Bless my soul it’s a Fairey Firefly in 1/48 by Trumpeter

[The Spadgent]

15 hours ago, Biggles87 said:

Just had a big catch up so a little late on the wheel well comment but you really went ‘ above and beyond ‘ with them and achieved a great result.

 

John. 🇺🇦

Thanks John. Too kind. 🤩

14 hours ago, heloman1 said:

Been away in the UK for a week, so playing catch-up with a few of my favourite builds . Great work on the wheel bays, tasty looking detail.

 

Colin

Much appreciated Colin. 😇

12 hours ago, Zephyr said:

I'm just catching up too, the wheel wells look fantastic and they were definitely worth the effort!

I don't know about resin copies but I'll be using this thread as an instruction manual when I do my Firefly!

Thanks. If anything I’m really happy if my builds can help others. 😇 

 

 Johnny

[The Spadgent]

Good evening. Hope you’re all having a lovely weekend. It’s been a bit of a hup ho week at Cheś Spadgent so not a whole lot of modelling but there has been some tinkering in between the madness.

First of I added a few wires using lead.

Then did a pre shade.

While I had some black in the cup I painted the nose intake PE.

Nice detail. 

Then some colour in the wells.

And on the rim of the lower wing.

While that all dried I need to try and move on with this thing. So after going in a really tiny lever in the cockpit. 👀

I decided to snip bits off and glue things together to get a bit of momentum. 
These gates are beginning to really grind my gears. They are just big enough to snip using….. well my snips, so that makes them slightly less of a pita. 😫

So any way the tail got stuck together in preparation for some surgery.

The tail of you leave it as is looks fine on things kit. However if you are to position the flaps (like I’m going to) they’re wrong.

so I cut along the seam provided with a scalpel. The Square reasons will have to come off also.

Glued to make new flaps. I’ll send the little tab as that’s not actually there.

This kit gives with one hand then takes away with the other. I think the issues aren’t that hard to fix but it’s almost like why?  Why would they do that?

Moulded tail flash 🫣😩

not a hard fix but….. why? 
sprue goo too the rescue.

I had planned on printing one of these to look more like what’s on the real aeroplane. Cloth/ ribs.

I still might do that but I thought I’d sand some dips and see what that does.

And a bit of primer.

Hmmm🤔 a bit over kill so I sanded them right back.

Here it is glued and sanded.

Still not 100% convinced. I need to print wheels anyway so I might just knock one up and be done with it.

 

And that as they say is your lot.

 

 More in the week 🤞🤞🤞

 

 Take care y’all.

 

 And thanks for dropping by.

 

 Johnny.

[Troy Smith]

12 hours ago, The Spadgent said:

not a hard fix but….. why? 

Garbage in-garbage out.     

 

The researcher and CAD designer likely knows nothing about the subject.   And it's not checked by anyone who does.  And I doubt if  it greatly affects Trumpeters sales.  Bear in mind they made mistakes on aircraft they actually have in museums and/or made, eg MiG-21/J-7....

Back in 2010, an employee of Trumpeter joined here, and posted a thread on their planned Spiteful/Seafang kit.  Lots of response, and help and information was given for fault seen on the CAD images.   

Result. Nothing.  No information used, no glitches corrected.    They had the chance to get  accurate info, and basically free error checking and set up pathway for future projects....   so we have since had a series of British subjects made with a load of flaws .... Spiteful/Seafang,  Dh Hornet/Sea Hornet, Albacore, Vampire, Firefly,  Defiant, Sea Vixen (these two after the Airfix kits  so not such a problems)  I've probably forgotten a couple 

 

Sad thing is,  they make decent kits, as in well moulded and engineered, you raved about the clear parts...     so with the right info you get  a great package.... Their Wyvren, and to a lesser extent, Sea hawk, have been raved about, (research possibly by Monochrome in Japan)     I'd love to know who did the research on their 1/24th Hurricane,  as they really did a good job on shapes, it has some faults, but the main big bits are just wow.  And they never scaled it down....  though Hobby Boss have just announced a 1/48t kit.  (apparently one florr of the factory is Trumpeter, the other is Hobby Boss... basically the same company) 

 

I read somewhere that Song ended up working for Kittyhawk.   

