224 Peter Posted February 27, 2023 Share Posted February 27, 2023 And now for something completely different, the big Meng Me 163 Komet. One option is a captured one, as flown by Captain Winkle Brown. There is debate about the undersurface colour, as this thread makes clear: But there is no firm conclusion! There is an excellent review here: So, the first post will be along soon, starting with the cockpit (where else) just as soon as I've transcribed all the painting colours to Humbrol! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billn53 Posted February 27, 2023 Share Posted February 27, 2023 I’m looking forward to seeing this one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flintstone Posted February 27, 2023 Share Posted February 27, 2023 I have a Meng 163 to do, so I will be interested to see how you get on. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mick Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 good luck with your build Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
224 Peter Posted February 28, 2023 Author Share Posted February 28, 2023 As I learn more and watch build videos I realise that the T Stoff (85% hydrogen peroxide) 3 tanks were on each side and under the pilots seat with the C Stoff (hydrazine hydrate and methanol) immediately behind with the 30mm cannon ammunition above. Given that T Stoff will dissolve any organic material, such as the pilot, in seconds and would react with any C Stoff violently the cockpit of a ME 163 was not a safe working environment... The tanks and pipes were aluminium, but any pipe joints had to be free of any organic material. There are few indications of the cockpit colours, the few photos show an even grey colour that I assume is RLM 02. Can anyone confirm this? PJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattlow Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 I would have erred towards RLM 66 Schwarzgrau. RLM02 had been superseded for cockpits by the time 163s were operating... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retired Bob Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 2 hours ago, Mattlow said: I would have erred towards RLM 66 Schwarzgrau. I agree, definitely RLM 66 according to my references. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amos brierley Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 3 hours ago, 224 Peter said: There are few indications of the cockpit colours, the few photos show an even grey colour that I assume is RLM 02. Can anyone confirm this? No can’t confirm RLM02. RLM 66 all day long, don’t forget that the fuel tanks make up the side walls, these are rubber black. C Stoft and T Stoft . 😉 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillF67 Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 Much harder to build a model of an aircraft Winkle didn’t fly🤔 2 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flintstone Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 The Komet had tanks either side of the cockpit containing T Stoff and the main T Stoff tank occupied the space between the pilot and the rocket engine. The two tanks in the cockpit were covered in a black tar like substance, but the main tank was aluminium. The C Stoff tanks were in the wings, with one tank ahead of the main spar and the other behind in each wing. The cockpit is mainly grey and not black. There are some great references on-line, but I recommend Rob De Bie's site - https://robdebie.home.xs4all.nl/me163.htm 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
224 Peter Posted March 1, 2023 Author Share Posted March 1, 2023 Thanks, all. From what I can find the best match for RLM66 is Humbrol 67. Does that mesh with the collective opinion. I don't have that paint...so time to pop to the model shop! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 1, 2023 Share Posted March 1, 2023 21 minutes ago, 224 Peter said: Thanks, all. From what I can find the best match for RLM66 is Humbrol 67. Does that mesh with the collective opinion. I don't have that paint...so time to pop to the model shop! Humbrol 67 would be a suitable shade IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
