Pink Spitfires

[224 Peter]

Has anyone ordered pre-ordered the forthcoming big Spitfire IXc? 

From the stories on the Airfix Blogs it looks like a "must have" for me. 

 

Although it isn't expected until late autumn I ordered a sheet of Xtradecal X24005 from Hannants because I was taken by MK915, a FR Mk IXc if 16 Squadron, in PRU Pink. 

I'll have to modify the radio hatch to include a camera window, but as far as I can tell, that is all. 

 

Thoughts, anyone? 

[noelh]

I think that's it. The only  argument is as to exact shade of pink. The late great Edgar Brooks held it was a pinkish off white rather  than a true pink. The well known photo of several pink Spitfires seems to back that up.

 

When I built a 1/72 pink Spitfire, it was very pink indeed.😗

 

I haven't ordered the new Spitfire  yet but I suspect I'll surrender to the inevitable and get one eventually.

Edited August 4, 2022 by noelh

[224 Peter]

My view, based on a bit of logic and no factt, is that it is the sort of pinky white seen when sunlight reflects off high clouds in the early evening... 

But I could be totally wrong! 

[Troy Smith]

4 hours ago, 224 Peter said:

My view, based on a bit of logic and no factt, is that it is the sort of pinky white seen when sunlight reflects off high clouds in the early evening... 

But I could be totally wrong! 

PRU Pink has been discussed on various occasions, there is even a period colour photo, taken on a captured German camera apparetly

Spitfire FR.IX by Etienne du Plessis, on Flickr

 

this is the paint sample

 

note how pale it is, and it's 'pinkness' is only really visible when placed on white paper.

 

HTH

[alt-92]

I believe MRP-190 is the only PRU Pink ready-made on the market that is pale enough to get away with (and it sprays really thin as well - added bonus).

 

[Graham Boak]

I agree about the paleness of the colour but it is fair to say that the photo above has been printed with a somewhat more intense pink.  Alfred Price's Spitfire Story, IIRC. The warning remains that any photo can vary remarkably when printed.

 

 

[Casey]

41 minutes ago, Troy Smith said:

this is the paint sample

Is this the real paint sample?

 

It does look to me a lot like mixture of ochre, white and tiny bit of black, which looks like this:

 

 

This is simple 1 part yellow ochre, 9 part white, 1 part bone black

 

It does have skin undertone.

 

 

[Troy Smith]

2 minutes ago, Casey said:

Is this the real paint sample?

it's a photo of the sample AFAIK, the right colour is PRU blue, which may help give you a reference to adjust too.    It is a photo taken indoors at an archive,  of sample card, posted more to show how pale the colour is.

 

41 minutes ago, Graham Boak said:

I agree about the paleness of the colour but it is fair to say that the photo above has been printed with a somewhat more intense pink.  Alfred Price's Spitfire Story, IIRC. The warning remains that any photo can vary remarkably when printed.

Indeed, and this was noted by Edgar, but the image above he said was reasonable reproduction.  (look at the cyclist face) 

 

Both posted to emphasise that PRU pink is really an 'off white' as opposed to 'pink' to allow @224 Peter  to get an idea of what the colour looks like from the two useful available bits of documentation available. 

[Casey]

52 minutes ago, Troy Smith said:

PRU blue, which may help give you a reference to adjust too. 

One point is not enough, I'd need a couple of more colors to get the proper reference. I mean, I can *try* but it will be bit of a wild shot.

 

I'd need something like that on same photo to do precise color calibration:

The color values are very precisely known on that calibration device:

 

 

 

... but this thing costs 350$ itself...

 

Eh. One can dream right?

[Casey]

BUT I got this on our own forum:

 

On 11/21/2009 at 8:10 AM, Nick Millman said:

PRU Special Pink is a definite pink and is reported by Thomas to be equivalent to 453 Shell Pink in BS 381C. The "off-white" appearance was probably the UV exposed paint surface. The FS equivalent is reported to be 31668 but I have not verified that. These days we would probably describe the colour as "Magnolia"! As Edgar has noted the appearance as applied was probably also affected by how well - or not - the paint had been stirred.

