend that models contain more and more parts. The most extreme example must be the Minibase Su-33. I could not find how many parts it contains exactly but it must be well above 300 (the Kinetic kit contains 253). Many of them are really small parts which measure only a few millimeters. For me, this is already a bit above the limit of what can be reasonably handled and this '3D puzzle' certainly leads to a much longer build time. It also comes down at the perceived market the kit is developed for. In Central Europe and the US the avarage modeller gets older and older, almost without influx of new, younger people. No wonder they don't like increasingly complex kits. But when we look at Eastern Europe and Asia you see way more younger chaps entering the hobby which appreciate this approach. We like to think that (Western) Europe and the US are the markets which drive kit development but this is wrong. Our market is declining while the money and growth is in markets like Asia. So the customers there drive the way kits will be developed, not we. When you look at the companies originating there (AMK, Kinetic, Minibase, Freedom Model Kits, GWH, ...) the direction is clear. And their products are successful, which confirms their way of doing things. There will always be less complex kits around (I think e.g. Airfix and Revell hit a good middle ground there) but I doubt we will ever come back to the likes of Matchbox. Personally, I like what Amusing Hobby is doing: Good detail with manageable parts count for a great price. Cheers Markus 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Des Posted March 23 Share Posted March 23 24 minutes ago, DeepSea said: Do you need to sedate your model before using an endoscope on it? And remember to take the medicine twenty-four hours ahead of checking the exhaust pipe. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeejeeZ Posted March 24 Share Posted March 24 On 23/03/2023 at 23:05, Shorty84 said: There will always be less complex kits around (I think e.g. Airfix and Revell hit a good middle ground there) but I doubt we will ever come back to the likes of Matchbox. Personally, I like what Amusing Hobby is doing: Good detail with manageable parts count for a great price. Cheers Markus I am mostly into (civil) helicopters so I have a very limited choice. To my unpleasant surprise a few years ago Revell's latest 1/32 version of the EC135 turned out to be an overly complex monstrosity compared to their earlier 135- version and f.i. their 1/32 EC145. Thank god DreamModel saved my day with their Dauphin and hopefully soon S-61N. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selwyn Posted March 25 Share Posted March 25 On 3/23/2023 at 8:28 PM, Sabrejet said: A400M; always with the 'M'. The A400 runs from Charing Cross to Archway. If what I hear about the A400M reliability is true, it couldn't run between Charing Cross and Archway! Selwyn 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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