Ju 88C in the Battle of Britain

[Mike N]

Calling all Ju 88 aficionados...

 

In the September 2000 edition of Scale Aircraft Modelling, there was a feature by Neil Robinson called 'Battle over Bridlington Bay - 15 August 1940'. This described a raid by approximately 50 Ju 88s of KG30 based in Denmark, made up of A-5 bombers and C-2 fighters. The latter variant is the one I am looking for help with for a 1/48 model. I am using the Special Hobby Ju 88C-4 boxing as my starting point, and also have the AIMS Ju 88A-5 correction set / A-1 conversion set.

 

Although I've also seen it stated that the C-1 variant was the type used at the time of the raid, I would be inclined to trust Mr. Robinson over 'the internet'.

 

None of my Battle of Britain references mentions Ju 88 fighters at all, and I have no books that detail the differences in Ju 88C sub-versions. From what I can glean from the net, the C-2 was based on the A-5 bomber, although Special Hobby's instructions state that the C-2 was converted from the A-1 with short span wings. Which is correct?

 

From an armament point of view, I believe the nose part is correct with three MGs and a cannon. The introduction in the instructions states that the C-4 introduced two additional forward firing cannon in the gondola on some machines, so from that I'm assuming these would not be appropriate for the C-2?

 

Regarding cockpit guns, the SH kit replaces the ICM main canopy part with one that doesn't have a flexible forward facing MG through the windscreen. While it is 'just a colour profile', the SAM article illustrates the C-2 with such a gun, and if it was converted from a bomber after leaving the factory (my speculation!) then could it be correct?

 

Finally (for now!), any idea what the dorsal rear gun configuration should be? Special Hobby offers three different options in its C-4 kit: single gun in circular mount; two separate guns in circular mounts; or two separate guns through standard rectangular panels.

 

Any help on the above would be much appreciated!

 

Mike 

Edited November 6, 2022 by Mike N

[Graham Boak]

The C-1 was never built.  The C-2 was the first production variant.  using Green (not the best sources perhaps but most easily available for now, the C-2 was converted from bombers but no views I have show the fixed forward firing gun, and as a three seater there'd be no-one free to fire it.  Only the single rear gun was fitted to all aircraft at this time, until additional guns sprouted during the BoB.  The two circular mounts are appropriate for the A-4.  Green states that the C-4 (based on the A-4) was the first fighter to have extended wingtips.  He states that KG30 was to be the first unit to get the C-2 but with the onset of night raids bt Bomber Command these were diverted to the Nachtjagd.  August would seem to be a little early for later arrivals but maybe.  

 

Given the age of this work, there is certainly room for changes to these descriptions, but the '88 has not the most consistently describes development history. Works dealing with the operational history might be more reliable, but surely something is available for the action on this day of all days?

 

 

[brewerjerry]

Hi

     I haven't got it but maybe someone has who can see if it has any useful info for you 

 

cheers

   jerry

 

 

[G.R.Morrison]

The early Ju 88C series with the KG 30

 

The first of the C-1 series Werknummer range that I have is 0096, assigned to the Z. Staffel of the KG 30 as “4D+OH” on 13.April 1940, and passed on to the 5./NJG 2 on 10.July 1940.  These ‘early birds’ with the NJG 2 retained their original ‘4D’ Kennung.  The Z-Staffel was using both ‘H’ and ‘Z’ as a Staffel indicator, but by June 1940 they were primarily using ‘Z’ as their Staffel indicator.

 

The C-1s are in the 0116, then 012x and 015x ranges.

  The C-2s begin with 018x (the first to arrive at the Z-Staffel of the KG 30 being WNr.0181 [SKZ: “VR+SA”] ‘4D+BZ’, 3.June 1940).

 

A several pilots who would later have noteworthy careers in the Nachtjagd, such as Paul Semrau (WNr.0122 ‘4D+BH’, WNr.0154 ‘4D+RH’) and Heinz Strüning (WNr.0142 ‘4D+NH’), flew C-1s at this time.

 

Regarding the 15.August battle, I have Oblt. Werner Bachmann (‘4D+DR’), Fw. Siegfried Matschke, and Lt. Riede as casualties in Ju 88Cs, but 1940 Lw records are often thin on details (such as sub-type, Werknummer, or Kennung).