 

one last thing, with your trials on the rudder, if you have the time,  read this

https://rclibrary.co.uk/title_details.asp?ID=1216

link to pdf donw the page

 

"My main aim is to liberate the plastic modeller from the kit, to show him what can be done and to assure him that the satisfaction he may get from his kit model is nothing compared to that he would experience from 'free' modelling."

 

It's old, but Harry Woodman was one of the people who pushed plastic modelling to where is is today,  I have a 1976 Scale Models mag where he telling you how have to make photo etch, and has a printed template for parts included...  

 

It's well worth a read to see various techniques and methods...   great one about making engine cylinder by wrapping wire around sprue, supporting it in balsa trough, heating it under the grill, and then letting it cool so you when you remove the wire you get fine cooling fins,  and much more.

Some can be done more easily in other ways now, like 3-d printing,   but there are things  that may just quicker to make...   

 

hope of interest 

Edited September 26, 2022 by Troy Smith
spelling.

[giemme]

Lovely detailing and surgery there, Johnny!  

 

(but I foresee more 3D printing )

 

Ciao

[heloman1]

Thanks for the link to the Harry Woodman book. I had it at one time but loaned it out!!!

 

Colin

[The Spadgent]

On 26/09/2022 at 01:45, Troy Smith said:

Garbage in-garbage out.     

 

The researcher and CAD designer likely knows nothing about the subject.   And it's not checked by anyone who does.  And I doubt if  it greatly affects Trumpeters sales.  Bear in mind they made mistakes on aircraft they actually have in museums and/or made, eg MiG-21/J-7....

Back in 2010, an employee of Trumpeter joined here, and posted a thread on their planned Spiteful/Seafang kit.  Lots of response, and help and information was given for fault seen on the CAD images.   

Result. Nothing.  No information used, no glitches corrected.    They had the chance to get  accurate info, and basically free error checking and set up pathway for future projects....   so we have since had a series of British subjects made with a load of flaws .... Spiteful/Seafang,  Dh Hornet/Sea Hornet, Albacore, Vampire, Firefly,  Defiant, Sea Vixen (these two after the Airfix kits  so not such a problems)  I've probably forgotten a couple 

 

Sad thing is,  they make decent kits, as in well moulded and engineered, you raved about the clear parts...     so with the right info you get  a great package.... Their Wyvren, and to a lesser extent, Sea hawk, have been raved about, (research possibly by Monochrome in Japan)     I'd love to know who did the research on their 1/24th Hurricane,  as they really did a good job on shapes, it has some faults, but the main big bits are just wow.  And they never scaled it down....  though Hobby Boss have just announced a 1/48t kit.  (apparently one florr of the factory is Trumpeter, the other is Hobby Boss... basically the same company) 

 

I read somewhere that Song ended up working for Kittyhawk.   

 

one last thing, with your trials on the rudder, if you have the time,  read this

https://rclibrary.co.uk/title_details.asp?ID=1216

link to pdf donw the page

 

"My main aim is to liberate the plastic modeller from the kit, to show him what can be done and to assure him that the satisfaction he may get from his kit model is nothing compared to that he would experience from 'free' modelling."

 

It's old, but Harry Woodman was one of the people who pushed plastic modelling to where is is today,  I have a 1976 Scale Models mag where he telling you how have to make photo etch, and has a printed template for parts included...  

 

It's well worth a read to see various techniques and methods...   great one about making engine cylinder by wrapping wire around sprue, supporting it in balsa trough, heating it under the grill, and then letting it cool so you when you remove the wire you get fine cooling fins,  and much more.

Some can be done more easily in other ways now, like 3-d printing,   but there are things  that may just quicker to make...   

 

hope of interest 

 Thanks Troy.  I get what you’re saying and it does seem like “Song” is asking for info but I can’t see where he said he works for Trumpeter. so I question if he is affiliated at all? Even if he was/is does he have the power within the company to make such changes?  As I said I may have missed some details about Mr Song and if I did I apologise.  Thanks for the book link I think you sent me this before and it’s a real winner.  Such great help. Thanks me mon.

