Converting 1/700 Hasegawa Mikasa to a Royal Navy battleship?

[P-3s rule]

I seem to recall a few posts  quite a while back asking about the difficulties of converting the Hasegawa 1/700 Mikasa to an RN pre dreadnought, and it seemed this project would be too difficult and involve too much work and surgery. I have also seen a post or two where some modellers have built the 1/350 or 1/700 Mikasa kit as an RN ship with varying, sometimes very minor or minimal degrees of modifications. I have the Hasegawa 1/700 Mikasa kit in my hands 'as I speak'!

 

Looking through my reference library (specifically Burt's British Battleships 1889-1904 volume) and several websites,it seems that a Formidable or Duncan Class (and maybe even a Canopus Class?) could be made from the Mikasa with not too much work being involved? Or is this not a great assumption? How much surgery would be involved?

 

Any thoughts guys?

 

Jason

[terryn]

Jason

 

Can't help much with the main question but as you probably already know Mikasa was built in Birkenhead where many British ships were also built.  There is a family resemblance so it depends on how fussy you are.  Incidentally a friend of mine grew up living in Mikasa Street in Birkenhead and there were pictures of Mikasa and her crew on the wall of a local pub.

 

A very small Japanese company called Foresight (Seals Models) also do a very nice Mikasa as well as a small range of 1/700 ships of the same era.  They sold the small parts sprue separately as a Boats/Weapons set for RN/IJN and I vaguely remember seeing an article in a Japanese Magazine about using these parts on a scratch built hull to build a British Majestic Class.  I know you already have the Hasegawa Kit but if I was going to start chopping I'd rather use the simpler Seals kit than the Hasagawa one.

 

Not a great deal of help but if you build the Hasegawa Mikasa and stick a White Ensign on it very few people will know you cheated  😇

 

Terry

[ArnoldAmbrose]

1 hour ago, terryn said:

very few people will know you cheated  😇

       Gidday Jason, I'd call it modeler's license. And I think Terryn make a good point in that it really depends on how far you want to go. This era of warship is not my forte so I don't know how close the Mikasa is to contemporary RN vessels. When researching a ship for a new build I Google, type in the ship's name and then click on 'images'. My apologies if I'm stating the bleedin' obvious. HTH.

       Regards, Jeff.

[David J Ross]

Actually, Mikasa was built about a mile from where I am typing this here in Barrow in Furness Cumbria. We also have a Mikasa Street.

 

Perhaps Mikasa stopped off at Birkenhead on its way to Japan.

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_battleship_Mikasa

 

Edited to add link.

Edited November 13, 2022 by David J Ross

[PF Naughton]

Hi,

According to Wikipedia the Mikasa was similar to the RN's Formidible class but with an etra 6inch gun per broadside.  Looking at images on the internet it appeara that these 6 inch guns are arranged in the central deckhouse on the Main Deck level, with a gun at each corner for both designs on both the main deck and 01 deck levels.  On the Formidible class there appears to be two additional 6 inh guns per side between the fore and aft guns, on the main deck level (as per the link below).  For the Mikasa there appears to be three addition 6 inch guns between the fore and aft guns on the main deck (as shown in the 2nd link)

Formidable_class_battleship_diagrams_Brasseys_1906.jpg (1209×883) (wikimedia.org)

 

Japan's 114-year-old battleship Mikasa: A relic of another time - CNET

 

As such, that may be a starting point for trying to convert your Mikadsa model into an RN ship. 

 

Both ships appear to have four 12 pdr small guns per side on the 01 level between the fore and aft 6 inch guns, so it does not appear that it would be necessary to make any changes there.

 

Other pictures of the Formidible look (at least superficially) similar to the Mikasa though the masts, small boats, and other such fittings may likely have changed over time on both vessels/classes.  As such you may want to look over images of the RN ships throughout their careers to see what other detail changes might make sense for your conversion.

 

Best of luck

 

Pat

[terryn]

8 hours ago, David J Ross said:

Actually, Mikasa was built about a mile from where I am typing this here in Barrow in Furness Cumbria. We also have a Mikasa Street.

 

Perhaps Mikasa stopped off at Birkenhead on its way to Japan.

 

Woops

 

You are of course correct.  I have Birkenhead on the brain at the moment and should have said Barrow in Furness.  Also there doesn't seem to be a Mikasa Street in Birkenhead.  

 

I was told stories of large section of a ship, perhaps Albion or Bulwark being dragged along the street outside my friends Aunties house.

 

I'm going to blame old age.  Thank you for your very polite correction.

 

Terry

[David J Ross]

Like this?

https://david-j-ross.smugmug.com/Military/Albion-class-on-the-move/i-p8kWngt/A

 

 

 

Edited November 22, 2022 by David J Ross
to correct link. Hope this works.

[Orso]

Need a login to look at it.

[P-3s rule]

Many thanks for those replies, and I will be tucking into my Burt's British Battleships 1889-1904 book to work out whether Formidable is the easiest conversion. I'm guessing so at this stage, and the helpful suggestions from Pat and Terry are taken on board. I would still love to make the earlier Canopus though as it and Invincible (Trumpeter 1/700 kit) both saw action off the Falklands in late 1914. But I suspect the conversion of Mikasa to Canopus might be just a bit too difficult?

