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Snobbery and greed in hobbies.


RobL
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13 hours ago, Bertie Psmith said:

Vallejo paints are perfumed and smell really pleasant. I think this is a brilliant marketing ploy which diverts mums and wives from complaining about our stinks.

They *DO* smell nice. Kind of like Pledge aka Klear smells nice too :D

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1 hour ago, masterKamera said:

the scent chemicals are toxic.  

 

Worse if your allergic to chemical scents.. 

 

What is your evidence for that please?

 

Vallejo manufacturein the highly regulated EU and have this to say. 
 

https://acrylicosvallejo.com/en/safety/

 

I have no connection with them apart from owning a couple of hundred bottles of their paint which I like. 
 
 

 

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On 06/07/2022 at 16:28, Bertie Psmith said:

 

I remember making the mistake of buying the wrong glue in my childish haste and ignorance. Balsa wood cement ain't the same stuff, I soon discovered.

 

At least I was able to build the kit twice, once with the balsa cement and then, when it fell to pieces with the proper stuff.

In the early days of my modelling I built some models using PVA woodworkers glue. It worked out ok.

 

Copydex no longer smells like fish. I use a lot of it my leatherwork. No fishy smell. I miss that

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42 minutes ago, Black Knight said:

Copydex no longer smells like fish.

 

True! I was disappointed too.

 

The ammonia smell of rotting fish. It's odd how we miss that pungent, breath catching pong when you think about it. 😁

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On 7/2/2022 at 7:32 AM, Bertie Psmith said:

be careful about wishing competitive behaviour away, it made our world. 
 

It also killed many millions of innocent people in pointless, horrifying wars, often largely created to satisfy the egos of feckless politicians. Now I'm going to go and look up the definition of "feckless", as my memory is a little hazy on that one...

 

Chris.   

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Changing the subject a bit (something that hardly ever happens in this thread) is this a case of snobbery in the hobby?

 

I used to make I/48 aircraft.

y4m_OUu_CSWcNx_VSikgrKZrS1Kazmzs06lwFIpp

 

Since returning to the hobby in my forties that was all I did. With some breaks and the off diversion just for fun. I think I built them all, pretty much! But I got bored with it and each one was less fun than the previous. Then I was starting but not finishing them...

 

y4m-yd345YY-doxWcUncU871NToYwvnIDYvcWZ3t 

 

So I switched to 1/35 tanks. Much more interesting to me because of the weathering, diorama possibilities, figures etc. This was working reasonably well for a while but again I was soon starting more than I was finishing. Mojo failing.

 

 y4maR6LMb8c-KN_8ilpY2hwCnTyJFFwvd862Vy2q

 

So I built one of these. It's all wood, string brass and cloth. Pretty much the same building methods as used in the 1920s (I have a book on the hobby from then) and almost the same as used in the 18 century! They take ages to make, look beautiful (even to non-hobbyists) and the sense of satisfaction I got from using my crude woodworking skills was unlike anything I've ever felt before with a model. Well, not since I was eight anyway. 😄 I look at my plastic kits now and think, "What's the point even trying? I haven't got time to waste on stuff that I don't like anymore and there's a boat waiting!" 

 

 

I've only done this one so far, there's another on the bench and one in the wardrobe. The one in the wardrobe is a top line kit of a British Ship of the Line from Nelson's time, in fact it was one of his ships. The kit is equivalent to the best of Wingnut Wings and looking at build threads it often takes people three to five years to build them. It cost me my year's normal budget on plastic kits. And being a tool and gadget freak, I have spent a bit on shiny new implements too.

 

Now, in your various opinions, does this make me a modelling snob? Does it make me a greedy person?

 

If so, why? And if not, why not?

 

 

 

Edited by Bertie Psmith
apostrophe catastrophe
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12 minutes ago, spruecutter96 said:

It also killed many millions of innocent people in pointless, horrifying wars, often largely created to satisfy the egos of feckless politicians. Now I'm going to go and look up the definition of "feckless", as my memory is a little hazy on that one...

 

Chris.   

 

Nah, it was co-operation that did that. Not even Hitler could fight a war on his own. All a competitive individual can manage at their worst is a bit of serial killin' 😂 

 

Competitiveness among peers made Edison invent a better lightbulb, some bakers invent sliced bread, some politicians invent democracy...

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2 minutes ago, Bertie Psmith said:

 

Well, we make it to page five. YouTube would be there in an hour. 😆

Considering my interests in WW2 airplanes I am getting that on frontpage regularly....

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17 minutes ago, Casey said:

Considering my interests in WW2 airplanes I am getting that on frontpage regularly....

 

Have you had the discussion about the moral implications of modelling Axis machines, particularly the Luft '46 sub genre? That always makes a few people call for their huffs and depart in them. 😁

 

(I decline to mention my own views on the subject. 😆)

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30 minutes ago, Bertie Psmith said:

looking at build threads it often takes people three to five years to build them. It cost me my year's normal budget on plastic kits. And being a tool and gadget freak, I have spent a bit on shiny new implements too.

