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Hi,

  recently I hijacked the Javelin thread by Admiral Puff.  Rather than continue to do that I thought it a good idea to start my own thread.

why am I progressing my 3D modelling?  Well, I have the High Planes resin ‘rear end’ and reheat nozzles aftermarket set and, as many of you know, the nozzles are too big and cannot be angled inwards readily.  Using data from ‘the plastic surgeon’ I have used my limited skills to commence the design and creation of a more correct ‘rear end’.

  I will populate this thread with more information later (I am in the middle of a 24hr build on UAMF atm).

 

thanks for stopping by.

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I will add material in here that appeared in the hi-jacked post so you can see what I am aiming to achieve.

 

These are the CAD 3D designs I have been working on:

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I did have a couple of false starts using dimensions from the Warpaints 1/72 scale drawings and those of the High Planes conversion, they looked OK - until I found the measured dimensions from TPS who measured the engineless FAW9 at Gloucester.  I now have a 3D drawing that matches, as far as possible the actual dimensions with jet pipes and reheat nozzles that angle towards one another:

In this photo, versions of my printed parts are upper and bottom right, the High Planes conversion is bottom left and, lurking middle right, the Airfix nozzle.

Note that these are ‘pre correction’ using dimensions from the scale drawings.

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In this photo I have mounted my revised tail-end on an Airfix fuselage ( I’ve not trimmed the plastic back to the ‘line’ on the fuselage).

It compares the revision with the model rear end.

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The photo and looking at the actual join in the model/printed part I have a little more work to do.  Once I file back to the join line on the model ‘my’ printed part will be a little bit too narrow and the profile need a bit of revision to match that of the model.  I am hoping that modifying that end of the CAD 3D drawing will be reasonable straight forward.  
A photo posted, on the other thread, by Sloegin57 clearly shows that the  reheat nozzles pointed downwards as well as inwards.  Not absolutely sure how I design that but it will be incorporated.

I have 3 Airfix Javelins to build and the one area I dislike is the Airbrake representation.  Half an hours computer work and I created this:

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It doesn’t look like much, but it can be printed as a cut and replace unit - open/drooping/closed.

This is another view without the rear plate to see ‘day light’:

 

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spacer.pngReturning to the replacement rear fuselage.  The High Planes replacement is OK but their re-heat nozzles are way too large.

in this photo the High Planes part is top left.  My earlier iteration based on the Warplanes drawings is below it.  On the right hand side are 2 of my corrected prints that hold the jet-pipes/nozzles at the correct angle inwards.

I have placed one of my redesigned jet pipes/nozzles next to the High Planes version.  Note that ‘my’ printed parts are lacking details that, having noticed my error, have now been added.

 

I guess I could/should create re-heat nozzles that sit at the correct angle and ‘fit’ the High Planes conversion??

 

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11 minutes ago, TeeELL said:

spacer.pngReturning to the replacement rear fuselage.  The High Planes replacement is OK but their re-heat nozzles are way too large.

in this photo the High Planes part is top left.  My earlier iteration based on the Warplanes drawings is below it.  On the right hand side are 2 of my corrected prints that hold the jet-pipes/nozzles at the correct angle inwards.

I have placed one of my redesigned jet pipes/nozzles next to the High Planes version.  Note that ‘my’ printed parts are lacking details that, having noticed my error, have now been added.

 

I guess I could/should create re-heat nozzles that sit at the correct angle and ‘fit’ the High Planes conversion??

 

Can you tell me what is the diameter/length  of the re heat nozzles, I am at the moment converting the Frog offfering to a FAW 8 with a nose conversion I have, but I am not sure about the nozzles on this kit . It would be interesting to get an idea if they are too large or small.

 

Selwyn

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This is great work Tony. I have an old poorly built Javelin FAW9 that I was going to bin because so much of the kit needs fixing but I might hang onto it now and see where this goes.

Keep the updates coming.

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1 hour ago, Selwyn said:

Can you tell me what is the diameter/length  of the re heat nozzles, I am at the moment converting the Frog offfering to a FAW 8 with a nose conversion I have, but I am not sure about the nozzles on this kit . It would be interesting to get an idea if they are too large or small.

 

Selwyn

Do you have Modeldecal set #30 ? This contains some notes regarding converting the Frog kit from a -9 to an -8. Markings for 85 & 41 Sqns.
The jet outlets are not mentioned but the nose changes vis a vis the Frog error and the 8 & 9 corrections are. I’m guessing that Dick Ward thought the ‘pipes were acceptable.
 

 

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Hi Selwyn,

  standby!

OK.  The jet-pipe end of the nozzle exits from the aperture in the airframe of 880mm (see details in Admiral Puffs thread page 2, ‘the plastic surgeon’s’ entry).  So my jet pipes and nozzles are 12mm diameter.  The ‘ring’ is 12.2mm.  Length from the side where the ring touches the rear fuselage to end 8mm, the nozzles point inwards at 3deg and downwards 3deg, there are 27 ‘holes’ around the circumference with the bottom hole being on the centre-line.  I will endeavour to visit the Air Museum at Gloucester to absolutely verify the re-heat nozzle diameters although ‘theplasticsurgeon’, I believe, might be a volunteer there and be able to do some more detailed measuring as they do have a jet-pipe/re-heat nozzle.

