nheather Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 I’ve noticed that some British early war bombs were a yellow colour. Airfix calls out trainer yellow (Humbrol 24) but we’re they really that stark a yellow or was it a more subdued colour? Is there a colour in Vallejo Model Air that is close enough? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 11 minutes ago, nheather said: I’ve noticed that some British early war bombs were a yellow colour. Airfix calls out trainer yellow (Humbrol 24) but we’re they really that stark a yellow or was it a more subdued colour? it called Buff, and was a standard colour for munitions from the Victorian era IIRC. @Selwyn is the chap for this Vickers Wellington. by Etienne du Plessis, on Flickr It did get overpainted in bomb dumps, leading to effects like this Halifax Mk. II by Etienne du Plessis, on Flickr this one shows the colour really well Can't help with a Vallejo match, @Casey? you may need to mix, trainer yellow and a dash of dark earth perhaps? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selwyn Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 4 minutes ago, Troy Smith said: it called Buff, and was a standard colour for munitions from the Victorian era IIRC. @Selwyn is the chap for this Vickers Wellington. by Etienne du Plessis, on Flickr It did get overpainted in bomb dumps, leading to effects like this Halifax Mk. II by Etienne du Plessis, on Flickr this one shows the colour really well Can't help with a Vallejo match, @Casey? you may need to mix, trainer yellow and a dash of dark earth perhaps? The colour was a light buff not yellow. Selwyn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogsbody Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 3 minutes ago, Selwyn said: The colour was a light buff not yellow. Selwyn Do you have a colour example to show us? Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 3 minutes ago, Selwyn said: The colour was a light buff not yellow. Selwyn I said it was buff the last photo looks decent on colour Did Light Buff end up as BS381C 358 - Light buff? https://www.e-paint.co.uk/lab-hlc-rgb-lrv-values.asp?cRange=BS+381C&cRef=BS381C+358&cDescription=Light+buff 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casey Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 15 minutes ago, Troy Smith said: I said it was buff I do not have sample. Buff is a class of colors, to quote 1908 Cyclopedia of painting (https://archive.org/details/cyclopediaofpain00arms/page/110/mode/2up). "Buff. Two parts of white lead and one part of yellow ochre produces a good buff, or white lead may be tinted with French ochre alone. Other shades are obtained with mixtures of two parts of black, four of white, one of red and one and one-eighth of yellow." 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selwyn Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 3 minutes ago, Troy Smith said: I said it was buff the last photo looks decent on colour Did Light Buff end up as BS381C 358 - Light buff? https://www.e-paint.co.uk/lab-hlc-rgb-lrv-values.asp?cRange=BS+381C&cRef=BS381C+358&cDescription=Light+buff It was actually Buff 381C 359 just checked, in my copy of INTER-SERVICE AMMUNITION AND AMMUNITION PACKAGE MARKINGS. selwyn 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casey Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 8 minutes ago, Selwyn said: It was actually Buff 381C 359 just checked, in my copy of INTER-SERVICE AMMUNITION AND AMMUNITION PACKAGE MARKINGS. selwyn That simplifies color matching at least for me My databases have only one good match for now, but I admit I might be missing a lot of paints Target: BS381C-358 | Light buff | GU 17.4, RGB: #DBAE6E (L*=72.50, a=12.74, b=36.69) DE00: 1.85 - #E0AC66 - Humbrol - AA0076 | No 7 | Light Buff - Gloss| GU 95.2 (L*=72.53, a=14.52, b=41.68) And it is not Trainer Yellow... