1:72 Emhar McDonnell F3H-2N Demon

[Brandy]

5 hours ago, Navy Bird said:

I'm not much of a candy bar man.

Sorry, you've lost me there. Butterfingers is a term used for someone who drops things, ie their fingers are slippery! Often heard at cricket matches! (also applicable to baseball games in your case!)

 

Ian

[Navy Bird]

13 hours ago, Brandy said:

Sorry, you've lost me there. Butterfingers is a term used for someone who drops things, ie their fingers are slippery! Often heard at cricket matches! (also applicable to baseball games in your case!)

 

Hi Ian, yes I am familiar with those definitions. Butterfinger is also the name of a candy bar here in the States - elsewhere as well I presume. Anyway, I was just looking for a way to bring those German pretzels into the conversation. I should have also mentioned Dunkel - can't have the brezel without one!   

 

Cheers,

Bill

 

PS. Underside is now white, but I see a few areas that need fixin' before the LGG goes on top. And then no doubt the top will need some fixin' too.

 

PPS. I wanted to see if the VF-122 decals that came with the kit were still good, since they have the large orange band for the tail. So I did a test with the CVG-9 flashes (which are wrong and will be replaced by those on the Xtradecal sheet) and I wasn't happy. The backing paper separated into numerous little bits that stuck to the back of the decal, and they could only be removed when the decal was completely off the paper, still in the water, turned upside down and rubbed with your finger. Kind of like what used to happen with old Monogram decals. This means I will most likely just use the Xtradecal decals which are a different version of the VF-122 markings, lacking the orange band on the tail. This is OK, as I've also learned that the orange band is wrong on the Emhar sheet anyway - what a surprise.   

 

PPPS. How about a nice dark blue F6U-1 next? With reheat!

[Terry1954]

1 hour ago, Navy Bird said:

How about a nice dark blue F6U-1 next?

 

A Vought Pirate no less! Planform like an early Phantom or Banshee but with a seriously not right blunt nose. I'm thinking only Admiral made one of those in 1/72, and I'm sure that means a challenge. That would be a cool build to watch Bill!

 

Terry

[John R]

On 5/24/2022 at 5:45 PM, Shalako said:

Theoretically speaking, do you think you can make the prototype Demon, using the Emhar kit?

 

Cheers,

Bill

I had this idea but came to the same conclusion as Mr Ed. The production version has a much deeper fuselage,

 

 

  Navy Bird said:

How about a nice dark blue F6U-1 next?

I converted an Admiral F6U1 with reheat to an XF6U-1 without reheat and it was almost as much trouble as Vought had doing the conversion in the opposite direction

 

https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235035881-vought-xf6u-1-pirate-prototype-converted-admiral-172/

John

[Knb.1451]

45 minutes ago, Terry1954 said:

 

A Vought Pirate no less! Planform like an early Phantom or Banshee but with a seriously not right blunt nose. I'm thinking only Admiral made one of those in 1/72, and I'm sure that means a challenge. That would be a cool build to watch Bill!

 

Terry

Terry, yes Admiral makes a 1/72 Pirate, I saw one at a hobby store in San Diego when I was on detachment there and thought long and hard about buying that odd little bird. 

[Navy Bird]

3 hours ago, Terry1954 said:

I'm thinking only Admiral made one of those in 1/72, and I'm sure that means a challenge. That would be a cool build to watch Bill!

 

The kit is right in front of me. A right fugly little bird she is.    

 

2 hours ago, John R said:

I converted an Admiral F6U1 with reheat to an XF6U-1 without reheat and it was almost as much trouble as Vought had doing the conversion in the opposite direction

 

The effort paid off, she looks good!    👍

 

2 hours ago, Knb.1451 said:

Terry, yes Admiral makes a 1/72 Pirate, I saw one at a hobby store in San Diego when I was on detachment there and thought long and hard about buying that odd little bird. 

 

Next time you go back to San Diego, check and see if the kit is still on the shelf. I doubt anyone bought it.    

 

Cheers,

Bill

 

PS. Packing the van for the trip to the beach house. About half done and already out of room.    