 

Now, in your various opinions, does this make me a modelling snob? Does it make me a greedy person?

By my calculation, if it takes you 5 years to build a model costing 1 year of plastic, it makes you a miser 😄

 

I think there can be an element of snobbery when it comes to scratch builders, wood builders etc compared to plastic kit builders - there is a tendency to equate time and effort required to some sort of superiority. However, that ignores the fact the people engage in the hobby for different reasons. For example, if the purpose is to build a large collection of, say, British civil aircraft, then opting for difficult or long term builds would be counter-productive. Conversely if the goal is to build the ultimate representation of a Spitfire, different criteria apply. Neither is inherently better or worse.

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17 hours ago, Bertie Psmith said:


That’s not true. Vallejo paints are so non-toxic they see more or less edible. 😁

 

Well, that gives them one possible use. Anything else? 

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On 7/8/2022 at 10:33 AM, Rob G said:

 

Well, that gives them one possible use. Anything else? 

 

Ha ha.  😆 OK I'll admit they aren't accurate or consistent and very occasionally they split like sour milk, and will not remix. Nor can you mix the earth colours with any predictability. Spraying them? Well, they smell nice when you spray them but that's about all I've managed to achieve.

 

However, they're widely available, they don't spill like, or cost as much as, Citadel. They don't dry up (I've had bottles in use for 15 years) You can wipe them up easily, and clean them from clothes most of the time. Some of the Game colors are astonishingly bright and unusual. They brush really well onto any primer (except their own, their primer being utter pants for me). They thin down to almost water before they fall to chemical pieces. You can blend them, glaze them, wash them, drybrush them, layer them. Brilliant for figures!

 

You can give them to anyone to play with knowing that they are safe, they encourage youngsters into the hobby, you can point and clean your brushes with your lips (ain't killed me yet anyway).

 

It's a horses for courses thing. I'm not saying that they are better overall than other brands, but they aren't so bad that I would avoid them. It just depends what you want your paint to do for you.

 

Of course, for the benefit of the Heath and Safety challenged, they are not really edible and like all paint, should not be ingested. I was using literary hyperbole above to make a point. In fact they lack many essential vitamins and minerals... 🤪

 

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1 hour ago, ckw said:

...Neither is inherently better or worse... [my emphasis]

 

That's the nub of the issue I think. 'Inherently' these things we are rambling on about have no absolute value. A Ferrari is worthless off road for example.

 

Value is something we place on them as complicated individuals in astonishingly differing circumstances. Whatever we may value or despise perhaps shouldn't really matter to anyone else. The nastiness arises when we place our values, unasked, on the possessions, habits and beliefs of other people. That's when we start using loaded judgemental words like 'snob', 'greedy' and so on. 

 

I say live and let live. Count your own riches (or rivets), I don't care for your opinion on mine. (Unless I post them on a thread like this which is me asking to hear them. 🤔)

 

 

 

 

 

p.s. I like how Britmodellers almost always handle these philosophical debates while maintaining good humour and manners. We should be proud of ourselves

 

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2 hours ago, Bertie Psmith said:

. . .

However, they're widely available, . . . .   or cost as much as, Citadel. 

. . .

Vallejo paint prices are on par with Citadel here

 

next week I'll be a rivet counter. I'm expecting an order and I'll have to count them

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49 minutes ago, Black Knight said:

Vallejo paint prices are on par with Citadel here

 

next week I'll be a rivet counter. I'm expecting an order and I'll have to count them

 

I've just ordered some rivet nuts (captive nuts) I don't know whether I have to count them or just say "Nuts!"

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6 hours ago, Bertie Psmith said:

 

Have you had the discussion about the moral implications of modelling Axis machines, particularly the Luft '46 sub genre? That always makes a few people call for their huffs and depart in them. 😁

 

(I decline to mention my own views on the subject. 😆)

 

Those-who-dont-know-history__quotes-by-E

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2 hours ago, Bertie Psmith said:

 

I've just ordered some rivet nuts (captive nuts) I don't know whether I have to count them or just say "Nuts!"

Why not do the right thing with captive nuts.

 

Release them back to the wild.👍

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35 minutes ago, jenko said:

Why not do the right thing with captive nuts.

 

Release them back to the wild.👍

 

Brilliant.

 

There's another joke in there somewhere about how my ex-wife held onto all the money, but I'll leave you to write that one too. 😁

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This thread has dipped into two topics that the participants know it shouldn't, so here's your warning.  No politics, and can you quit the double-entre please?  mind you, it's so on the nose it's barely 1.5 entendre. :dull:

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On 7/8/2022 at 5:26 PM, jenko said:

Why not do the right thing with captive nuts.

 

Release them back to the wild.👍

But will they know how to fend for themselves? How to forage in the forest? Somehow, I doubt it...

 

Chris. 

Edited by spruecutter96
Correcting a typo.
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