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selwyn Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 1 minute ago, Casey said: That simplifies color matching at least for me My databases have only one good match for now, but I admit I might be missing a lot of paints Target: BS381C-358 | Light buff | GU 17.4, RGB: #DBAE6E (L*=72.50, a=12.74, b=36.69) DE00: 1.85 - #E0AC66 - Humbrol - AA0076 | No 7 | Light Buff - Gloss| GU 95.2 (L*=72.53, a=14.52, b=41.68) And it is not Trainer Yellow... I think its now an obsolete colour in BS381c. it gets referred to as "Buff" and "Middle Buff" in different editions of the BS, but there is a past history of colour names being changed in the standard but the colour actually remains the same . Selwyn 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casey Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Selwyn said: think its now an obsolete colour in BS381c. it gets referred to as "Buff" and "Middle Buff" in different editions of the BS, but there is a past history of colour names being changed in the standard but the colour actually remains the same . I think I have one from the e-paints deck, I had trusted them slightly less than original British Standard documents. Let me get that one. Here you go: Target: BS359 | Middle Buff | GU 87.2, RGB: #CD9855 (L*=65.29, a=15.58, b=41.02) I could not find any good match in any of paints in the box below: Spoiler Paint set name: Humbrol A1701 | No 157 | Azure Blue - Matt | GU 1.3 A6238 | No 187 | Dark Stone - Matt | GU 1.5 AA0046 | No 46 | Orange - Matt | GU 8.5 AA0059 | No 5 | Dark Admiralty Grey - Gloss | GU 90.8 AA0076 | No 7 | Light Buff - Gloss| GU 95.2 AA0134 | No 12 | Copper - Metallic | GU 8.7 | Metallic AA0173 | No 173 | Track Colour - Matt | GU 1.3 AA0234 | No 234 | Dark Flesh - Matt | GU 4.4 AA0343 | No 31 | Slate Grey - Matt | GU 7.5 AA0360 | No 33 | Black - Matt | GU 2.2 AA0549 | No 50 | Green Mist - Metallic | GU 94.3 | Metallic AA0552 | No 51 | Sunset Red - Metallic | GU 95.3 | Metallic AA0583 | No 53 | Gunmetal - Metallic | GU 1.2 | Metallic AA0727 | No 65 | Aircraft Blue - Matt | GU 5.0 AA0770 | No 66 | Olive Drab - Matt | GU 5.9 AA0775 | No 70 | Brick Red - Matt | GU 3.1 AA0802 | No 73 | Wine - Matt | GU 1.3 AA0816 | No 74 | Linen - Matt | GU 7.9 AA0833 | No 75 | Bronze Green - Matt | GU 2.0 AA0847 | No 76 | Uniform Green - Matt | GU 2.1 AA0850 | No 77 | Navy Blue - Matt | GU 1.7 AA0878 | No 79 | Blue Grey - Matt | GU 4.3 AA0905 | No 82 | Orange Lining - Matt | GU 4.1 AA0919 | No 83 | Ochre - Matt | GU 5.3 AA0922 | No 84 | Mid Stone - Matt | GU 4.1 AA0967 | No 87 | Steel Grey - Matt | GU 6.9 AA0970 | No 88 | Deck Green - Matt | GU 2.0 AA1105 | No 100 | Red Brown - Matt | GU 3.8 AA1119 | No 101 | Mid Green - Matt | GU 2.9 AA1167 | No 105 | Marine Green - Matt | GU 7.1 AA1287 | No 116 | US Dark Green - Matt | GU 2.1 AA1314 | No 119 | Light Earth - Matt | GU 4.5 AA1328 | No 120 | Light Green - Matt | GU 3.1 AA1331 | No 121 | Pale Stone - Matt | GU 7.0 AA1376 | No 125 | US Dark Grey - Satin | GU 11.4 AA1393 | No 126 | US Medium Grey - Satin | GU 37.9 AA1417 | No 128 | US Compass Grey - Satin | GU 31.6 AA1420 | No 129 | US