[Neil Lambess]

On 07/06/2022 at 18:33, StephenCJ said:

So does the ground with a crunch and no lunch

"What's that thing coming towards me very ,very fast ...so big and wide and round it needs a big sounding word like Grrrr...ound ..Ground ...yes thats it GROUND  !........I wonder if it will be friends with me ...?"   

 

(A very confused and falling Sperm Whale as quoted by Douglas Adams )

 😉

 

[Navy Bird]

I survived another week at the beach house. As the grandkids get older, it gets louder for some reason. Go figure.    

 

The day after we arrived, we had tickets for the Ocean City Maryland Air Show. My son-in-law decided we should get "premium sand boxes" for the eight of us - these consisted of two spots on the beach with beach umbrella and four folding camp chairs each. They did a nice job of marking out these spots so you had a bit of room and no one was crowded. These were $300 for each "sand box," so $75 per person. We had our own concessions and loos, so I suppose it was reasonable. Except...

 

There was a deluge that day. I haven't seen so much water fall in an afternoon since Poseidon got back at Odysseus for that little episode with the sharp stick in Polyphemus' eye. When we arrived, our chairs were already set up and each seat had a huge puddle in it. The umbrella wasn't really large enough to provide shelter for four people, so thank God some of us were kids (not me). The kids went in the ocean regardless, but ended up freezing and shivering afterwards. We waited until late in the afternoon and finally bagged it. The rain stopped and the skies cleared as soon as the sun was setting. Of course. No refunds, but we can get a discount for next year. Yea. No wait, we won't be able to go to the beach house next year as we're going to Hawaii for our 50th wedding anniversary. I wonder if giving $600 to the air show is a charitable donation?    

 

*****

 

Now, I think I was building a model. Ah yes, the Demon! Today I decided to have a look at the photoetch speed brakes. These are much nicer than the plastic jobs that come with the kit - those do not have any holes in them and the moulding is not very crisp. The holes on the PE will look much better. However, the real air brakes had a reinforcing structure on the inside which will be quite obvious with the brakes posed open. There are some good photos of this in the Detail & Scale digital book about the Demon, and there is a nice line drawing in the Ginter volume. Time for some more card stock!    

 

To replicate this structure 100% accurately would require that the number of holes, their position, and pattern all be correct on the PE part so that the structure doesn't cover up any holes, nor would any errant glue have a chance to clog up some of them. As mentioned previously, the PE part pattern of holes is not entirely correct, so I had to modify the reinforcing structure accordingly.

 

 

Even so, this will look so much better than the naked PE, especially with some paint applied. If you're keeping track of Emhar boo-boos, the angle cut off of the lower right corner in the photo is much less pronounced in real life. Airwaves made the PE to match the Emhar fuselage, so it's not on them.

 

Now I have to go and make another one for the other side...    

 

Cheers,

Bill

 

PS. What's Ireland like the week before Telford? Last time I went to Telford, we went to Scotland for a week prior, then wifey flew home and I bothered poor @CedB to entertain me (and @Procopius and @Cookenbacher) for the next week. Now wifey wants to go to Ireland (not sure why, it's pretty green here) so I'm thinking maybe I could pull a similar stunt again. I'm only 13 years away from 80 so the time to travel is now. Besides, I never saw a hearse with a luggage rack.

[Navy Bird]

Adventures in Card Stock, Part 2:

 

The F3H Demon has a unique wingtip skid under the rear of the each wing. My understanding is that these came in handy with nose high landings - I've seen some videos on YouTube where these came perilously close to hitting the deck. The Detail & Scale book calls these "vortex de-generators" (first I heard of that term) but @Tailspin Turtle has confirmed that they are indeed wingtip skids. The Squadron "In Action" book doesn't appear to mention them at all, nor does the Ginter volume (as far as I can tell). You can see them in the photos though.

 

Due to my inability to leave well enough alone, I decided to add these little buggers to the model. The round disks were punched out of card stock with my Waldron punch and die set. They are 0.125 inch in diameter; the standoff are made from scrap bits of card stock and even tinier.

 

EDIT - I shortened the standoffs after I took this picture. The real skids weren't that far away from the bottom of the wing.

 

 

How many times will I knock them off, lose them in the ether and have to make them again?    

 

Cheers,

Bill

 

PS. This build is getting ridiculous. I should slap on some paint and stickers and call it a day!    

