1:72 Emhar McDonnell F3H-2N Demon

[Tweener]

The Intrepid Demon is tail marking AG 3566 with the Red - Yellow - Blue - Orange - Green - Black stripe on the end of the rudder, similar to the other option on the decal sheet you're using. At one point it's markings were more generic, but I can't say how long ago that was.

[Navy Bird]

On 26/03/2022 at 22:45, Tweener said:

The Intrepid Demon is tail marking AG 3566 with the Red - Yellow - Blue - Orange - Green - Black stripe on the end of the rudder, similar to the other option on the decal sheet you're using. At one point it's markings were more generic, but I can't say how long ago that was.

 

Nice - I searched a bit and found a photo of the aircraft. I like the colours on the tail.     👍

 

*****

 

So, let's see - I think the expression is one step forward, two steps back. I have the cockpit and instrument panel finished (except for the ejection seat and control column which I usually add at the end of the build) but I ran into one of those problems with the resin replacement nose. Actually, several problems. In no particular order:

1. The two nose sections are different length (by a mm or so)
2. The longest of the nose sections is 2 mm shorter than the corresponding kit part (compared to drawings the kit is already a bit too short by itself)
3. The resin nose sections are slightly different height (which could be fixed when gluing by strategic squeezing)
4. When assembled, the resin nose section is too narrow where it meets the fuselage (could be shimmed I suppose)
5. The resin nose section has an odd lateral twist to it which makes the cockpit lean a bit to port

What to do? I vote for binning it.

 

Back to using the kit's nose section - I made a list of the features on the resin that are not on the styrene. Surprisingly, there are not that many. I started by drilling out the cannon ports. Now that I've done that, it actually looks better than the resin. There are some lumps and bumps on the underside of the nose that I'll add later - pretty easy mods. I removed the kit's coaming so I can use the resin version which is more detailed and sharply cast. I used this cool little end mill bit on the Dremel and it worked great. The resin cockpit fits nicely in the kit's nose section so I don't see any difficulties there.

 

The two "tabs" at the top rear of the cockpit opening are meant to represent the portion of the front fuselage that forms the inside of the intake cowling. However, they are moulded vertical, while on the real aircraft they are canted outward. Accordingly 🪗, I removed them and will replace with card stock.

 

The nicely cast resin radome is a bit smaller in diameter (maybe 0.5 mm) than the front portion of the kit's nose. I can fix this by adding a card stock shim. It will make the nose section correspondingly longer, but I won't tell anyone if you won't.   

 

Lastly, there is a NACA duct on top of the nose in front of the windscreen. The resin includes this, albeit with a nasty seam running right through the middle of it, and I've yet to decide if I will try to add this to the styrene. It's small and located in the anti-glare section so it's not real obvious except in close-ups. I need one of NACA duct makers that you use like a branding iron. We'll see.

 

I love scale modelling.   

 

Cheers,

Bill

 

[giemme]

9 hours ago, Navy Bird said:

I need one of NACA duct makers that you use like a branding iron. We'll see.

I use a (homemade) punch version of that, but it requires a bit of surgery. I punch the NACA on some plasticard (0.3mm thick at least), then cut around it in the shape of a small square; I then produce the same cutout on the actual kit plastic and blend in the NACA "patch"in. The reason for this is that I tried with a hot iron, but I couldn't get consistent result, especially in terms of orientation; my system instead allows you multiple attempts without altering the kit plastic until you are happy with the result. HTH

 

Ciao

[David H]

15 hours ago, Navy Bird said:

 

So, let's see - I think the expression is one step forward, two steps back. I have the cockpit and instrument panel finished (except for the ejection seat and control column which I usually add at the end of the build) but I ran into one of those problems with the resin replacement nose. Actually, several problems. In no particular order:

1. The two nose sections are different length (by a mm or so)
2. The longest of the nose sections is 2 mm shorter than the corresponding kit part (compared to drawings the kit is already a bit too short by itself)
3. The resin nose sections are slightly different height (which could be fixed when gluing by strategic squeezing)
4. When assembled, the resin nose section is too narrow where it meets the fuselage (could be shimmed I suppose)
5. The resin nose section has an odd lateral twist to it which makes the cockpit lean a bit to port

What to do? I vote for binning it.

 

 

 

Cheers,

Bill

 

Jeez, what a buzzkill. You'd think the folks at Pavla would have actually tried this "brilliant" concept for themselves, and proof it to make sure it would work....consistently. Just affirms my prejudice that Resin often makes promises it can't keep.