Gull Grey - Satin | GU 21.6 AA1448 | No 131 | Mid Green - Satin | GU 21.1 AA1451 | No 132 | Red - Satin | GU 11.0 AA1465 | No 133 | Brown - Satin | GU 33.0 AA1496 | No 28 | Camouflage Grey - Matt | GU 17.2 AA1523 | No 140 | Gull Grey - Matt | GU 5.4 AA1568 | No 144 | Intermediate Blue - Matt | GU 4.8 AA1571 | No 145 | Medium Grey - Matt | GU 11.6 AA1599 | No 147 | Light Grey - Matt | GU 6.1 AA1609 | No 148 | Radome Tan - Matt | GU 19.1 AA1612 | No 149 | Dark Green - Matt | GU 2.9 AA1626 | No 150 | Forest Green - Matt | GU 1.4 AA1729 | No 159 | Khaki Drab - Matt | GU 2.0 AA1780 | No 164 | Dark Sea Grey - Satin | GU 25.9 AA1804 | No 166 | Light Aircraft Grey - Satin | GU 54.6 AA2240 | No 240 | RLM 02 Grau - Matt | GU 3.9 AA2241 | No 241 | RLM 70 Schwartzgrun - Matt | GU 2.2 AA2241 | No 241 | RLM 70 Schwartzgrun - Matt | GU 3.0 AA2242 | No 242 | RLM 71 Dunkelgrun - Matt | GU 1.0 AA2247 | No 247 | RLM 76 Lichtblau - Matt | GU 13.9 AA2248 | No 248 | RLM 78 Himmelblau - Matt | GU 3.0 AA2252 | No 252 | RLM 82 Olivgrun - Matt | GU 2.2 AA2253 | No 253 | RLM 83 Dunkelgrun - Matt | GU 2.4 AA6330 | No 195 | Dark Green - Satin | GU 31.5 AA6344 | No 196 | Light Grey - Satin | GU 29.9 AA6389 | No 200 | Pink - Gloss | GU 91.8 AA6392 | No 201 | Black - Metallic | GU 91.3 | Metallic AA6608 | No 220 | Racing Red - Gloss | GU 100.0 AA7222 | No 222 | Moonlight Blue - Metallic | GU 95.0 | Metallic AA7224 | No 224 | Dark Slate Grey - Matt | GU 3.0 AA7225 | No 225 | Middle Stone - Matt | GU 2.6 AB0047 | No 47 | Sea Blue - Gloss | GU 65.0 AB0052 | No 52 | Baltic Blue - Metallic | GU 78.7 | Metallic AB0065 | No 65 | Aircraft Blue - Matt | GU 6.3 AB0078 | No 78 | Cockpit Green - Matt | GU 4.1 AB0090 | No 90 | Beige Green - Matt | GU 9.5 AB0091 | No 91 | Black Green - Matt | GU 1.6 AB0094 | No 94 | Brown Yellow - Matt | GU 2.2 AB0104 | No 104 | Oxford Blue - Matt | GU 1.4 AB0145 | No 145 | Medium Grey - Matt | GU 2.4 AB0165 | No 165 | Medium Sea Grey - Satin | GU 17.2 AB0167 | No 167 | RAF Barley Grey - Satin | GU 9.2 AB0168 | No 168 | Hemp - Satin | GU 33.8 AB0226 | No 226 | Interior Green - Matt | GU 2.3 AB0230 | No 230 | Pru Blue - Matt | GU 1.3 AB0237 | No 237 | Desert Tan - Matt | GU 1.3 AB0238 | No 238 | Arrow Red - Gloss | GU 65.7 AB0239 | No 239 | British Racing Green - Gloss | GU 56.0 AB0240 | No 240 | RLM 02 Grau - Matt | GU 1.3 AB0241 | No 241 | RLM 70 Schwartzgrun - Matt | GU 4.0 AB0243 | No 243 | RLM 72 Grun - Matt | GU 1.5 AB0244 | No 244 | RLM 73 Grun - Matt | GU 1.4 AB0245 | No 245 | RLM 74 Graugrun - Matt | GU 0.9 AB0246 | No 246 | RLM 75 Grauviolett - Matt | GU 1.3 AB0247 | No 247 | RLM 76 Lichtblau - Matt | GU 12.9 AB0249 | No 249 | RLM 79 Sandgelb - Matt | GU 1.5 AB0251 | No 251 | RLM 81 Dunkelbraun - Matt | GU 0.7 AB0252 | No 252 | RLM 82 Olivgrun - Matt | GU 0.7 AB0253 | No 253 | RLM 83 Dunkelgrun - Matt | GU 0.8 DB0001 | No 1 | Primer | GU 5.6 DB0002 | No 2 | Emerald Green - Gloss | GU 79.8 DB0003 | No 3 | Brunswick Green - Gloss | GU 63.0 DB0009 | No 9 | Tan - Gloss | GU 76.9 DB0010 | No 10 | Service Brown - Gloss | GU 78.0 DB0011 | No 11 | Silver - Metallic | GU 6.7 | Metallic DB0012 | No 12 | Copper - Metallic | GU 48.2 | Metallic DB0014 | No 14 | French Blue - Gloss | GU 80.5 DB0015 | No 15 | Midnight Blue - Gloss | GU 79.7 DB0016 | No 16 | Gold - Metallic | GU 6.4 | Metallic DB0018 | No 18 | Orange - Gloss | GU 78.0 DB0019 | No 19 | Red - Gloss | GU 90.2 DB0020 | No 20 | Crimson - Gloss | GU 84.2 DB0021 | No 21 | Black - Gloss | GU 45.3 DB0022 | No 22 | White - Gloss | GU 65.9 