[Killingholme]

If it's possible, you've already got the contemporary reference book that's most likely to help you get it right. But the question still remains, why bother? If you want HMS Canopus, Combrig make a perfectly decent kit of her and her sisters!

[grubber]

Hi,
i

I'm in the process of this conversion on the 1/350 kit..............Not that simple!

I am hoping to do Venerable my grandfather served on that in 1912

I was after drawings for it but found little.

The armament has been discussed but the fwd funnel is oval in shape orientated abeam. The anchor stowages were moved aft but for 1/700 I see little difference

[P-3s rule]

On 11/16/2022 at 6:32 PM, Killingholme said:

If it's possible, you've already got the contemporary reference book that's most likely to help you get it right. But the question still remains, why bother? If you want HMS Canopus, Combrig make a perfectly decent kit of her and her sisters!

The reason why I am even contemplating this conversion is that I really do not want a Japanese pre-dreadnought in my collection as I mainly build German, RN and USN ships from pre-WW1 to now - with an emphasis on the WW1 and WW2 periods. I have recently read "The Scapegoat" by Steve Dunn, which describes Rear Admiral Chris Cradock's life and Royal Navy career with quite an emphasis on the Battle of Coronel in late 1914. The Canopus was fairly much a bystander and their is still much debate how useful this slow old pre-dreadnought would have been against Von Spee's squadron on the day. The general concensus is Canopus would have been more of a liability - with the main (only?) benefit (of it steaming with Cradock's cruisers) being it's 4 x 12 inch guns. It's worth remembering also that Canopus fired the first salvoes the following month when Von Spees cruisers approached the Falklands again.

 

I can see the Combrig Canopus advertised on several places on websites which I won't name here. These kits tend to be fairly pricey - considering I already have a handy 'free' donor kit in the form of a near relative (2nd cousin?) in my stash already (the Hasegawa Mikasa). As I stated above, I don't see a place in my collection for a Japanese pre-WW1 ship, but a companion to my Trumpeter 1914 Invincible and 1906 Dreadnought DOES interest me.

 

I hope this explains my motivation.

 

Then again, you may be right? Maybe I should just bite the bullet and buy a Combrig Canopus!

 

Jason

[Killingholme]

7 minutes ago, P-3s rule said:

The reason why I am even contemplating this conversion is that I really do not want a Japanese pre-dreadnought in my collection as I mainly build German, RN and USN ships from pre-WW1 to now - with an emphasis on the WW1 and WW2 periods. I have recently read "The Scapegoat" by Steve Dunn, which describes Rear Admiral Chris Cradock's life and Royal Navy career with quite an emphasis on the Battle of Coronel in late 1914. The Canopus was fairly much a bystander and their is still much debate how useful this slow old pre-dreadnought would have been against Von Spee's squadron on the day. The general concensus is Canopus would have been more of a liability - with the main (only?) benefit (of it steaming with Cradock's cruisers) being it's 4 x 12 inch guns. It's worth remembering also that Canopus fired the first salvoes the following month when Von Spees cruisers approached the Falklands again.

 

I can see the Combrig Canopus advertised on several places on websites which I won't name here. These kits tend to be fairly pricey - considering I already have a handy 'free' donor kit in the form of a near relative (2nd cousin?) in my stash already (the Hasegawa Mikasa). As I stated above, I don't see a place in my collection for a Japanese pre-WW1 ship, but a companion to my Trumpeter 1914 Invincible and 1906 Dreadnought DOES interest me.

 

I hope this explains my motivation.

 

Then again, you may be right? Maybe I should just bite the bullet and buy a Combrig Canopus!

 

Jason

 

Sound reasoning. Personally I think there's good cause for including Misaka in a collection of RN ships. The IJN wasn't just interested in British warship designs, they were also interested in accessing RN knowhow, sending their officers and constructors to train with the RN. And the RN took a very keen interest in how Japan was actually using the assets and tactics during the course of the Russo-Japanese war- sending officers as observers aboard ships. 

 

I think you should build both!

 

Will

[P-3s rule]

On 11/24/2022 at 11:42 AM, grubber said:

Hi,
i

I'm in the process of this conversion on the 1/350 kit..............Not that simple!

I am hoping to do Venerable my grandfather served on that in 1912

I was after drawings for it but found little.

The armament has been discussed but the fwd funnel is oval in shape orientated abeam. The anchor stowages were moved aft but for 1/700 I see little difference

I know what you mean about trying to source drawings and plans for most of these similar looking RN pre-dreadnoughts. Regarding references, the 1889-1904 Burt volume seems to be the best I have and there is no plan view of the Formidable Class - just photos and side profile drawings. However the Canopus and Duncan Class chapters do have reasonable plan views. It really makes it more personal when a family member served on one of the Bulwark Class too! I'm checking out sister ship London in awesome looking dazzle scheme when used as a minelayer in 1918 on page 222 of Burt's volume.

 

I will be most interested in your conversion work in 1/350 too!