A word of warning, Thomas and BS 381C give different approximate Munsell values, 5.5 RP 8/2.5 and 4.9 R 8.0/2.6 respectively. Those are different hues. I haven't compared them though and bearing in mind the usual response to such precision probably won't bother to do the maths.

 

Let me get my BS 381C

[Casey]

... which scans to this:

 

 

My real sample seems to be tiny bit different, more 7R 8.0/1.3, but please remember those samples are >25yo.

[Casey]

35 minutes ago, Casey said:

(Quote Nick): "FS equivalent is reported to be 31668"

1957 FS 31668 is very close to BS 381C 453 "Shell Pink" indeed. It's DE is 3.2.

2016 AMS-STD-595A is 5.0 DE from BS 381C 453. More closer match there is 31669 (DE 4.1)

Edited August 5, 2022 by Casey

[Ed Russell]

32 minutes ago, Casey said:

this:

This looks too pink to me although I suppose it is different on every computer monitor. Looking at the above photo, although it is bright sunlight and might wash the colours out a bit, the cyclist's face, the stripes, the propeller tips and the roundels are in believable colours. Therefore, while the picture may not be completely balanced, it can't be too far off. This accords with Edgar Brooks' obsevations of a real colour swatch, as mentioned on BM many times, where he found it to be only recognisable as pink if it was put against a white sample.

[224 Peter]

What a minefield! 

If the photo was taken on a German camera using german colour film, probably made by AGFA, it has a stronger colour balance than if taken using early Kodachrome. 

A mixed pink with a significant white base will fade quite rapidly in UV light, reds were (and still are) notorious for fading and losing depth of colour. 

 

The colour swatch from @Casey is remarkably close to the Xtracolour painting guide...

 

We have quite some time to debate this before the kit appears!

[Phoenix44]

I don't see a lot that's "normal" in that colour photo. The chap's face looks a bit strange, the prop tips look very drab and the sky has a lavender tinge (on thd original site). What I'm guessing is grass is who knows what colour! Similarly the trees are not typical summer green either.

 

Frankly I would be utterly amazed if a reproduction of a reproduction of a reproduction...of a photo taken over 70 years ago (and who knows how well it was printed then), is a reasonable source for a subtle pink shade. Now perhaps the reproduction on Etiennes site is a good one of an original slide or print that was well-developed/printed but even then it's a digital scan of a 70 year old photo. At worse it's several poor iterations from a poor original. It's really quite grainy so I'm guessing this is some distance from the original and may be a copy from a magazine of book?

[occa]

I once read that it was a mixture of white with a few percent (4% if I am not wrong) of wartime roundel red,
That explains the grayish pink tone, well to me at least

[Ed Russell]

1 hour ago, Phoenix44 said:

I don't see a lot that's "normal" in that colour photo.

Possibly your monitor needs calibration. Mine was done with a specific ICC profile using a colorimeter.

I think the evidence of the colour swatch is more important than the picture.

[Phoenix44]

12 hours ago, Ed Russell said:

Possibly your monitor needs calibration. Mine was done with a specific ICC profile using a colorimeter.

I think the evidence of the colour swatch is more important than the picture.

Oddly many other photos look perfectly fine on my monitor. But maybe it was acting up just for that photo.

[Ed Russell]

13 minutes ago, Phoenix44 said:

But maybe it was acting up just for that photo.

That's very unlikely. However not every photo will be affected by monitor calibration - many photos I have look the same on another (unclibrated) monitor. It's hard to tell whether a photo, especially one like that, is "normal" or not. I still think the best evidence of the colour is Edgar Brooks' description of the colour swatch.

[Bruce Archer]

I was forced to make my own PRU Pink as there are no shades which, to my eye, replicate the color. Take your favorite insignia white, thoroughly mix it. Then take your favorite red, completely mixed, and add the red to the white drop by drop, mixing between drops. When the color turns, and you will see it turn, that is the color PRU Pink. It is a extreamly pale off white with a slight pinkish tinge.

 

Bruce

[Chuck1945]

I have a PRU Pink color chip via Edgar from several years ago. What Ed and Bruce suggest is good. The mix needs to look like white with a pinkish cast viewed next to white. If it looks pinkish on its own, you’ve probably added too much red.

[224 Peter]

I will get my BIG Spitfire tomorrow.... according to DHL and Airfix!