DB0023 | No 23 | Duck Egg Blue - Matt | GU 4.3 DB0024 | No 24 | Trainer Yellow - Matt | GU 3.6 DB0025 | No 25 | Blue - Matt | GU 5.1 DB0026 | No 26 | Khaki - Matt | GU 3.4 DB0027 | No 27 | Sea Grey - Matt | GU 10.5 DB0029 | No 29 | Dark Earth - Matt | GU 3.6 DB0030 | No 30 | Dark Green - Matt | GU 3.2 DB0032 | No 32 | Dark Grey - Matt | GU 11.2 DB0033 | No 33 | Black - Matt | GU 3.9 DB0034 | No 34 | White - Matt | GU 6.5 DB0036 | No 36 | Pastel Green - Matt | GU 6.9 DB0037 | No 37 | Bright Green - Matt | GU 3.9 DB0038 | No 38 | Lime - Gloss | GU 82.8 DB0040 | No 40 | Pale Grey - Gloss | GU 65.2 DB0041 | No 41 | Ivory - Gloss | GU 58.2 DB0042 | No 42 | Pastel Violet - Matt | GU 4.8 DB0044 | No 44 | Pastel Blue - Matt | GU 7.0 DB0048 | No 48 | Mediterranean Blue - Gloss | GU 71.1 DB0053 | No 53 | Gunmetal - Metallic | GU 6.1 | Metallic DB0054 | No 54 | Brass - Metallic | GU 8.0 | Metallic DB0055 | No 55 | Bronze - Metallic | GU 6.7 | Metallic DB0056 | No 56 | Aluminium - Metallic | GU 14.6 | Metallic DB0057 | No 57 | Pink - Matt | GU 5.2 DB0058 | No 58 | Magenta - Matt | GU 6.4 DB0060 | No 60 | Scarlett - Matt | GU 3.5 DB0061 | No 61 | Flesh - Matt | GU 5.9 DB0062 | No 62 | Leather - Matt | GU 3.5 DB0063 | No 63 | Sand - Matt | GU 7.1 DB0064 | No 64 | Light Grey - Matt | GU 5.9 DB0067 | No 67 | Matt Tank Grey - Matt | GU 5.2 DB0068 | No 68 | Purple - Gloss | GU 79.1 DB0069 | No 69 | Yellow - Gloss | GU 93.5 DB0071 | No 71 | Oak - Satin | GU 19.7 DB0072 | No 72 | Khaki Drill - Matt | GU 6.8 DB0080 | No 80 | Grass Green - Matt | GU 3.6 DB0081 | No 81 | Pale Yellow - Matt | GU 1.9 DB0085 | No 85 | Black - Satin | GU 19.5 DB0085 | No 86 | Light Olive - Matt | GU 9.2 DB0089 | No 89 | Middle Blue - Matt | GU 5.4 DB0093 | No 93 | Desert Yellow - Matt | GU 4.5 DB0096 | No 96 | RAF Blue - Matt | GU 6.6 DB0098 | No 98 | Chocolate - Matt | GU 3.0 DB0099 | No 99 | Lemon - Matt | GU 8.5 DB0102 | No 102 | Army Green - Matt | GU 4.6 DB0103 | No 103 | Cream - Matt | GU 6.1 DB0106 | No 106 | Ocean Grey - Matt | GU 4.4 DB0109 | No 109 | WWI Blue - Matt | GU 4.7 DB0110 | No 110 | Natural Wood - Matt | GU 6.4 DB0113 | No 113 | Rust - Matt | GU 4.9 DB0117 | No 117 | US Light Green - Matt | GU 3.5 DB0118 | No 118 | US Tan - Matt | GU 5.6 DB0123 | No 123 | Extra Dark Sea Grey - Satin | GU 18.4 DB0127 | No 127 | US Ghost Grey - Satin | GU 19.7 DB0130 | No 130 | White - Satin | GU 27.3 DB0153 | No 153 | Insignia Red - Matt | GU 4.1 DB0154 | No 154 | Insignia Yellow - Matt | GU 9.6 DB0155 | No 155 | Olive Drab - Matt | GU 6.2 DB0156 | No 156 | Dark Camouflage Grey - Satin | GU 7.3 DB0160 | No 160 | German Camouflage Red - Matt | GU 4.9 DB0163 | No 163 | Dark Green - Satin | GU 21.8 DB0171 | No 171 | Antique Bronze - Metallic | GU 7.1 | Metallic DB0174 | No 174 | Signal Red - Satin | GU 25.2 DB0186 | No 186 | Brown - Matt | GU 4.5 DB0189 | No 189 | Chrome Silver - Metallic | GU 89.6 | Metallic DB0208 | No 208 | Fluorescent Signal Green - Gloss | GU 11.3 | Fluorescent DB0209 | No 209 | Fire Orange - Gloss | GU 20.2 | Fluorescent DB0242 | No 242 | RLM 71 Dunkelgrun - Matt | GU 1.5 MET27001 | No 27001 | Aluminium - Metalcote | GU 5.2 | Metallic MET27002 | No 27002 | Polished Aluminium - Metalcote | GU 10.8 | Metallic MET27003 | No 27003 | Polished Steel - Metalcote | GU 47.4 | Metallic MET27004 | No 27004 | Gunmetal - Metalcote | GU 5.2 | Metallic Paint set name: Revell 36104 | White | RAL 9010 | GU 72.8 36105 | White | RAL 9001 | GU 5.7 36106 | Tar black | RAL 9021 | GU 2.3 36107 | Black | RAL 9005 | GU 79.8 