Hoops Posted January 25 Share Posted January 25 Good morning, Does anybody know the dimensions of the above mentioned pylon? I want to build an F-16ADF in 1/72 scale, but need to scratch build the underwings Sparrow pylon. I think I can get the basic shape based on the photos, but I would like to know the dimensions to get the size right if anybody knows what they are. Cheers, and thanks. Hoops Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f111guru Posted January 25 Share Posted January 25 (edited) 3 hours ago, Hoops said: Good morning, Does anybody know the dimensions of the above mentioned pylon? I want to build an F-16ADF in 1/72 scale, but need to scratch build the underwings Sparrow pylon. I think I can get the basic shape based on the photos, but I would like to know the dimensions to get the size right if anybody knows what they are. Cheers, and thanks. Hoops @Hoopsfound this maybe help https://www.f-16.net/f-16_armament_article10.html also https://www.f-16.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=57760 lots of early photos. this is what i put in a search engine, f-16 adf aim 7 pylon All The Best, Ron VanDerwarker Edited January 25 by f111guru add info Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoops Posted January 25 Author Share Posted January 25 @f111guru Thanks for the links, I am familiar with those threads, there is lots of good information and some photos. I have plenty of photos, but I don't have anything in the way of actual dimensions, though. I could do some interpretation, but if somebody knew what the sizes actually were, that would be even better. Cheers, Hoops Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f111guru Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 (edited) @HoopsSent a message out to the Marvin Engineering Group for any information that they may share with me on the development of the pylon they have for the F-16 and AIM-7. So hopefully they'll respond in time. This is they're website https://marvineng.com/product_category/complex-systems/ All The Best, Ron VanDerwarker Edited January 26 by f111guru Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthViper Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 10 hours ago, Hoops said: Good morning, Does anybody know the dimensions of the above mentioned pylon? I want to build an F-16ADF in 1/72 scale, but need to scratch build the underwings Sparrow pylon. I think I can get the basic shape based on the photos, but I would like to know the dimensions to get the size right if anybody knows what they are. Cheers, and thanks. Hoops Try the F-16s of the Kinetic 1/48 series, in theirs armament options. Good Luck SouthViper from Brazil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoops Posted January 26 Author Share Posted January 26 (edited) On 1/25/2023 at 7:15 AM, Hoops said: I want to build an F-16ADF in 1/72 scale 13 hours ago, SouthViper said: Try the F-16s of the Kinetic 1/48 series, in theirs armament options. Good Luck SouthViper from Brazil Thanks SouthViper Unfortunately that does not help me in 1/72 scale. Edited January 26 by Hoops grammar 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoops Posted January 26 Author Share Posted January 26 15 hours ago, f111guru said: @HoopsSent a message out to the Marvin Engineering Group for any information that they may share with me on the development of the pylon they have for the F-16 and AIM-7. So hopefully they'll respond in time. This is they're website https://marvineng.com/product_category/complex-systems/ All The Best, Ron VanDerwarker I had tried to send a message via there website as well, but it threw me an error and would not let me submit. Please let me know if you hear anything. Thanks Ron! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CT7567 Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 I don't have access to the kit(s) in my stash at the moment to confirm, but my recollection is that the Italeri/Testors "first generation" F-16A/B tooling in 1:72 included an accurate version of the Sparrow pylon as used early on by the YF/FSD birds. I'm not sure whether this is different from the "production" ADF pylon, but they are similar in general appearance. Note that Italeri later revised their F-16 tooling to (approximately) represent the C/D, with an entirely new sprue for the wing pylons so later Italeri A/B kits won't have what you need (Not sure of the date break point but most likely late 80s - for Testors boxings anything in the vintage yellow boxes should be good). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f111guru Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 I still have 2 of the original F-16A in 1/32nd scale from Hasegawa and the kit has the AIM-7 pylon. This is from the late 70's and had built 2 while I was stationed at RAF Lakenheath. So will have to dig out the remaining sprue to see if the pylon represent anything close as to what Marvin Engineering Group has. I also have a few Hasegawa in 1/72nd Scale and will have to look if those pylons are there. Also have the old Testors reboxing F-16A/B in the stash and will look there too. Also got the same error when I sent out the first message. Resent but not noticed an error on the second. All The Best, Ron VanDerwarker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tempestfan Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 (edited) 23 hours ago, Hoops said: Thanks SouthViper Unfortunately that does not help me in 1/72 scale. If you had the kit already, simply all measurements *0.6667. But it will not make much sense to buy a 48th kit just for the measurements if you do not intend to build it. Wait - you could Edit: "*" instead of "+"... 