[Tailspin Turtle]

1 hour ago, Navy Bird said:

Adventures in Card Stock, Part 2:

 

The F3H Demon has a unique wingtip skid under the rear of the each wing. My understanding is that these came in handy with nose high landings - I've seen some videos on YouTube where these came perilously close to hitting the deck. The Detail & Scale book calls these "vortex de-generators" (first I heard of that term) but @Tailspin Turtle has confirmed that they are indeed wingtip skids. The Squadron "In Action" book doesn't appear to mention them at all, nor does the Ginter volume (as far as I can tell). You can see them in the photos though.

 

 

For more on the "vortex de-generators", see https://thanlont.blogspot.com/2015/02/swept-wing-tip-skid_22.html, including the comments.

[Fritag]

5 hours ago, Navy Bird said:

Due to my inability to leave well enough alone, I decided to add these little buggers to the model.

 

Making a vice of a virtue in that sentence, Bill; or a negative of a positive; or - oh heck, the point I’m inelegantly making is that it’s this plastic stock sorcery (amongst other wizardry) that makes you the modeller you are Bill, and draws us all back to this and all your other wonderful threads.

 

3 hours ago, Tailspin Turtle said:

For more on the "vortex de-generators", see https://thanlont.blogspot.com/2015/02/swept-wing-tip-skid_22.html, including the comments.

 

Fascinating snippet of information.  👍

[giemme]

Airbrakes and wing tip skids looking ace, Bill!  And I can only echo Steve's @Fritag comment!

 

Ciao

[John R]

8 hours ago, Navy Bird said:

PS. This build is getting ridiculous. I should slap on some paint and stickers and call it a day!    

You should have done that at the start. The word 'Emhar' should have been enough to put you off.

John

[Terry1954]

Neat little wing skids Bill, very neat.

 

I love those articles in the blog @Tailspin Turtle links for us, and within that one, I was taken by one of the pictures onto this one actually:

 

http://thanlont.blogspot.com/2011/04/bell-l-39-wing-sweep-evaluation.html

 

I wondered how easy it would be to convert a P-39 to that swept wing P-63. That would look cool/strange/neat/ugly (delete as applicable)!

 

14 hours ago, Navy Bird said:

PS. What's Ireland like the week before Telford?

 

Can't speak from experience at that time of year, but geographically (slap bang against the Atlantic) and climatically (slap bang against the Atlantic), and in November, you may not see it at it's best, but I have experienced it in summer when I found it absolutely beautiful. I am sure Tony @TheBaron could advise on that however.

 

And don't forget, if you are over and spend any time in the rest of the UK, there is a small hostel down here in Dorset that can accomodate!

 

Terry

 

PS with hindsight, and recalling when I made a P-39 about 45 years ago and how it wanted to tail sit, those swept wings would require some serious nose weight to be applied!

 

 

 

 

 

[Tailspin Turtle]

3 hours ago, Terry1954 said:

I love those articles in the blog @Tailspin Turtle links for us, and within that one, I was taken by one of the pictures onto this one actually:

 

http://thanlont.blogspot.com/2011/04/bell-l-39-wing-sweep-evaluation.html

 

I wondered how easy it would be to convert a P-39 to that swept wing P-63. That would look cool/strange/neat/ugly (delete as applicable)!

 

Terry

 

PS with hindsight, and recalling when I made a P-39 about 45 years ago and how it wanted to tail sit, those swept wings would require some serious nose weight to be applied!

 

In case you missed the link to the modeling blog post on the L-39, it is http://tailspintopics.blogspot.com/2011/04/sweeping-change-bell-l-39.html

 

And yes, serious nose weight is required, particularly if you add the aft fuselage plug...

[Corsairfoxfouruncle]

8 hours ago, Terry1954 said:

wondered how easy it would be to convert a P-39 to that swept wing P-63. That would look cool

Something Ive often wanted to try myself and definitely Cool. 

[Navy Bird]

17 hours ago, Tailspin Turtle said:

For more on the "vortex de-generators", see https://thanlont.blogspot.com/2015/02/swept-wing-tip-skid_22.html, including the comments.

 

Excellent information Tommy. Now I know the full story! Although when I looked up the word "blivet" I found a lot of definitions but none that seemed to imply a wingtip skid. Perhaps "item of unknown purpose" was the closest! 