😀😇
 

On 26/09/2022 at 08:21, giemme said:

Lovely detailing and surgery there, Johnny!  

 

(but I foresee more 3D printing )

 

Ciao

Thanks G. More printing no doubt.

On 26/09/2022 at 12:53, heloman1 said:

Thanks for the link to the Harry Woodman book. I had it at one time but loaned it out!!!

 

Colin

♥️

[The Spadgent]

Good evening.

 Thanks for all the feedback. It’s very useful. I did get some bits wrong but I have rectified.

Although my photos could have been better. You know the little tab I cut off? I found some reference telling me that that was wrong so I unglued and stuck back to the main fin.  Chopped out the gap and now I can pose correctly, you can’t see in this shot but it’ll look great. 😇

The tail fits the fuselage really well. 😀 the step isn’t there with a little pressure.

And here’s the rudder. I also re scribed the little back fin thing. I quite like that. 

And the other side.

The little bits of the flash panel lines are also now gone.

More has been done but I have no pics. More soon. ♥️

 

 Thanks for popping in.

 

 Johnny. 

[The Spadgent]

A little more on the fly and a moral of “Time doesn’t always equal quality” . Is that a moral? More of a statement. 🤣🥹

Here is a belated photo. Of the fixed tail fin.

The glue line will vanish under paint. 😍

The wells got a Flory wash, top coat and left to dry. What is it with wheel wells and this hobby? We spend ages getting them just so, then point them at the floor for all eternity. 🤷‍♀️  

Then they got pegged and glued as a very deliberate act of progression. 

Now here’s the thing. @Ex-FAAWAFU  pointed out an inaccuracy in the chin oil cooler. The Trumpy kit has that one little PE part that’s a bit vague and a bit see through and as is seems a bit deeeeep.

So What a to do ?  Cutting a very long journey a little shorter to save you the pain after many attempts I found the best way to fix this was to firstly bung said hole with tin foil. Pack it in noice and toit. 😉

Then upon poking it out from tother end you can make a template using plasticard.

the foil goes back in then card and now all you have to do is make a convincing vent.

Imagine if you will the throaty tones of our very own Welsh gravel tin Bonnie Tyler, belting out “Holding out for a hero” while I rattle through what can only be described as a really dull montage spiced up by some classic Jim steinman. 🤪

Here we go!!!!

”Where have all the good men gone
And where are all the gods?
Where's the streetwise Hercules
To fight the rising odds?”

 

lord knows but here’s a vent. 🥸

 

 

 

 

 

I did say it was boring. Imagine siting doing it for well over an hour and this was the best of three. 🤨

I looked at it for ages and from different angles but I just couldn’t get in with it. 😩

so I found a bit of old PE bomb bay I think cut it down with scissors spent 5 mins painting and weathering and bunged it up the chute.

Much better. 🙃😆

Always the way.

As it stands you get to see my bunged tin foil from tother side which is a pain.

And I’d cut the PE to use in the first vent. 😩 never mind. I had a spare, should look ok with a spot of paint. 

Ok so after the madness I’ll end on a bit of a fun little dry fit. The wells had dried and fit wonderfully. 🤗

The wings seem to fit.

All the other bits just seen to slot into place.

Looks a bit like a firefly. 🔥🪰

 

On that note I’ve just seen the time so I’m headed off to the land of nod. Take care y’all. 😴💤

 

Johnny. 

[81-er]

Nice work on the vents, Johnny. Out of curiosity, what was the silver foil thing that you cut up for the first attempt?

 

James

[AdrianMF]

It is indeed looking Fireflylicious!

 

Noice tip with the silver foil too.

 

Regards,

Adrian

[stevehnz]

Looking quite excellent Johnny, really liking the wheel wells & cockpit detail, that front cockpit especially had a "just right" look to it. Beautiful.

Steve.

