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1/48 Corsair II, 1836 NAS, HMS Victorious, 1945. Finished 16/08.


DaveJL

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Hello all,

 

Here is my entry for this GB - Tamiya's 1/48 F4U-1D Corsair, marked as a Corsair II, JT410 of 1836 Naval Air Squadron, flying off HMS Victorious in 1945. The pilot, Lt Don Sheppard, RCNVR became the only FAA Corsair ace during the Second World War and was also involved in the first attack on the Tirpitz in 1944. He was awarded a DSC in March 1945 and served in the Royal Canadian Navy through the 1950s and 60s before retiring after a stint at NATO HQ in 1974. He passed away in 2018.

 

Kit:

 

52170450430_a7900481f6_b.jpg

52170217744_54a2d8c844_b.jpg

 

Extras:

 

52169972426_bc1601d514_b.jpg

 

I'll be using Eduard etch and mask, MDC FAA Corsair conversion set along with Ultracast exhausts, seat (although there is one included in the MDC set) and Sky decals. Saying that, the decals show, I'm fairly certain, an incorrect paint scheme for this machine:

 

52168951377_3452a2660f_b.jpg

 

'Grey' and 'white' 🧐 I'm fairly sure this machine was painted the DSG or EDSG, Dark Slate Grey and sky undersides? I also know there's some modifications to do for an FAA machine - clip the wingtips, fill a foot hold in the flaps. Anything else that those in the know could point out?

 

Cheers and stay safe

 

Dave

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Yes EDSG/Slate Grey, over sky if memory is correct ? I have a similar set of decals. 

5 hours ago, DaveJL said:

Anything else that those in the know could point out?

Vents each side of fuselage and one on the belly. I’ll see if I can find photo’s. 
 

tpCtu6p.jpg


Firgot to circle these ⬆️ But you can see the starboard and belly vent. 

FX1k4aD.jpg

 

JSZQpMI.jpg


Dennis

 

Oh there were three different tips on RN FAA Corsairs. Standard, short, and short short

Edited by Corsairfoxfouruncle
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I'm sure I've read here somewhere that Vought (unlike, say, Grumman) didn't use colour matched EDSG/DSG/sky; rather their own closest equivalents. Having waded in there, I'll then proceed to say, I know nothing about which colours, which other manufacturers of the FAA-bound corsairs used and indeed whether it was worth flagging this at all! 😝

 

Good luck with this, I'm looking forward to it.

 

Aside, what were those vents? Also did FAA corsairs mount rockets (in which case the kit ones are probably incorrect)?

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33 minutes ago, Ngantek said:

I'm sure I've read here somewhere that Vought (unlike, say, Grumman) didn't use colour matched EDSG/DSG/sky; rather their own closest equivalents. Having waded in there, I'll then proceed to say, I know nothing about which colours, which other manufacturers of the FAA-bound corsairs used and indeed whether it was worth flagging this at all! 😝

 

Good luck with this, I'm looking forward to it.

 

Aside, what were those vents? Also did FAA corsairs mount rockets (in which case the kit ones are probably incorrect)?

Yes they used a different manufacturer for paints. I have Tamiya & Gunze Mixes that Ive used before if interested ? The bents were for venting exhaust gases that collected in the fuselage. Im not aware of rocket use in the war but they were capable ? Not sure I can post this photo so a link.

 

 https://i.imgur.com/NDHfzdB.jpg

 

Dennis

Edited by Corsairfoxfouruncle
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Vought used “Equivalent” colours.  I think the colours were:-  Olive Drab, Dark Sea Grey & Sky Grey (Not the Sky Light green we know)

 

There are a couple of threads on Britmodeller worth taking a look at.  

 

Here is one...  Great research by @JackG..

 

 

BTW I was going to do this same aircraft.  - I’ll go and find something different (maybe rebuild Hellcat JX772/X119..

Edited by Grey Beema
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Thanks all, I'm looking forward to it. Will go nicely with my Hellcat I built last year:

 

 

14 hours ago, Black Knight said:

'Sky' decals are not known for their accuracy, in fact they are known for their inaccuracies 

 

Good to know! I'd used some of their decals before for a Hurricane and thought they were a bit 'iffy'!