224 Peter Posted March 11, 2023 Author Share Posted March 11, 2023 Here is the cockpit....nearly completed. I just need to highlight the seat buckles. The belts are photo etch that comes with the kit. MENG uses a very hard plastic that doesn't seem to stick easily with either Tamiya superfast or Revell glues. Every part has multiple sprue gates and every one has to be carefully cleaned up. There are also a lot of injector pin circles, as can be seen above. Surface detail is stunningly fine. I believe that the lever that has the red ball on the end is the "undercarriage" lever, it has 3 positions: down and locked, for take off, up and locked for flight and down and unlocked for landing. My main reference is West's, the Captive Luftwaffe, most of the photos are IWM or RAE. This model is the ME 163B-1a C/N 191060 and VF241 in RAF markings as flown by Lt-Cmdr E M Brown as flown by him in October 1946 from Vickers' airfield at Wisley. This is going to be a long job.....I'm working on the motor and tanks now. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flintstone Posted March 12, 2023 Share Posted March 12, 2023 On 11/03/2023 at 17:33, 224 Peter said: Here is the cockpit....nearly completed. I just need to highlight the seat buckles. The belts are photo etch that comes with the kit. MENG uses a very hard plastic that doesn't seem to stick easily with either Tamiya superfast or Revell glues. Every part has multiple sprue gates and every one has to be carefully cleaned up. There are also a lot of injector pin circles, as can be seen above. Surface detail is stunningly fine. I believe that the lever that has the red ball on the end is the "undercarriage" lever, it has 3 positions: down and locked, for take off, up and locked for flight and down and unlocked for landing. My main reference is West's, the Captive Luftwaffe, most of the photos are IWM or RAE. This model is the ME 163B-1a C/N 191060 and VF241 in RAF markings as flown by Lt-Cmdr E M Brown as flown by him in October 1946 from Vickers' airfield at Wisley. This is going to be a long job.....I'm working on the motor and tanks now. The lever with the red ball on it is the pump handle to raise and lower the flaps. Beside it is the selector tap which looks a bit like a big question mark. The skid control is on the left side of the instrument panel. Eric Brown explains the control for the skid in his Wings of the Luftwaffe book. Incorrect use of the lever would result in a solid skid for landing and would likely result in a spine injury for the pilot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
224 Peter Posted March 13, 2023 Author Share Posted March 13, 2023 The forward fuselage is coming together, the silver barrel is the T Stoff main tank.....just behind is the rocket motor and in front the cockpit.. I've also finished the skid, complete with takeoff bogie... The kit continues to be a challenge, mostly because the plastic used doesn't like to be glued, so super glue is needed and locating parts is made more difficult by lack of firm location pins, slots etc and very poor instructions. The motor control box has been particularly difficult to get square and lined up, Ive left some small parts off as it simply isn't clear where they go. Because the kit is designed to be able to be separated to show the motor it will not be clear until the last step if everything fits properly. I intend to have it joined up so may fix the rear section to the front section before the two sides are joined. The skid/wheels are beautifully moulded and the black plastic actually joins with glue... the best bit of the kit! 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
224 Peter Posted March 25, 2023 Author Share Posted March 25, 2023 (edited) The basic assembly is complete, sort of. The design of the kit is poor, nothing fits properly and there is no positive location for key bits, like the wings. The result is that attaching the wings to the body requires the use of both superglue and significant force, any attempt to position a part and run "Super Thin" glue will fail. These photos make the issues clear, note particularly the wing/fuselage fillet. Note the cannon hatches. It is vital to fit the cannon, even though they are hidden, as they help hold the wing assembly to the forward fuselage The leading edge slats are beautifully moulded! I've included a Humbrol tinlet to give scale, despite being in 1/32 scale this model is small!. Note the terrible fit of the wing fillets into the fuselage: on the real aircraft there was no visible step. Considerable filling and sanding will be needed and to make life even more difficult the plastic is so hard that sanding it is hard work.... I've applied "Green Stuff" and will be sanding extensively. I may not fit the rocket motor as as depicted in the kit VF241/ c/n 191060 did not have a motor, instead a cockpit data recorder was fitted and leaving out the motor may make fitting the tail easier...Once sanded I'll attach the tail to the forward section and that will mean more filling. Once sanded I can prime and paint. The black sections on the wing are where the photo etch air brakes go, although I've not found a photo showing them extended....so I may just glue them in place. This is a horrible kit to build, mostly because the designers wanted to include so much detail they made it very complex. Edited March 25, 2023 by 224 Peter 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flintstone Posted March 25, 2023 Share Posted March 25, 2023 Sorry to hear that you are having problems with the fit, I have seen this reported elsewhere and yet some reviews suggest no problem, perhaps there is some variability in the moulding process? Looking at my kit, the separate inner wing root part seems to be a very difficult thing to locate on the fuselage. I am sure you will wrestle a good 163 out of it in the end! The flaps were only extended for landing and would then be retracted before the aircraft was collected on the special trailer, hence there are not many photos of them being extended. The Cosford Komet did have the flaps down for a while, so maybe a internet search would give some detail photos? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flintstone Posted March 25, 2023 Share Posted March 25, 2023 Forgot to say that the outer control surfaces on the wings are elevons and the inner pair are trim tabs. The trim tabs would only move a limited amount, so generally appear quite flush with the wing profile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
224 Peter Posted June 5, 2023 Author Share Posted June 5, 2023 (edited) I've regained my MoJo...progress to report very soon..... Edited June 5, 2023 by 224 Peter 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
224 Peter Posted June 8, 2023 Author Share Posted June 8, 2023 Assembled, filled and sanded multiple times, treated with Mr Surfacer and sprayed with white primer. There is still a lot of rubbing down to do, the removable hatches on the spine fit where they touch and the undersurface is no better. This is a difficult kit and I wish I'd never started it. MENG are reputed to be excellent, not based on this. More as I run out of wet and dry paper.... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
224 Peter Posted July 24, 2023 Author Share Posted July 24, 2023 (edited) Well, 6 weeks of summer later and the little ME163 is starting to take colour, with underside in RAF Trainer Yellow, wings will be mostly 83 and 81 from wing splinter and a heavy mottle 83 of carried over the centre section with a lighter.83 over 76 on the front rear and rudder with the fin in RAF Dark Green, Hu 163. . The wings are supposed to be in 81, but the paint, old Humbrol, looking too bright. The 76 on the fuselage isn't blue enough, it is too grey to my mind. The wing to fuselage is acceptable, after endless rubbing down and the wings look good. More later this week... Edited July 24, 2023 by 224 Peter Typo 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
224 Peter Posted July 30, 2023 Author Share Posted July 30, 2023 Now with colour, next is to apply mottle to the fuselage and splinter camouflage to the wings. The mottle differs, depending on the source photo: even on the same airframe. I suspect that the top covers were replaced after servicing, but not always from that A/C. There were a number of 163's at farnborough when the A/C was flown by Brown. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
224 Peter Posted July 31, 2023 Author Share Posted July 31, 2023 Now that I've got to the painting stage I've been looking at all the photos of VF241 that I have found. This is what is happening Underside Trainer Yellow Hu 24 over white undercoat. Fin RAF Dark Green Hu 163 overall. The dark green stops at the fin joint line, so I wonder if the fin is original to this A/C Rudder, front and rear fuselage Hu 247 (RLM 76) with Hu252 (RLM 82) mottle Rear Fuselage: the German Cross shows clearly through the blue of the RAF Roundel, I'm going to try to show this by applying a transfer and then the RAF roundel over. I have RLM 76 over all this area so some further painting needed. Upper outer wing Hu252 (RLM 82) and Hu 251 (RLM 81) splinter: the 81 is ready to be applied. Now the difficult bit: the wing root up to the canopy line: this seems to have been repainted in a tone from B&W photos that looks more like Dark Green Hu 163 than RLM 82. There is no visible mottle, but German fuel triangles. I begin to wonder if the wing and upper fuselage panels are from a different A/C and had been partly repainted by the British to hide repairs to panels damaged stripping the A/C for transport. Anyone suggest any other comments...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
224 Peter Posted August 1, 2023 Author Share Posted August 1, 2023 OK, I've given it my best shot, also my first attempt at an airbrush mottle. Two photos, my effort and the reference photo. I think they have a reasonable similarity... Thoughts, comments....PLEASE! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flintstone Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 Well done, good to see you got your Komet in one piece! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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