[giemme]

FWIW, I quite liked the first attempt at the vent thing, Johnny. Wheel wells and all looking ace    

 

Ciao

[bigbadbadge]

Ooooooo cracking progress Johnny   like the mods and corrections you are doing, wheel Wells look ace and that is a cracking idea using the foil will have to use that myself,  thanks.

Great work 

Chris

[Brandy]

Looking good!

Flaps, by the way, are on the inner portion of the wing. Either underneath or the entire rear section. They are deployed for landing (on some aircraft also partially deployed for take off) to reduce the stall speed, increase lift, and also act as air brakes to some extent.

The moveable bits on the tail are rudder (verticle) or elevators (horizontal).

The "little back fin thing" is a trim tab, to help reduce the control pressures.

 

Here endeth todays lesson. 

 

Ian

[opus999]

Boy! I've missed a lot!  Johnny -- those wheel wells are just flat amazing. Despite the trouble you had.  There was some good engineering going on there. 

 

I don't know what to say about the cockpits because they are incredible.

 

You can imagine my amazement when I was still laboring under the impression that this was 1/72. Still, even at 1/48 the detail is more than I could ever hope to achieve.

 

It's a good sized model isn't it?

[Troy Smith]

On 25/09/2022 at 23:32, The Spadgent said:

I thought I’d sand some dips and see what that does.

re fabric, and book link, it was that fabric doesn't really dip,  well, not when in a useable condition, but is taught, and the ribs show

this is unrestored WW2 fabric,  and still taught

 

 

 

 

 

in this not the nearly 'faceted' appearance of the fuselage fabric

 

all from

 

https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235099841-hawker-hurricane-mkia/

 

modellers have got used to 'troughs and valleys' and sackcloth texture in models, so study how how it really look can be surprising. 

 

On 27/09/2022 at 21:10, The Spadgent said:

Thanks for the book link I think you sent me this before and it’s a real winner.  Such great help. Thanks me mon.

i should have said, it has info on how to do fabric surfaces, but it's full of ideas, even if some are now a bit obsolete,  it's useful to se how idea develop, and in the case of making thing like a wing,  still very workable.   I have probably posted it for you before, as it a really good 'toolkit' for modellers wanting to expand their skills.

  It's interesting to note how the hobby developed,  and how initially plastic kits weren't 'proper modelling'   while I think at times modellers are now a bit cossetted and worried to just 'have a go' ,  I do on occasion point out that if 'such and such' has some AM correction part, they have nothing to lose by trying a fix, and if it fails, then get the AM bit... and If it works, feel chuffed. 

I wonder what Harry Woodman would have made of 3-D printing?     Embraced it I should think....

 

And always a pleasure that my contributions may help your work in anyway.  

cheers

T

 

[The Spadgent]

On 30/09/2022 at 09:07, 81-er said:

Nice work on the vents, Johnny. Out of curiosity, what was the silver foil thing that you cut up for the first attempt?

 

James

Thanks James. It’s an old favourite go to do my foil. Pie dish. 🥧 any time we have one I save it and use it for such things. 😇

On 30/09/2022 at 09:08, AdrianMF said:

It is indeed looking Fireflylicious!

 

Noice tip with the silver foil too.

 

Regards,

Adrian

Thanks. The foil worked well, I just looked the other one better.

On 30/09/2022 at 10:20, stevehnz said:

Looking quite excellent Johnny, really liking the wheel wells & cockpit detail, that front cockpit especially had a "just right" look to it. Beautiful.

Steve.

Thank you. Too kind. 😇

On 30/09/2022 at 15:29, giemme said:

FWIW, I quite liked the first attempt at the vent thing, Johnny. Wheel wells and all looking ace    

 

Ciao

Thanks G. I thought that’s what you’d say. 😂

On 30/09/2022 at 17:21, bigbadbadge said:

Ooooooo cracking progress Johnny   like the mods and corrections you are doing, wheel Wells look ace and that is a cracking idea using the foil will have to use that myself,  thanks.

Great work 

Chris

Thanks. That’s very kind of you. 😇

On 30/09/2022 at 17:55, Brandy said:

Looking good!