36108 | Black | RAL 9011 | GU 1.4 36109 | Anthracite | RAL 7021 | GU 4.7 36112 | Yellow | RAL 1018 | GU 79.5 36115 | Yellow | RAL 1017 | GU 6.5 36116 | Sandy yellow | RAL 1024 | GU 2.6 36117 | Africa brown | GU 3.1 36125 | Luminous orange | GU 3.5 | Fluorescent 36130 | Orange | RAL 2004 | GU 87.7 36131 | Fiery red | RAL 3000 | GU 90.5 36134 | Italian Red | GU 88.5 36135 | Flesh | GU 5.9 36136 | Carmine red | RAL 3002 | GU 3.0 36137 | Reddish brown | RAL 3009 | GU 1.8 36139 | Dark green | GU 2.2 36140 | Black green | GU 2.1 36142 | Yellowish olive | GU 1.8 36143 | Medium grey USAF | GU 2.9 36145 | Light olive | RAL 7003 | GU 2.2 36146 | Nato olive | RAL 7013 | GU 1.6 36147 | Mouse grey | RAL 7005 | GU 2.4 36148 | Sea green | RAL 6028 | GU 2.1 36149 | Light blue | GU 3.1 36150 | Light blue | RAL 5012 | GU 72.9 36151 | Ultramarine | RAL 5002 | GU 85.4 36152 | Blue | RAL 5005 | GU 82.7 36154 | Night blue | RAL 5022 | GU 85.3 36155 | Light green | RAL 6027 | GU 3.3 36156 | Blue | RAL 5000 | GU 2.2 36157 | Grey | RAL 7000 | GU 3.5 36159 | Sky RAF | GU 3.4 36161 | Emerald green | RAL 6029 | GU 82.3 36162 | Sea green | RAL 6005 | GU 88.5 36165 | Bronze green | RAL 6031 | GU 2.9 36166 | Olive grey | RAL 7010 | GU 2.2 36167 | Greenish grey | RAL 7009 | GU 2.3 36168 | Dark green RAF | GU 2.1 36169 | Granite grey | RAL 7026 | GU 1.6 36174 | Gunship grey | GU 3.1 36175 | Stone grey | RAL 7030 | GU 3.5 36176 | Light grey USAF | GU 4.1 36177 | Dust grey | RAL 7012 | GU 3.8 36178 | Tank grey | RAL 7024 | GU 2.9 36179 | Greyish blue | RAL 7031 | GU 1.9 36180| Mud brown | RAL 8003 | GU 82.2 36182 | Dark earth RAF | GU 2.1 36183 | Rust | GU 1.9 36184 | Leather brown | RAL 8027 | GU 1.9 36185 | Brown | RAL 8023 | GU 2.5 36186 | Olive brown | RAL 7008 | GU 2.2 36187 | Earth brown | RAL 7006 | GU 4.8 36188 | Ochre brown | RAL 1011 | GU 2.4 36189 | Beige | RAL 1019 | GU 2.9 36190 | Silver | GU 76.6 | Metallic 36191 | Steel | GU 4.9 | Metallic 36192 | Brass | GU 54.8 | Metallic 36193 | Copper | GU 60.8 | Metallic 36194 | Gold | GU 53.0 | Metallic 36195 | Bronze | GU 61.5 | Metallic 36199 | Aluminium | GU 9.6 | Metallic 36301 | White | RAL 9010 | GU 20.9 36302 | Black | RAL 9005 | GU 11.1 36310 | Lufthansa Yellow | RAL 1028 | GU 25.6 36312 | Luminous yellow | RAL 1026 | GU 4.9 | Fluorescent 36314 | Beige | RAL 1001 | GU 18.8 36330 | Fiery red | RAL 3000 | GU 16.2 36331 | Purple red | RAL 3004 | GU 17.8 36332 | Luminous red | RAL 3026 | GU 3.7 | Fluorescent 36350 | Lufthansa blue | RAL 5013 | GU 19.6 36360 | Fern green | RAL 6025 | GU 22.2 36361 | Olive green | RAL 6003 | GU 24.5 36362 | Greyish green | RAL 6013 | GU 12.4 36363 | Dark green | RAL 6020 | GU 21.6 36364 | Leaf green | RAL 6001 | GU 20.4 36365 | Patina green | RAL 6000 | GU 38.1 36371 | Light grey | RAL 7035 | GU 17.8 36374 | Grey | RAL 7001 | GU 20.7 36378 | Dark grey | RAL 7012 | GU 28.0 36381 | Brown | RAL 8025 | GU 42.5 36382 | Wood brown | RAL 8001 | GU 24.0 36730 | Orange | GU 87.2 | Opacity 34.45% | Transparent 36731 | Red | GU 93.0 | Opacity 42.21% | Transparent 36752 | Blue | GU 88.5 | Opacity 48.3 | Transparent Paint set name: Vallejo 71.001 | White | Blanco | FS37925 | RAL9016 | RLM21 | GU 3.5 71.002 | Medium Yellow | Amarillo Medio | GU 3.0 71.003 | Red RLM 23 | RLM23 Rot | RLM23 | GU 1.6 71.004 | Blue | Azul | GU 1.4 71.005 | Grey Blue | Azul Gris | RAL5008 | GU 1.5 71.006 | Light Green Chromate | Verde Claro Chromo | GU 1.3 71.007 | Olive Green | Verde Oliva | GU 1.2 71.008 | Pale Blue | Azul Claro | FS35414 | GU 2.0 71.009 | Eau