 

 

13 hours ago, Corsairfoxfouruncle said:

Yes EDSG/Slate Grey, over sky if memory is correct ? I have a similar set of decals. 

Vents each side of fuselage and one on the belly. I’ll see if I can find photo’s. 
 

tpCtu6p.jpg


Firgot to circle these ⬆️ But you can see the starboard and belly vent. 

FX1k4aD.jpg

 

JSZQpMI.jpg


Dennis

 

Oh there were three different tips on RN FAA Corsairs. Standard, short, and short short

 

Thanks Dennis. I'll be sure to add the vents.

 

5 hours ago, Grey Beema said:

Vought used “Equivalent” colours.  I think the colours were:-  Olive Drab, Dark Sea Grey & Sky Grey (Not the Sky Light green we know)

 

There are a couple of threads on Britmodeller worth taking a look at.  

 

Here is one...  Great research by @JackG..

 

 

BTW I was going to do this same aircraft.  - I’ll go and find something different (maybe rebuild Hellcat JX772/X119..

Thanks for the info! I had stumbled on @JackG's post along with a few others which I've all bookmarked. Re the sky, is it more of a grey? I've seen several built up and looks like the sky that I'd associate with RAF/FAA machines. Please don't feel that you should build another model! The more Corsairs the merrier!

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You will have to compare your kit to this 1/72 review to see if the fixes are required (and if you deem worthwhile).

http://kits.kitreview.com/tamiya60774reviewdf_1.htm

 

The 'fix it' list I have saved:

1. Fill the small notch in the rear edge of the inter-cooler door.*
2. Do not install part B40, the drop tank or bomb rack. Fill in the resulting  notch in forward fuselage. DO Install if for drop tank.*
3. Fabricate a cover for the backfire valves. as all details should be flush.
4. Remove fairings on the tail wheel gear doors.
5. Fill in the cut out in the upper forward fuselage behind the engine cowling. This replaces the dead cowl flaps.
6. Remove the small air inlet on the right forward fuselage as shown on the instruction sheet.
7. Delete forward antenna mast. Fill in resulting opening. - circular hole
8. bulk head behind seat - shave down

9.  clipped wings

 

additional notes,

1.&2. I'm not so sure about the need to deal with those two holes,  Having read excerpts of  Don Sheppard's and surrounding events, his missions involved the use of bombs and sometimes an auxiliary fuel tank.

 

9.  additional info from Dana Bell - In February 1944 the refit with short wingtips began; short short tips were introduced that April.  If you've got a good photo, you'll know which tip to use.

 

One other thing is the bombing window located on the underbelly.   According to Dana Bell, after serial no. JT425 this was deleted from production.   So if production was sequential, then JT410 would still have it.

 

-------------

 

Colours, yes the Temperate Sea Scheme in American paints.  Incidentally, when delivered these Corsairs also had European style national markings, also in American paints.   Not sure if the carriers had on board  their own paints when markings were altered for Pacific theater, or were supplied with American sourced paint?   Anyhow, per Dana Bell, the aircraft paints were enamel (as opposed to duPpont's lacquer).  Am still not sure what to suggest in terms of hobby paints because the document that Dana quotes has American paint names and the duPpont numbers combined.  It could be just a simple matching of the duP paints, though the well known chart does not include 71-028.

 

Army Dark Olive Drab duPont 1071-028   

Sea Gray duPont 71-19324                      
Sky duPont 71-021      
             

 

regards,

Jack

Edited by JackG
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2 hours ago, Stephen said:

Cheers Stephen, duly added to my reference lists.

1 hour ago, JackG said:

You will have to compare your kit to this 1/72 review to see if the fixes are required (and if you deem worthwhile).

http://kits.kitreview.com/tamiya60774reviewdf_1.htm

 

The 'fix it' list I have saved:

1. Fill the small notch in the rear edge of the inter-cooler door.*
2. Do not install part B40, the drop tank or bomb rack. Fill in the resulting  notch in forward fuselage. DO Install if for drop tank.*
3. Fabricate a cover for the backfire valves. as all details should be flush.
4. Remove fairings on the tail wheel gear doors.
5. Fill in the cut out in the upper forward fuselage behind the engine cowling. This replaces the dead cowl flaps.
6. Remove the small air inlet on the right forward fuselage as shown on the instruction sheet.
7. Delete forward antenna mast. Fill in resulting opening. - circular hole
8. bulk head behind seat - shave down

9.  clipped wings

 

additional notes,

1.&2. I'm not so sure about the need to deal with those two holes,  Having read excerpts of  Don Sheppard's and surrounding events, his missions involved the use of bombs and sometimes an auxiliary fuel tank.