 

13 hours ago, Fritag said:

... it’s this plastic stock sorcery (amongst other wizardry) that makes you the modeller you are Bill, and draws us all back to this and all your other wonderful threads.

 

It's not my charming personality?

 

10 hours ago, John R said:

You should have done that at the start. The word 'Emhar' should have been enough to put you off.

 

My bad. I thought Emhar was German for "shake and bake."    

 

9 hours ago, Terry1954 said:

And don't forget, if you are over and spend any time in the rest of the UK, there is a small hostel down here in Dorset that can accomodate!

 

Thanks Terry. I'll expect Full English each morning and several pints in the afternoon. Doom Bar preferred.

 

6 hours ago, Tailspin Turtle said:

In case you missed the link to the modeling blog post on the L-39, it is http://tailspintopics.blogspot.com/2011/04/sweeping-change-bell-l-39.html

 

Somehow I did miss that one. The final gestation is quite strange indeed, with the fuselage plug, ventral fin, swept wings, etc. As always, Tommy fascinates us with these tales from USN aviation history. We all owe him a debt of gratitude.  

 

Cheers,

Bill

[Navy Bird]

Still alive and well on this side of the pond. In-between taking care of the grandkids now that school is out and re-modelling the kitchen, I've been trying to get some paint on the Demon. The basic Light Gull Gray over White is on, with the ailerons also getting a coat of white. Not shown in the photo are the flaps and the tailplanes along with other assorted bits like the landing gear doors, wheels, and armament/pylons which have also been painted.

 

 

The Corogard on the wing leading edges was especially fun as it seems to be applied over the front portions of the wing fences. That meant masking over each and every fence. Ugh. The photo makes it look like I sprayed the Corogard past the panel line; in reality that is just a reflection off of the panel line. I used GSI Mr. Color Super Metallic Silver for the Corogard. It's also on the intake lip and the leading edge of the fin and tailplanes. Similar to the Phantom, the inboard underside of the tailplane is bare metal, but this is unlike the Phantom in being only on the bottom.

 

The bare metal portion around and behind the exhaust (similar to that on an F-4), is Mr. Color Super Metallic Iron. This blast area extends all the way to the end of the beaver tail. The exhaust will get a contrasting metal colour.

 

The speed brake wells will be sprayed with a dark bronze green to match the colour photos that I have. When paired with the red inside surfaces of the speed brake it'll be just like Christmas morning. Although I'm not sure if the Emhar kit is a present or a lump of coal.     

 

The anti-glare panel has an interesting angle near the intake - this matches the angle that is on the intake warning chevron. To make sure that I got the angle reasonably close, I made a template of the intake chevron from a post-it note, and put it in place while I masked the anti-glare area. Hope it works!

 

I still have some masking to do for the metal areas around the cannon ports, plus I've got to get the red stripes on the fuel dumps. I suspect the latter will be decals, and I may make my own. We'll see. I don't think a hairy stick with four hairs will cut it.    🖌️

 

Lots of details to mask with the old LGG/White colourful USN birds. The wing and tailplane tips are orange in both of the VF-122 Black Angels schemes that I have photos and decals for. One of these schemes also has an orange top on the fin, but I'm going to try the other scheme first - that has a large orange band across the fin. The kit decals have this, and you may recall the test I made with these decals, and the resulting disintegration of the paper not the decal film. Wish me luck!    

 

The armament will be four rocket pods and two AIM-9B Winders. I'm not happy with any of the -9B missiles I have, so I ordered the resin and photoetch set from Eduard. The kit I'm using for this build does not have the AERO-1A launcher and pylon, so I've had to modify the AERO-3A that came with the kit. I think this will work out OK, at least they match the drawing in the Detail & Scale book for dimensions. The Sidewinders will be on stations 3 & 6 (inboard on the wings) and the rocket pods on stations 1, 2, 7 & 8. Nothing will be on fuselage stations 4 & 5.

 

Speaking of the rocket pods, Detail & Scale advise you to fill the panel lines that represent the aero covers on the front and back of the pod. This is wise, as the panel lines are huge! Plus, they don't line up, as can be plainly seen here after I'd filled those babies and sanded down the putty.