De Nil "D.E. Green" | Verde Huevo Pato | BS216 | GU 1.8 71.010 | Interior Green | Verde Interior | FS34098 | GU 3.5 71.011 | Dark Green RLM83 | RLM83 Dunkelgrün | RLM83 | GU 1.2 71.015 | Dark Green RLM71 | RLM71 Dunkelgrün | RLM71 | GU 2.0 71.021 | Black Green RLM70 | RLM70 Schwarzgrün | RLM70 | GU 0.6 71.022 | Light Green RLM82 | RLM82 Hellgrün | RLM82 | GU 0.8 71.042 | Dark Brown RLM61 | RLM61 Dunkelbraun | RLM61 | GU 1.6 71.044 | Grey RLM02 | RLM02 Grau | RLM02 | GU 1.9 71.055 | Black Grey RLM66 | RLM66 Schwarzgrau | RLM66 | GU 1.7 71.078 | Yellow RLM04 | RLM04 Gelb | FS33538 | RLM04 | ANA614 | BS356 | GU 2.5 71.103 | Grey Blue RLM84 | RLM84 Graublau | FS36559 | RLM84 | GU 1.7 71.104 | Green RLM62 | RLM62 Grün | RLM62 | GU 3.4 71.109 | Faded P.R.U. Blue | M485 Blue Gray | FS35189 | BS636 | GU 1.6 71.121 | Light Gull Gray | Gris Gaviota USN | FS36440 | ANA620 | GU 2.6 71.255 | Light Blue RLM65 | RLM65 Hellblau | RLM65 | GU 1.7 71.257 | Light Blue RLM76 | RLM76 Lichtblau | RLM76 | GU 1.7 71.258 | Grey Green RLM74 | RLM74 Graugrün | RLM74 | GU 1.4 71.259 | Grey Violet RLM75 | RLM75 Grauviolett | RLM75 | GU 1.5 71.260 | Light Grey RLM63 | RLM63 Hellgrau | RLM63 | GU 1.5 71.264 | Brown Violet RLM81 | RLM81 Braunviolett | RLM81 | GU 1.2 71.277 | Dark Gull Gray | Gris Gaviota Oscuro | FS36231 | ANA621 | GU 1.7 71.279 | Insignia White | Blanco Insignia | FS37875 | ANA601 | GU 5.2 71.295 | USN Sea Blue | USN Azul Marino | FS35042 | ANA607 | GU 2.2 71.298 | M495 Light Gray | M495 Gris Claro | FS36357 | GU 1.8 71.299 | Intermediate Blue | Azul Intermedio | FS35164 | ANA608 | GU 2.5 71.300 | Glossy Sea Blue | Azul Mar Brillante | FS15042 | ANA623 | GU 24.6 Paint set name: Hataka HTK-A009 | Dark Earth | GU 9.1 HTK-A015 | Black-Green (RLM70) | GU 7.9 HTK-A016 | Dark Green | GU 9.6 HTK-A017 | Dark Green (RLM71) | GU 10.5 HTK-A023 | Grey (RLM02) | GU 14.1 HTK-A025 | Interior Grey-Green | GU 17.4 HTK-A026 | Sky "Type S" | GU 13.1 HTK-A029 | Light Blue (RLM65/78) | GU 13.2 HTK-A032 | Ocean Grey | GU 13.3 HTK-A034 | Medium Sea Grey | GU 14.2 Paint set name: Tamiya XF-1 | Flat Black | GU 3.9 XF-10 | Flat Brown | GU 4.4 XF-11 | J.N. Flat Green | GU 4.2 XF-12 | J.N. Gray | GU 2.1 XF-2 | Flat White | GU 9.8 XF-3 | Flat Yellow | GU 4.8 XF-4 | Yellow Green | GU 6.3 XF-5 | Flat Green | GU 3.5 XF-6 | Flat Copper | GU 4.9 | Metallic XF-7 | Flat Red | GU 1.0 XF-8 | Flat Blue | GU 4.1 XF-9 | Hull Red | GU 5.0 Here how they look: BS359 vs BS358 and Light Buff from Humbrol. Still it is nowhere close trainer yellow Edited February 12, 2023 by Casey 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nheather Posted February 12, 2023 Author Share Posted February 12, 2023 Are those photos originally black and white and have been colourised - I ask because, in them, the colours looks more like trainer yellow than buff. I’m sure you are all correct and buff is the correct colour so wondering whether the photos have been colourised incorrectly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 1 hour ago, nheather said: Are those photos originally black and white and have been colourised - I ask because, in them, the colours looks more like trainer yellow than buff. I’m sure you are all correct and buff is the correct colour so wondering whether the photos have been colourised incorrectly. Original colour. The best of the three is the one in the desert for the colour. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nheather Posted February 12, 2023 Author Share Posted February 12, 2023 1 hour ago, Troy Smith said: Original colour. The best of the three is the one in the desert for the colour. Maybe it's my computer/monitor but to, my eyes, that looks a lot closer to trainer yellow than it does to the the buff (BS381c) patches. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