 

The few photos I have of Z-Staffel machines (‘4D+HH’, 4D+NH’, ‘4D+DZ’) do not have a MG15 firing forward through the windscreen (nor do the C-2s with the NJG 2).  The rear defensive armament appears to be a single gun, but ‘4D+DZ’ may have a raised rear part of the canopy to accommodate two guns.

 

Good luck with your build, GRM

[vppelt68]

(EDIT: Of course this doesn't help you at all in answering your original question about the Battle over Bridlington Bay 😞 )

 

Hello and welcome to the Ju 88 group build too! I've read in Norwegian Luftwaffe SIG #5 "Junker Ju 88 i Norge" that not only the Zerstörerstaffel but also the Erprobungsstaffel of the KG 30 used some of the C-2 variant. The latter also, after former had been taken away to form core of a nightfighter unit. According to our Norwegian experts the C-2:s had the extended wingtips (lang rekkevidde). Erpr.St./KG 30 used the A letter usually reserved for Geschwaderstab, for example the 4D+QA they lost 10.7.1942. I must say thank you to our Norske venner for this information! V-P

[Mike N]

Thanks for the replies, folks. I'll try to get hold of a copy of the Topdrawings book, or at least a peek at it at Telford this weekend

 

Cheers,

 

Mike

[StevieD]

And just to throw in another theory….

 

I plan to model Ju88 4D+DR shot down near Bridlington Waterworks by Flt/Sgt Hopwell of 616 Squadron. This is always credited as a ‘Ju88C’ However a photo of this aircraft on display (give it a google) clearly shows the glass nose of an A1 or A5. 

 

Researching this sometime ago I came across an explanation that ‘C’ was an operational subvariant that indicated fuel tank capacity like this….

 

/A (no fuselage fuel), /B one internal fuselage tank, /C two internal tanks, /F one internal, and up to two droptanks (plus cameras).

 

So 4D+DR is a Ju88A1/C

 

Can’t vouch for the source but I think he was German and seemed pretty well read on this. Seems plausible. 

Edited November 11, 2022 by StevieD

[Vesa Jussila]

If I am not wrong this Rüstzustand C there would be two fuel tanks in internal bays.

[brewerjerry]

40 minutes ago, Vesa Jussila said:

If I am not wrong this Rüstzustand C there would be two fuel tanks in internal bays.

Hi

    interesting , i have a copy of

Ju -88A-1, A-5 , juni 1941, Teil 12 G 

( only 12G i have a copy of ) 

 

  gives Rüstsatz B-1 as the bombay fuel tanks 

 

 I have nothing for the C series or fighter types

 

  Anyone know if the Rüstzustand and Rüstsatz numbers were subtype specific ?

 

  i.e different for  A, C , D,  S  etc

 

 

 

   cheers

      jerry 

[Mike N]

On 11/11/2022 at 5:41 PM, StevieD said:

And just to throw in another theory….

 

I plan to model Ju88 4D+DR shot down near Bridlington Waterworks by Flt/Sgt Hopwell of 616 Squadron. This is always credited as a ‘Ju88C’ However a photo of this aircraft on display (give it a google) clearly shows the glass nose of an A1 or A5. 

 

Researching this sometime ago I came across an explanation that ‘C’ was an operational subvariant that indicated fuel tank capacity like this….

 

/A (no fuselage fuel), /B one internal fuselage tank, /C two internal tanks, /F one internal, and up to two droptanks (plus cameras).

 

So 4D+DR is a Ju88A1/C

 

Can’t vouch for the source but I think he was German and seemed pretty well read on this. Seems plausible. 

 

The SAM article has a colour profile of 4D+DR and shows it as an A-5, so at least that tallies.

 

An interesting note about the sub-variants, although I'm going to stick with mine being a C-2 fighter. The article has profiles of two C-2s: 4D+ES and 4D+FH. Googling the latter code does turn up a reference to a C-0 or C-2 that force-landed in Norway in May 1940, but presumably a different machine could have been assigned that code by August.

 

I am no clearer on the long vs short wing tips, various books I perused at Telford suggested both... The Topdrawings books I found were sealed, and I didn't want to spend ~£15 just for this info!

 

Mike