 

Hope this helps?

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Hi,

  please dont take this the wrong way, this is all about the 1/72 Airfix FAW9 offering.  Any queries about the Frog, Novo etc kit needs to be addressed elsewhere, I have enough on my plate with Airfix!  :)   That said, general questions pertaining to Javelins: eg as asked by Selwyn, I can try to answer. 
If anything I do has any crossover with the Frog kit, that’s fine but I am not going to be creating anything specifically for that moulding.  (Although I do have one in my - ‘to dispose of’ box!).

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 Having mentioned that the rear fuselage part of the High Planes conversion looked pretty accurate, I though it would be a breeze to modify the CAD drawings to produce re-heat extensions with the 3deg cant inwards and 3deg cant downwards - wrong!  I need to sit and think about it as the 2 cuts don't work.  Creating the tunnel in the 3D rear fuselage will be easier.

 

one of my planned Javelin conversions is for a 29(F) Sqn FAW6, so I will be working on the other end of the model once I have sorted the rear.  I guess that means, with my printed parts, a FAW8 is a possibility!  Unfortunately that is not a mark of Javelin flown by ‘29.

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6 hours ago, TeeELL said:

Hi Selwyn,

  standby!

OK.  The jet-pipe end of the nozzle exits from the aperture in the airframe of 880mm (see details in Admiral Puffs thread page 2, ‘the plastic surgeon’s’ entry).  So my jet pipes and nozzles are 12mm diameter.  The ‘ring’ is 12.2mm.  Length from the side where the ring touches the rear fuselage to end 8mm, the nozzles point inwards at 3deg and downwards 3deg, there are 27 ‘holes’ around the circumference with the bottom hole being on the centre-line.  I will endeavour to visit the Air Museum at Gloucester to absolutely verify the re-heat nozzle diameters although ‘theplasticsurgeon’, I believe, might be a volunteer there and be able to do some more detailed measuring as they do have a jet-pipe/re-heat nozzle.

 

Hope this helps?

Interesting! the nozzles on my frog kit measure out at 12.5mm diameter and the length from the airframe is 8.5mm. so pretty close!

Unfortunately the nozzles on my kit will have to be remade as they are oval, (11.6.x12.5mm!) which probably accounts for the stray 0.5mm in the dimensions, but not a problem there, however there is no toe in or down apparent. 

 

Thanks for your time and effort on this.

 

Selwyn

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Selwyn,

  happy to send you some jet pipe/nozzles which you can trim and angle.  

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13 hours ago, Selwyn said:

Interesting! the nozzles on my frog kit measure out at 12.5mm diameter and the length from the airframe is 8.5mm. so pretty close!

Unfortunately the nozzles on my kit will have to be remade as they are oval, (11.6.x12.5mm!) which probably accounts for the stray 0.5mm in the dimensions, but not a problem there, however there is no toe in or down apparent. 

 

Thanks for your time and effort on this.

 

Selwyn

Selwyn,

  I have a set at 12.8 mm diameter and can print off a set at the ‘near as dammit’ correct diameter of 12 mm if you are interested.  

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1 minute ago, TeeELL said:

Selwyn,

  I have a set at 12.8 mm diameter and can print off a set at the ‘near as dammit’ correct diameter of 12 mm if you are interested.  

That would be great.  I was literally just trying to source some 12mm tube for this! i will PM you.

 

Selwyn

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An update that might interest those of you with the High Planes conversion and the Frog/Novo kits!  (And there’s me asking you not to include stuff about the Frog/Novo kit!!!  Ho hum).

after sleeping on it, I realised how to create the ‘cut’ to work in 2 planes.  Here are images of the Port and Starboard nozzles:

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And on the starboard side:

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Looking good. It might mean l can build a Javelin without the constricted rear.

 

Regards

Robert

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It has taken several (= lots) of false starts and a couple of hours of mental strain but I have finally managed to have the holes for the jet pipes set at 3 deg in AND 3 deg down - the latter really exercised the ‘little grey cells’!

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If the opportunity arises today I shall redesign the airbrakes to be rectangular I will also separate the 2 components so it is possible to see the options.  Standby!

Tomorrow, I will fire up the Elegoo and see how things print.

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There is a distinct downward curve where the fuselage drop to join the back plate.  I am trying to decide if it is ‘doable’ and worth attempting in this scale?  It appears to start around the mid point of the rudder, but it is quite subtle, do I really want to try and emulate that.

in fact, looking at other profile photos, it appears as though the fuselage, both upper and lower, curves towards the jet pipes, from a line approx the rudder mid point.  I will, at least see I I can measure the deflection.

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Space Ranger,

  there have been some enquiries through PMs, so it seems that the parts might be finding favour amongst the Javelinologists!  I would be very happy to makr the printed parts available, if they are deemed good enough!  I am not a commercial outfit, just a septuagenarian trying to stave off old age!

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Forgot to mention, I have sorted out the airbrakes - closed the laptop down so photos tomorrow probably including printed parts.

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Space Ranger,

  I see from your profile, one of your interests is V Bombers - I spent 5 years as a Vulcan driver!  (Escaped to Canberras then Phantoms and finally Hawks as an instructor - hence avatar).

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