 

9.  additional info from Dana Bell - In February 1944 the refit with short wingtips began; short short tips were introduced that April.  If you've got a good photo, you'll know which tip to use.

 

One other thing is the bombing window located on the underbelly.   According to Dana Bell, after serial no. JT425 this was deleted from production.   So if production was sequential, then JT410 would still have it.

 

-------------

 

Colours, yes the Temperate Sea Scheme in American paints.  Incidentally, when delivered these Corsairs also had European style national markings, also in American paints.   Not sure if the carriers had on board  their own paints when markings were altered for Pacific theater, or were supplied with American sourced paint?   Anyhow, per Dana Bell, the aircraft paints were enamel (as opposed to Dupont's lacquer).  Am still not sure what to suggest in terms of hobby paints because the document that Dana quotes has American paint names and the Dupont numbers combined.  It could be just a simple matching of the Dupont paints, though the well known chart does not include 71-028.

 

Army Dark Olive Drab duPont 1071-028   

Sea Gray duPont 71-19324                      
Sky duPont 71-021      
             

 

regards,

Jack

Great info, thanks Jack. I'll probably need more help along the way as I've no idea what some of those bits that need corrected are!

 

As for the paints, I've looked through some references and think I can closely match the green and sea grey to the my preferred MRP range - Olive drab and Extra Dark sea Grey, which as it turns out, is the incorrect shade for EDSG but looks like it could work for the Corsair. As for the sky, I've seen a couple of close matches, one of which being FS35622 'light blue', which looks more like a grey/cream and the other being FS36622 'Light Grey'. Bit of a minefield for me on a topic I've no clue about so all the help is greatly appreciated!

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Sky, yes FS35622 has been quoted as Nick Millman's closest match from a thread entitled  Best match for Du Pont 71-021?  

 

EDSG , Sea Grey is also associated with ANA 603 and an FS value of 36118.  In one of Dana Bell's post, he has the duPont colour EDSG was essentially renamed 'Sea Grey' for the ANA paints.

 

DSG  - duPont 1071-028 - Dana Bell believes this was just the number assigned to Dark Olive Drab '41.  Sometimes ANA 613 is inserted here, but here is a recent discussion about this olive colour:

 

 

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29 minutes ago, JackG said:

Sky, yes FS35622 has been quoted as Nick Millman's closest match from a thread entitled  Best match for Du Pont 71-021?  

 

EDSG , Sea Grey is also associated with ANA 603 and an FS value of 36118.  In one of Dana Bell's post, he has the duPont colour EDSG was essentially renamed 'Sea Grey' for the ANA paints.

 

DSG  - duPont 1071-028 - Dana Bell believes this was just the number assigned to Dark Olive Drab '41.  Sometimes ANA 613 is inserted here, but here is a recent discussion about this olive colour:

 

 

 

Official standards of Dark OD 41 and ANA613 are not similar at all besides the fact they are a kind of olive drab of course.
Dark OD 41 was assumed to be equivalent to/ usable as Dark Green (not exactly a match).

But I am a bit confused here and haven't touched this theme.
EDSG =  Extra Dark Sea Grey or Extra Dark Sea Green?
DSG = Dark Sea Grey or Dark Slate Grey or Dark Sea Green?

You see that's why numbers are invented :D 


rYQAdvp.jpg

Edited by Steben
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@STEBEN  yes, as Dana Bell points out in that last link posted on olive drab discussion,  ANA613 was lighter than OD 41.  Unfortunately the quoted FS value 34087 comes up as an error on the colorserver site.

 

Understood about the confusion using acronyms instead of the full paint names, but since the discussion is about the British Temperate Sea Scheme, (and unless I'm misinformed), there were only three main official colors during this period:

 

- Extra Dark Sea grey

- Dark Slate grey

- Sky Type S

 

regards,

Jack

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Not all American paints chosen for British Lend Lease equipment were mandated to be equivalents.  In the case of "Dark Slate Grey is definitely not DOD41' that olive was considered as an acceptable substitute.