 

 

Not exactly sure what Emhar was thinking here.    

 

I like the set of the aircraft, being somewhat nose high. I modified the nose gear a wee bit to get this. Some photos show it with even more of a nose high attitude, especially with the nose gear oleo extended.

 

 

So much still left to do, plus I've got to catch up on Star Trek: Strange New Worlds. I'm several episodes behind. I really need to get my priorities straight.    

 

Cheers,

Bill

[Corsairfoxfouruncle]

Lovely paintwork sir, I keep looking fir one of these as its a glaring hole in my early navy jets collection. Someday I will get lucky. 

[John Laidlaw]

19 minutes ago, Navy Bird said:

I've got to catch up on Star Trek: Strange New Worlds. I'm several episodes behind. I really need to get my priorities straight. 

Strap yourself in - it gets better and better.

 

The Demon is looking gorgeous, but I expected nothing less from you. It's always a pleasure watching your builds.

[Learstang]

That Demon is looking brilliant, Bill! Believe or not, I've actually built a model (the unbelievable part is that I've actually built and finished (!!) a model) of the F6U-1 Pirate. And to add amazement to unbelievability, it was the old (ancient?) Meikraft kit. It actually turned out rather nicely, if I may say so. Sadly, it vanished many years ago, so you have only my (somewhat suspect) word regarding its existence at all. You need to do your Admiral Pirate next, Bill - I have one (to replace my old Meikraft model), and I need to know how to build it.

 

Best Regards,

 

Jason

 

P.S. John R, excellent job on your backdated Pirate! I really like the look of that with the WWII-style stars and bars. That gives me an idea for a cunning plan on my Pirate.

Edited July 1, 2022 by Learstang
Additional comments added.

[giemme]

7 hours ago, Navy Bird said:

Lots of details to mask with the old LGG/White colourful USN birds.

But they look soooo good, don't they?

 

Excellent progress on the Demon, that Coroguard must have been a royal pain     

Ciao

[81-er]

That's looking really nice with the paint on now, Bill. Really looking forward to seeing it with the orange stripes

 

James

[Robin-42]

10 hours ago, Corsairfoxfouruncle said:

Lovely paintwork sir, I keep looking fir one of these as its a glaring hole in my early navy jets collection. Someday I will get lucky. 

Hannants has lots in stock.

[Navy Bird]

14 hours ago, Corsairfoxfouruncle said:

Lovely paintwork sir, I keep looking fir one of these as its a glaring hole in my early navy jets collection. Someday I will get lucky. 

 

Both Emhar and Sword kits of the Demon can be found, often at model shows in the vendor room. Since you're in the US, Kitlinx has both Emhar kits, but they want crazy money (why?). I would probably go the Sword route if I were to build another, just because of the better surface detail.

 

14 hours ago, John Laidlaw said:

Strap yourself in - it gets better and better.

 

When I was in college (mid 70s) Gene Roddenberry came and gave a nice presentation on the original show. In addition to showing the wrap party blooper reels, he also showed the complete original pilot episode with Capt. Pike and Number 1. Of course, his wife was playing Number 1 and then in the series she was demoted to Nurse Chapel. Gene said "that shows you what you can get by sleeping with the producer."    

 

14 hours ago, Learstang said:

And to add amazement to unbelievability, it was the old (ancient?) Meikraft kit.

 

Haven't heard of that kit before. I had a look at the box art over at Scalemates and it says "not suitable for children." So how did you get one?    

 

7 hours ago, giemme said:

Excellent progress on the Demon, that Coroguard must have been a royal pain    

 

Corogard is always a pain, probably even for the guys who had to paint the real aircraft too. But I guess it did its job.

 

7 hours ago, 81-er said:

That's looking really nice with the paint on now, Bill. Really looking forward to seeing it with the orange stripes

 

Me too. I don't have any USN jets with orange markings, so it should stand out nicely.

 

3 hours ago, Robin-42 said:

Hannants has lots in stock.

 

Yes they do, both Emhar and Sword in 1:72 and Hobby Boss in 1:48. At reasonable prices I might add - the Emhar kits are half what Kitlinx wants.     

 

*****

 

Thanks for the comments mates. Back to work...got to fix the swimming pool pump today. Ugh.

 

Cheers,

Bill