23 hours ago, CT7567 said: I don't have access to the kit(s) in my stash at the moment to confirm, but my recollection is that the Italeri/Testors "first generation" F-16A/B tooling in 1:72 included an accurate version of the Sparrow pylon as used early on by the YF/FSD birds. I'm not sure whether this is different from the "production" ADF pylon, but they are similar in general appearance. Note that Italeri later revised their F-16 tooling to (approximately) represent the C/D, with an entirely new sprue for the wing pylons so later Italeri A/B kits won't have what you need (Not sure of the date break point but most likely late 80s - for Testors boxings anything in the vintage yellow boxes should be good). Italeri 130 itself was revised at least once when they extended the tailplanes to Block 15 size, and IIRC they updated numerous more parts, including replacing the "tip end" tanks with the "blunt end" variety, possibly also the Banana c/l tank. Not completely sure when this happened, but I think it was before they released the C/D boxing - possibly 1986? Edited January 27 by tempestfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthViper Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 1 hour ago, Hoops said: Thanks SouthViper Unfortunately that does not help me in 1/72 scale. Dear Hoops, well, I meant that having a 1/48 scale piece in hand, you could convert the measurements to 1/72. SouthViper from Brazil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve McArthur Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 Apparently several of the Kinetic 1/48 kits have the pylon as well that could be used for measurements. Kinetic has a sprue FF that has one Sparrow and one 501 pylon. They include a pair in any kit that needs Sparrows: some F/A-18s, F-104S, Taiwan F-16 Block 20 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CT7567 Posted January 27 Share Posted January 27 13 hours ago, tempestfan said: If you had the kit already, simply all measurements +0.6667. But it will not make much sense to buy a 48th kit just for the measurements if you do not intend to build it. Wait - you could Italeri 130 itself was revised at least once when they extended the tailplanes to Block 15 size, and IIRC they updated numerous more parts, including replacing the "tip end" tanks with the "blunt end" variety, possibly also the Banana c/l tank. Not completely sure when this happened, but I think it was before they released the C/D boxing - possibly 1986? I can't confirm a release date but I know that the Testors boxing of the C/D was available by 1990 and the release of the A/B (#130) that includes a Greek option shared new/retooled parts that include the 'production style' pylons and tanks on Sprue B (the C/D stores and vertical tail were an additional part of this same sprue in that boxing, so while the release may not have been concurrent certainly the tooling updates were contemporary): https://www.scalemates.com/kits/italeri-130-f-16-a-b-fighting-falcon--145793 I can't verify from actual plastic but based on the instructions for various issues of #130 that Scalemates posts as "198x" the updated tanks & pylons were done the same time as the enlarged horizontal tail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoops Posted February 2 Author Share Posted February 2 On 1/26/2023 at 10:22 AM, CT7567 said: I don't have access to the kit(s) in my stash at the moment to confirm, but my recollection is that the Italeri/Testors "first generation" F-16A/B tooling in 1:72 included an accurate version of the Sparrow pylon as used early on by the YF/FSD birds. I'm not sure whether this is different from the "production" ADF pylon, but they are similar in general appearance. Thanks for the tip, it looks like those kits are demanding pretty silly prices on Ebay though. Unfortunately no swap meets locally that I am aware of to pick up the kits on the cheap. On 1/26/2023 at 10:38 AM, f111guru said: I also have a few Hasegawa in 1/72nd Scale and will have to look if those pylons are there. I looked at those kits online as well, and it looks like there is a very simple rendition of the weapons pylon in there. Probably not much better accuracy than I can get based on resources gathered online. After measuring the kit, some photo interpretation of aircraft and the Kinetic parts, I came up with the solution that the pylon is ~7mm tall and ~34mm long in 1/72 scale. It's probably not exactly right, but it's pretty close in scale. It will be better than anything else out there in 1/72 (because there isn't anything else!). Cheers, Hoops F-16 AIM-7 (501) Pylon v2 by J2Hoops, on Flickr 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tempestfan Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 @Hoops, do you happen to have the Aerofax Aerograph on the F-16? It may be worth having a look in there. If you don't, I could have a look in one of mine if there are any drawings. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AntPhillips Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 Here's a screen grap from the Kinetic 1/48 F/A-18C kit instructions of the sprue containing the Sparrow and the pylon (the pylon isn't used in the Hornet kit just the Sparrow missile), you could resize the image using the Sparrow as a guide to give you some basic dimensions for scratchbuilding purposes. I've read somewhere that carrying the Sparrow lead to some longitudinal stability issues, particularly if carried assymetrically, to the point where in live firing exercises they would be fired as a pair. Hope this helps Ant 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mak_the_Knife Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 I have a resin ADF conversion set somewhere, I’ll see if it has any pylons—it’s been awhile since I had a look at it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mak_the_Knife Posted February 7 Share Posted February 7 22 hours ago, Mak_the_Knife said: I have a resin ADF conversion set somewhere, I’ll see if it has any pylons—it’s been awhile since I had a look at it. It's the FBminis kit, and it has an ALQ pod, not a sparrow pylon. Sorry! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoops Posted February 14 Author Share Posted February 14 On 2/2/2023 at 9:33 AM, AntPhillips said: Here's a screen grap from the Kinetic 1/48 F/A-18C kit instructions of the sprue containing the Sparrow and the pylon (the pylon isn't used in the Hornet kit just the Sparrow missile), you could resize the image using the Sparrow as a guide to give you some basic dimensions for scratchbuilding purposes. I've read somewhere that carrying the Sparrow lead to some longitudinal stability issues, particularly if carried assymetrically, to the point where in live firing exercises they would be fired as a pair. Hope this helps Ant Thanks Ant, I imported the image into Fusion 360 and layed it behind the 3D model, and it compared out pretty well. I did a little bit of tweaking of some of the panel lines based on that, and I am happy with the result. I'll consider this mini project completed. On 2/6/2023 at 9:17 PM, Mak_the_Knife said: It's the FBminis kit, and it has an ALQ pod, not a sparrow pylon. Sorry! No worries Mak, thanks for looking! Cheers, Hoops 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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