europapete Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 but don't forget 1940's colour film was not as accurate at reproducing exact colours as it is today. Regards, Pete 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wmcgill Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 (edited) 7 hours ago, europapete said: but don't forget 1940's colour film was not as accurate at reproducing exact colours as it is today. Regards, Pete Perhaps, but you can see how yellow the bomb fins appear compared with the green bombs and the buff bombs & fin, desert sand, Caucasian skin and uniform fabric. Bombs may have been "buff" during WWI and for the inter-war years but they were "yellow" before they were dark green. Hence these obviously "yellow" fins. Edited February 12, 2023 by wmcgill clarity 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nheather Posted February 12, 2023 Author Share Posted February 12, 2023 25 minutes ago, wmcgill said: Perhaps, but you can see how yellow the bomb fins appear compared with the green bombs and the buff bombs & fin, desert sand, Caucasian skin and uniform fabric. Bombs may have been "buff" during WWI and for the inter-war years but they were "yellow" before they were dark green. Hence these obviously "yellow" fins. That makes more sense because I am definitely seeing yellow, not buff. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antti_K Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 Hello guys, here's couple that are on display at Finnish Air Force Museum: They are "light yellow", certainly not Trainer Yellow. Buff is pretty good name for the colour also. Unfortunately I didn't make a colour comparison but I'm visiting the museum again early next month. After that I will have NCS 1950 values for the colour. Cheers, Antti 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogsbody Posted February 13, 2023 Share Posted February 13, 2023 This is the photo that @Antti_K posted above. I had to open it on another tab to see it. Chris 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nheather Posted February 13, 2023 Author Share Posted February 13, 2023 5 hours ago, Antti_K said: Hello guys, here's couple that are on display at Finnish Air Force Museum: They are "light yellow", certainly not Trainer Yellow. Buff is pretty good name for the colour also. Unfortunately I didn't make a colour comparison but I'm visiting the museum again early next month. After that I will have NCS 1950 values for the colour. Cheers, Antti Maybe it’s my eyes, my brain, or my screen, but the colour I am seeing is much closer to trainer yellow than the British Standard buff colour referenced above. Maybe I have ‘trainer yellow’ wrong but to me this colour is definitely yellow rather than buff. And I’m seeing the same yellow colour in all the photos in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finn Posted February 13, 2023 Share Posted February 13, 2023 Here is a Stirling about to get a load of bombs: note the shade of bombs compared to the yellow of the roundel. Jari 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody37 Posted February 13, 2023 Share Posted February 13, 2023 27 minutes ago, nheather said: Maybe it’s my eyes, my brain, or my screen, but the colour