USN's WW2 largest flying boats

[72modeler]

Jut got through watching both of these films, and I thought some of you would find them of interest. If you ever have the opportunity to fly a PBM, the film will show you how it's done! The Mars was the largest WW2 airplane, IIRC. The two surviving JRM's have been retired after many years of service as fire bombers; one will going to the National Museum of  Naval Aviation at Pensacola, FL, and has been repainted in the overall glossy sea blue camouflage it wore in service. The other example is up for sale.Both films via YouTube.

Mike

 

https://youtu.be/YCKLuBi9C1E

 

https://youtu.be/mAQCCKB6p7A

 

 

 

   

[Chris Preston]

Hi Mike,

 

The two surviving Martin Mars are right here on Vancouver Island, north of Victoria, BC, on Sprout Lake. I last saw one of them demonstrating it's fire-fighting water-dropping capability at a display during the Vancouver Winter Olympics in 2010 - very impressive. These aircraft will be missed here once they're gone.

 

Chris Preston

Victoria, BC,

Canada

[fubar57]

Back in the last century, '84 it was, I was fighting a forest fire on the B.C. coast. The Mars came in and dropped its load. The sight was awesome to say the least

[G.R.Morrison]

My father spent a lot of hours in P-aircraft (PV, PBY, PB4Y1, PBM), and his LEAST favorite was the PBM: "Too much airplane for only two motors."  If you lost an engine, it just didn't want to stay in the air.  During one night-time takeoff, they struck an unlit buoy, which tore a large gash along the fuselage, and the beast pulled to one side and immediately sank, with a wingtip sticking out of the water (upon which they gathered).  Fortunately a radar operator noticed they weren't appearing on-screen, and a boat came out to look.  He declared his leather jacket lost, it (much) later became my first motorcycle jacket.  It still had "U.S.N." painted under the fur collar = "Uncle Sam's Nephew."

I think the biggest 'boat' he ever saw was a Coronado.  He liked the Lockheeds for their speed (they had one they took down to bare metal with steel wool, then 'Simonized' - waxed - it); the PB4Y1 (the U.S.Navy's "Liberator") for its long legs (and four engines).  Theirs was named, "Mrs. Frequently" 😉 

But the PBY was his favorite -- reliable but never fast ("Climb, cruise, dive -- eighty knots."), comfortable-enough to catch some shut-eye on a long patrol.

Something to realize about the flying boats, the water is HARD on landing, and you always had to check for pulled or popped rivets / leaks.

 

GRM

 

"Ich bin kein 'Experte' - nur Historiker."

[JWM]

16 hours ago, 72modeler said:

The Mars was the largest WW2 airplane,

The question is what parameter we consider critical for such classification. Actually there were three such large flying boats, all only prototypes during WW2. Besides Martin Mars (wings 61 m, fuselage 35.7 m, max weight 74 t) it was Latecore 631 (wings 57.4 m, fuselage 43.5 m, weight 71 t) and Blohm & Voss 238 (wings 60.3 m, fuselage 43.4m, weight 94 t)  [all data from Wiki, rounded to single digit after decimal dot].  The Mars has the longest wingspan, but the shortest fuselage and intermediate mass.... ). Latecore was having the longest fuselage and BV was the heaviest and almost the same long as Late and the same span wings like Mars... So perhaps ther BV 238 was the largest  Anyway - Mars was really huge as for WW2 standards. Still I did not bought the kit for that reason...(also due to price of the A-model kit)...

 

Regards

J-W

 

[Graham Boak]

Wasn't the Hughes Hercules intended for the USN?

[KRK4m]

3 hours ago, JWM said:

Actually there were three such large flying boats, all only prototypes during WW2. Besides Martin Mars (wings 61 m, fuselage 35.7 m, max weight 74 t) it was Latecore 631 (wings 57.4 m, fuselage 43.5 m, weight 71 t) and Blohm & Voss 238 (wings 60.3 m, fuselage 43.4m, weight 94 t)... 

The Mars has the longest wingspan, but the shortest fuselage and intermediate weight). Latecore was having the longest fuselage and BV was the heaviest and almost the same long as Late and the same span wings like Mars... So perhaps ther BV 238 was the largest  Anyway - Mars was really huge as for WW2 standards.

Frankly speaking there were four of them - you forgot about the LeO H-49 (a.k.a. SE-200 Amphitrite): span - 52.2m, lenght - 40.2m, MTOW - 72 tons.

Nevertheless you're right - the BV 238 should be considered the largest of them all.

Cheers

Michael

Edited March 26, 2022 by KRK4m

[JWM]

1 hour ago, Graham Boak said:

Wasn't the Hughes Hercules intended for the USN?

Was, but it was finished after ww2, afair.

[Graham Boak]

As were a number of WW2-period types.

[JWM]

1 hour ago, KRK4m said:

you forgot about the LeO-49 (a.k.a. SE-200 Amphitrite):

I did not forget, I never knew about it

J-W

[RJP]

My father was a district manager with MacMillan Bloedel Limited, one of the forestry companies that invested in Forest Industries Flying Tankers, the company that brought the four surviving Mars to Canada in the early 1960s.  Dad got hold of publicity and informational films produced by the company for showing to community groups about forest management and there was one strictly about the Mars.  A real eye-opener for a bunch of kids from the 'burbs.

[dogsbody]

In May, 2011, Hawaii Mars was up here, helping to fight a large fire off to our northeast. I whipped out to Gregoire Lake, about 25 klicks south of town and got some photos and video.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Chris

[RJP]

Nice shots!

[e8n2]

13 hours ago, Graham Boak said:

Wasn't the Hughes Hercules intended for the USN?

As I remember it, it was for the AAF as a large, outsize transport aircraft, and not a patrol aircraft.  It was supposed to be able to supply the forces in the UK during the U-Boats happy hunting times.

Later,

Dave

[72modeler]

16 hours ago, e8n2 said:

As I remember it, it was for the AAF as a large, outsize transport aircraft, and not a patrol aircraft.  It was supposed to be able to supply the forces in the UK during the U-Boats happy hunting times.

Later,

Dave

Here's a short description/history. Too bad it came before reliable turboprops...what a fire bomber it would have made! 

Mike

 

https://www.theaviationzone.com/factsheets/hk1.asp

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hughes_H-4_Hercules

 

 

Edited March 27, 2022 by 72modeler
added links

[e8n2]

17 hours ago, 72modeler said:

Here's a short description/history. Too bad it came before reliable turboprops...what a fire bomber it would have made! 

Mike

 

https://www.theaviationzone.com/factsheets/hk1.asp

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hughes_H-4_Hercules

 

 

I remember seeing it when it was still next to the Queen Mary shortly after my return from three years in Germany.  We bought a set of slides but where they are now I have no idea.  Maybe the ex tossed them or something.  You could fit a DC-10 underneath each wing.

Later,

Dave