[Navy Bird]

7 hours ago, giemme said:

...my system instead allows you multiple attempts without altering the kit plastic until you are happy with the result. HTH

 

That's a great idea. I knew I liked you for some reason.    🤟

 

1 hour ago, David H said:

 Just affirms my prejudice that Resin often makes promises it can't keep.

 

True fact. But when it does live up to its promises the results can be fantastic. Pavla are one of those producers who aren't always consistent - the cockpit set for the Airfix Canberra PR.9 was brilliant, but this set for the Demon has some issues. At least the sample I have does - I suspect these were caused by resin shrinkage and all those associated gremlins.

 

The kits from CMR that I've built were amazing, especially the Firebrand and Buccaneers. The accessories from CMK are usually pretty good, but those from Aires often have fit problems. The latter I don't think are due to the resin, but rather the engineering behind the set. The resin kits I've built from Aki and S.B.S were phenomenal, but those from Planet were so-so. I won't even mention Anigrand...      So resin for me has been a bit of a mixed bag. But I still like it - maybe I'm addicted to the dust.   

 

OK, back to work...

 

Cheers,

Bill

[Fritag]

I can’t honestly say I remember having heard of the F3H Demon  But seeing as I wos an absolutely plane-mad kid I s’pect I knew of it back in the day and simply forgot about it…….

 

Looking forward to learning more about it in the company of a first class Navy Bird build 

Edited March 29, 2022 by Fritag

[Navy Bird]

6 hours ago, Fritag said:

...I s’pect I knew of it back in the day and simply forgot about it…….

 

You and most of the rest of humanity.   

 

Maybe one of the final proposed variants of the Demon will look familiar - just bend the wingtips up, the tailplanes down, and add a back seat.

 

 

 

Of course, this would have been virtually an entirely different aircraft even though it was being referred to with the F3H moniker. I like the fact that this baby appears to be in my favourite Sea Blue colour.    🤟

 

Cheers,

Bill

[Fritag]

11 hours ago, Navy Bird said:

just bend the wingtips up, the tailplanes down 

 

Or maybe just leave it at that?  

 

On second thoughts maybe it was best to

 

11 hours ago, Navy Bird said:

add a back seat.

 

The workload would probably have been impossible otherwise, given the avionics of the day.

 

Just like I can’t imagine how a buccaneer could have been any where near as effective with only one bod to try and do everything.

[Navy Bird]

3 hours ago, Fritag said:

The workload would probably have been impossible otherwise, given the avionics of the day.

 

I think McDonnell offered that same argument to convince the USN brass that the Phantom would be a better choice than the Crusader III. I would have bought both, myself, assuming those pesky taxpayers didn't object.     💰

 

Cheers,

Bill

[Tailspin Turtle]

3 hours ago, Fritag said:

 

Or maybe just leave it at that?  

 

On second thoughts maybe it was best to

 

 

The workload would probably have been impossible otherwise, given the avionics of the day.

 

Just like I can’t imagine how a buccaneer could have been any where near as effective with only one bod to try and do everything.

With respect to requiring a guy dedicated to the radar, Vought not only insisted that the avionics of the day were adequate to the task, they sought to prove it with a fixed based simulator that they took to Washington to demonstrate that the guy in front, with the assistance of an autopilot, could acquire the bogey on radar and designate it for the Sparrow to guide on all by himself. There was no question that not having the radar operator of the F8U-3 reduced its weight and cost compared to the F4H . However, the Navy decided that having someone full time, albeit for just the few minutes searching on the scope for the bogey that they were being vectored toward and tweaking the radar for optimum performance, resulted in enough of an increase in likelihood that the interception would be successful to justify the higher cost given the detection range of the Phantom's radar; the time required to acquire the bogey and lock a Sparrow on to it: and a closing speed of 1,850 knots (the combined speed of the Phantom at full chat and the incoming jet bomber at Mach .8).

[VT Red Sox Fan]

Bill, joining up—I don’t have this kit, so really looking forward to how you sort it out given your track record of stunning builds—best, Erwin 

[Navy Bird]

Not the best photo by a long shot (actually it's a terrible photo), but I think I can detect a suggestion of the infamous Ω.

 

 

Loads more work to do. One of these days I'm going to build OOB. Really. I am. Seriously.

 

Cheers,

Bill

 

PS. I'm not kidding.   

[Learstang]

Nice to see you doing the Demon, Bill! I've always liked the F3H for some reason - it's like some kind of larval Phantom II, and that mockup photograph seems to prove that. A Demon on its way to becoming the 'beautiful butterfly'* that was the Phantom II.