I am seeing is much closer to trainer yellow than the British Standard buff colour referenced above. Maybe I have ‘trainer yellow’ wrong but to me this colour is definitely yellow rather than buff. And I’m seeing the same yellow colour in all the photos in this thread. Interestingly, I have two monitors and on one it looks a deeper yellow, not far from trainer yellow, on the other much paler so monitors could be a key factor here too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nheather Posted February 13, 2023 Author Share Posted February 13, 2023 2 hours ago, Finn said: Here is a Stirling about to get a load of bombs: note the shade of bombs compared to the yellow of the roundel. Jari I agree they look more pale than the roundel, they also look quite Matt, faded out. But they still look yellow. To my eyes the bombs in the photos have all been yellow, different shades (or lustres) but definitely yellow. The buff looks more brown orange to me, not at all like the bombs in the photos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selwyn Posted February 13, 2023 Share Posted February 13, 2023 2 hours ago, nheather said: I agree they look more pale than the roundel, they also look quite Matt, faded out. But they still look yellow. To my eyes the bombs in the photos have all been yellow, different shades (or lustres) but definitely yellow. The buff looks more brown orange to me, not at all like the bombs in the photos. Irrespective of what you see the colour that was officially mandated, the colour that the factories had to paint them was Buff 381C 359. It was the same colour that was used on British Army and Royal Navy artillery shells. It could not be yellow as this colour was used for a separate purpose in the explosive marking system. Selwyn 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nheather Posted February 13, 2023 Author Share Posted February 13, 2023 8 minutes ago, Selwyn said: Irrespective of what you see the colour that was officially mandated, the colour that the factories had to paint them was Buff 381C 359. It was the same colour that was used on British Army and Royal Navy artillery shells. It could not be yellow as this colour was used for a separate purpose in the explosive marking system. Selwyn I totally respect your knowledge and research and I'm confident that what you say is correct. So do you think those bombs in the photos are painted buff - do they look yellow to you - do you think that is a colour shift in the vintage photography (but what about the modern photos of the examples in Finland) or do you think that buff was actually more yellow than the colour swatches would suggest. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selwyn Posted February 13, 2023 Share Posted February 13, 2023 4 minutes ago, nheather said: I totally respect your knowledge and research and I'm confident that what you say is correct. So do you think those bombs in the photos are painted buff - do they look yellow to you - do you think that is a colour shift in the vintage photography (but what about the modern photos of the examples in Finland) or do you think that buff was actually more yellow than the colour swatches would suggest. What you must realise is that these images are copies of copies of copies of original images from the 1940's that would have colour fading etc. , The colours are at best now just a representation of the original. Selwyn 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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