Flaps, by the way, are on the inner portion of the wing. Either underneath or the entire rear section. They are deployed for landing (on some aircraft also partially deployed for take off) to reduce the stall speed, increase lift, and also act as air brakes to some extent.

The moveable bits on the tail are rudder (verticle) or elevators (horizontal).

The "little back fin thing" is a trim tab, to help reduce the control pressures.

 

Here endeth todays lesson. 

 

Ian

Thanks Ian. I love the thing you learn on BM. 😇🤩

On 30/09/2022 at 18:15, opus999 said:

Boy! I've missed a lot!  Johnny -- those wheel wells are just flat amazing. Despite the trouble you had.  There was some good engineering going on there. 

 

I don't know what to say about the cockpits because they are incredible.

 

You can imagine my amazement when I was still laboring under the impression that this was 1/72. Still, even at 1/48 the detail is more than I could ever hope to achieve.

 

It's a good sized model isn't it?

1/72😳😳😳 That would have been fun. Yes she’s quite the size.  And thanks. 😃

On 30/09/2022 at 19:32, Troy Smith said:

re fabric, and book link, it was that fabric doesn't really dip,  well, not when in a useable condition, but is taught, and the ribs show

this is unrestored WW2 fabric,  and still taught

 

 

 

 

 

in this not the nearly 'faceted' appearance of the fuselage fabric

 

all from

 

https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235099841-hawker-hurricane-mkia/

 

modellers have got used to 'troughs and valleys' and sackcloth texture in models, so study how how it really look can be surprising. 

 

i should have said, it has info on how to do fabric surfaces, but it's full of ideas, even if some are now a bit obsolete,  it's useful to se how idea develop, and in the case of making thing like a wing,  still very workable.   I have probably posted it for you before, as it a really good 'toolkit' for modellers wanting to expand their skills.

  It's interesting to note how the hobby developed,  and how initially plastic kits weren't 'proper modelling'   while I think at times modellers are now a bit cossetted and worried to just 'have a go' ,  I do on occasion point out that if 'such and such' has some AM correction part, they have nothing to lose by trying a fix, and if it fails, then get the AM bit... and If it works, feel chuffed. 

I wonder what Harry Woodman would have made of 3-D printing?     Embraced it I should think....

 

And always a pleasure that my contributions may help your work in anyway.  

cheers

T

 

Thanks Troy. 
I had a bit of a wobble when I saw the ailerons? We’re cloth. But then I noticed tears a hurrie. 😅I think if I have read correctly that the FF converted to metal.

 

 You’re right about the dips, that’s why I sanded most/ all of the dips out, they do get more pronounced during flight but on the ground not so much.

 

You did share the book before but there can never be too much spreading of wonderful knowledge like that. I’m sure he would have embraced 3D printing. It still seems like magic even though I know the process. And as you said plastic / injection moulding was seen as “not proper modelling” Back in the day. It’s the same as people thinking digital art isn’t real art. 😩 they’re all tools that we can use to make our hobby even more wonderful. 
 

And I thank you once again for your vast knowledge and informative comments on all of my threads.

 

Hopefully more later on the old FF.

 

😇

 

 Johnny

 

[corsaircorp]

Veeery fine job Spad !!

I love the way you improve the radiators !!

Pure modelling with talent !!

Well done Sir !! Congrats !!

CC

[The Spadgent]

On 02/10/2022 at 12:47, corsaircorp said:

Veeery fine job Spad !!

I love the way you improve the radiators !!

Pure modelling with talent !!

Well done Sir !! Congrats !!

CC

Thanks Alain. You’re a gent. 😀

[The Spadgent]

Good morning. 

Some progress on the FF that has occurred sporadically over the past few days. 😇

Fist off my little compass that I printed and painted vanished. 😩

The modelling gods must be please today as my first venture under the desk bore fruit. 😀

Quickly I glued it in place!!! Not before knocking it onto the carpet again and having to do the same for about ten minutes just to remind me who’s in charge. 🤣

Now that the Mason cooler has its rear facing section added and painted.

I could do the same to the other little vent. It also needed a plasticard back to stop any peep through.

This got trimmed and glued into place in the nose panel.