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17 hours ago, JackG said:

Sky, yes FS35622 has been quoted as Nick Millman's closest match from a thread entitled  Best match for Du Pont 71-021?  

 

EDSG , Sea Grey is also associated with ANA 603 and an FS value of 36118.  In one of Dana Bell's post, he has the duPont colour EDSG was essentially renamed 'Sea Grey' for the ANA paints.

 

DSG  - duPont 1071-028 - Dana Bell believes this was just the number assigned to Dark Olive Drab '41.  Sometimes ANA 613 is inserted here, but here is a recent discussion about this olive colour:

 

 

Thanks Jack, I've plenty of FS36118 so can have a bit of trial and error testing. I've several shades of Olive Drab, MRP do a specific USAAF one so I'll try that first.

 

16 hours ago, Corsairfoxfouruncle said:

Its more grey but does at least to my eyes have a hint of green cast to it ? 

I thought the same Dennis, looks like I've a close match in MRP - FS35622.

3 hours ago, Beazer said:

I am intently following this one,  wanted to do the exact same machine in the future.

I hope it's of some use to you!

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  • DaveJL changed the title to 1/48 Corsair II, 1836 NAS, HMS Victorious, 1945. Update 05/07.

A brief start made on this one. I'm still getting my head around all the bits and pieces I need to do! First up, I sanded back the moulded detail on the cockpit sides and fitted the MDC resin parts:

 

52196543015_9b3c25e8a5_b.jpg

52196071438_cffdb846d4_b.jpg

 

Nice detail here. @JackG you'd mentioned shaving down the bulkhead behind the seat. Forgive my ignorance but could you advise me as to the correct layout here?

 

52196071283_81c3aafbbe_b.jpg

 

Seat sits neatly:

 

52196543875_c9ffab6eba_b.jpg

 

Another couple of questions; with wings extended, would the flaps have been retracted or deployed and do the circled the holes on both flaps need filled in?

 

52196544055_590447fb8f_b.jpg

 

I moved on and had a look at the fuel tank. I wasn't sure what way this was positioned but then I found the below picture from another thread, which I can no longer find now :lol:

 

52196545035_7d57157837_c.jpg

 

There's a locating hole for part B40 just aft of the cowling and another hole which can be drilled just aft of the intercooler door. Fits perfectly:

 

52196543275_d30fc7a67d_b.jpg

 

Not much but a start is a start. I did also find this great video of the BPF during 1945. Some great shots of the Corsairs. I've noticed that the mast antenna aft of the canopy appears to be absent on the majority of FAA Corsairs. Typical that I've already cut out the notch on the kit for it!

 

 

More soon and stay safe

 

Dave

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1 hour ago, zebra said:

Off to a good start. Those MDC bits look nice.

Thanks mate. The resin is nicely detailed but the parts other than the tank are a bit fragile!

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3 hours ago, DaveJL said:

Another couple of questions; with wings extended, would the flaps have been retracted or deployed and do the circled the holes on both flaps need filled in?

Extended flaps fill the foot step in as its from a later model. 

 

3 hours ago, DaveJL said:

I moved on and had a look at the fuel tank. I wasn't sure what way this was positioned but then I found the below picture from another thread, which I can no longer find now

I can find photo’s for you if you need but thats got the tank covered. Antenna’s changed and are often hard to decipher. Im pretty sure I can get you drawings showing antenna mounting locations. Depending If its only a wire, standard, or whip mount

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3 minutes ago, Corsairfoxfouruncle said:

Extended flaps fill the foot step in as its from a later model. 

 

I can find photo’s for you if you need but thats got the tank covered. Antenna’s changed and are often hard to decipher. Im pretty sure I can get you drawings showing antenna mounting locations. Depending If its only a wire, standard, or whip mount

Thanks Dennis!

 

I think I've the tank sorted, if you had any info on the antenna that would be great! I'm also looking through references to see what size the upper roundels were. I've leftovers from the Eduard FAA Hellcat so should have some suitable ones there. The Skys decal sheet doesn't show what roundel is for the upper wing. As @Black Knight says, they don't appear to be the most accurate decals out there 😐

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