The next steps kind of need to be done “Allatonce”.  The side vents need to go on first.

With these in place the nose section can get fitted.

At the same time this is going on the tops of the wings and the whole lower wing and well section needs to squeeze int place.

Deploy ze Precision Engineered Grip System  ( P.E.G.S ). 

There is almost a need for an extra limb while wrestling all that into place in one go but as you Jimmy the whole thing around there is an audible “Click” and everything just holds together, it’s a very odd feeling. You have to hold some sections while gluing but that’s it. There was a step from the side vents and the wings that I eliminated via the gift of sprue goo as seen above. This will get sanded later on. While all that dried I decided to tackle another missing item from the trump kit. Those pesky nose vents. They aren’t very big so it’s easy to see why they were missed.

i head planned on printing some but have decided to use a mule to see if I can get them done with other means.

 Here’s exhibit A “plasticard and goo”

After a bit of a dry, sand and prime we have this.

And

Which I think is pretty good. ❤️

I have to print some wells so I might do a test with printing the vents too and see which one I like best.

This is the scheme I think I’m headed towards.

💛💛💛💛

And with that I might not have weapons. I’m hoping @Troy Smith will let me know about this. Did prototypes have weapons? If not that’s fine but I need to fill these ‘oles and not add the little pylons for the bombs.

Well fully energised with some of this last night.

(The first new pint from Batham’s I have ever seen in all my years )

I did some sanding and some tidying.

(next day obvs🤣)

Everything nice and neat.

I decided to fit the wing bits now. I may regret this but what the hey.

The nose and vent section got smoothed.

As did the fuselage seam.

I also drilled the exhausts.

Just a couple of pics because. ❤️

A bit of goo around the wings to fix any gaps.

Also there seems to be no light in the , erm light. I’ll print one along with some new guns as the ones in the kit don’t match my choice of build.

 

ok then.

I think that’s it.

I foresee some Digital modelling and maybe some masking in my future.

 

Take care and I hope you all have a splendid Sunday.

 

All comments welcome.

 

 Johnny

[Troy Smith]

1 hour ago, The Spadgent said:

Did prototypes have weapons? If not that’s fine but I need to fill these ‘oles and not add the little pylons for the bombs.

Prototypes had all sorts of things, which is why they are prototypes.   No pylons are in your reference photo,  so I'd fill them, but they likely were set for underwing stores.

Aesthetically,  I'd say leave them off, as it will show off the aircraft lines better.    

Note the standard sized roundels I was going on about.       

Also, the just visible serial is small, probably 4 inch (so just under 2mm high in 1/48th)    as seen on the decals above, can you make Z1832... well the is 183 above.   I can't see on the photo, but it's likely

note, this

https://www.hlj.com/1-48-scale-fairey-firefly-mk-i-early-nf-2-azm06395

AZ kit has these decals, though, again, the roundel proportion are wrong.... and the serial  lettering look wrong style as well. 

note, to add to the decals sent by Chris,  either paint in the red roundel centre, or use one of these you have

 

Ah, I now note the Trumpeter sheet has "Royal navy Z1832"  decals which look OK.    You still need the fin flash, but that is a standard marking, available in many kits.

 

1 hour ago, The Spadgent said:

Well fully energised with some of this last night.

(The first new pint from Batham’s I have ever seen in all my years )

9.3%!!!!!  Not surprised.   I surprised you can see anything to today though.....   

 

HTH

T

  

[woody37]

All these little improvements are making a big difference, enjoying seeing it come together

 

[bigbadbadge]

Looking good Johnny and coming together well.  Great work. 

Chris

[giemme]

15 hours ago, woody37 said:

All these little improvements are making a big difference, enjoying seeing it come together

 

Agreed 100%!   

 

The nose vent looks the biz, IMO

 

Ciao 

[SafetyDad]

Johnny, would these be of any use to you?

 

 

Roy was selling them off at the Nationals some years back and I bought a few packs for Sea Furies etc.

Ironically, I don't have any Firefly kits!

 

Yours gratis. Drop me a PM if interested with your address

 

Enjoying your build - great problem-solving and painting skills

 

SD