 

Best Regards,

 

Jason

 

* Sarcasm intended. I'm actually building a Fine Molds Double Ugly right now.

[giemme]

7 hours ago, Navy Bird said:

Loads more work to do. One of these days I'm going to build OOB. Really. I am. Seriously.

 

PS. I'm not kidding.   

I'm not buying that, sorry....   

 

7 hours ago, Navy Bird said:

loads more work to

Based on that pic, I tend to agree   Should be a lot of fun!  

 

Ciao

[corsaircorp]

Hello Bill !!

Oooh Demons on the way !!

May I take a sat ?? It will be an incentive to finish mine (s)

Obvioulsly, the first one will be a VF-61 one...

On second thoughts the second one could be a Jolly Roger as well....

Sincerely.

CC

[Navy Bird]

22 hours ago, Learstang said:

I'm actually building a Fine Molds Double Ugly right now.

 

Beautiful kit innit? 

 

14 hours ago, giemme said:

Based on that pic, I tend to agree   Should be a lot of fun!

 

Fun is a relative term when building an Emhar kit.   

 

So, yeah, a lot of work but I knew that when I opened the box. The windscreen "omega" cross-section is a tough one - the only kit I've seen that has this almost right is <gasp> HobbyBoss. Of course the rest of that kit has some issues - who woulda thunk?

 

9 hours ago, corsaircorp said:

...It will be an incentive to finish mine (s)

Obvioulsly, the first one will be a VF-61 one...

On second thoughts the second one could be a Jolly Roger as well....

 

You have two of these kits? And I thought I was deranged...

 

Cheers,

Bill

[Navy Bird]

Hi mates,

 

I just got back from Delaware and Maryland, first to celebrate my son's 40th birthday (40? Ye gads, that makes me really old) followed by watching him compete in a 100K bike race. Man, if I only had 1% of his energy...

 

I managed to move the Demon project a bit further along. As I was putting the fuselage halves together, I noticed two areas where I wanted to make some changes - the catapult bridle hook bay and the arresting hook bay. Here are the parts as supplied by Emhar:

 

 

When compared to the actual aircraft, I think these leave a lot to be desired. For example here is the catapult bridle hook:

 

(Please consult the Detail & Scale publication on the F3H Demon.)

 

And here is the arresting hook and tail bumper bay (also note the shape of the fuel tank vents - Emhar have this wrong too):

 

(Please consult the Detail & Scale publication on the F3H Demon.)

 

I've seen some photos that show a triangular-shaped section that covers the bay between the arms of the arresting hook, but most photos that I've managed to collect (admittedly not many) seem to show the bay open as seen here. I decided to break out the card stock and see if I can botch up trying to replicate this. First, the fuselage halves were joined and I built up the basic shape of the two bays.

 

 

To this I'll add some details following what I see in the reference photos. Come to think of it I suspect I will need to add some details to the speed brake area too. After this bit of work, I added a bulkhead inside the fuselage, about where the front edge of the wing slot is. This is to prevent any "see-through" to the exhaust (just in case). I believe the exhaust itself will block most, but I don't want to press my luck. Just for giggles I may print out a picture of the front of the engine and put it on the bulkhead - I've done that trick before.   

 

The turtle deck was also added. Here is a comparison of the kit part with the Pavla resin replacement. I don't have any good photos of this area, but the line drawing in the Ginter volume shows that Pavla did their homework.

 

 

Let's see, what else? Oh, right, nose weight. Emhar says you need 15g of weight to prevent tail-sitting. I filled up the radome with Liquid Gravity, and adding a pile or two of ball bearings in front of the cockpit area. This didn't get me up to 15g, so I'll add a chunk of lead right behind the cockpit on top of the nose gear bay. Personally, I think this might be an overkill, but better safe than sorry. I've been bit on that before.    

 

Back to work...

 

Cheers,

Bill

 

[Learstang]

Nice to see you back on the larval Phantom II Demon, Bill! I suspect I shall be buying the Sword interpretation sooner, rather than later.

 

Best Regards,

 

Jason

[Navy Bird]

Arghh - lousy news on the home front. My daughter, her husband, and almost one-year old Dexter all tested positive for Covid today. They are now quarantining at home, feeling kinda crummy. Dexter is being quite cranky. Wifey and I will need to get tested since we were with my daughter and Dexter yesterday. We normally babysit Dexter on Mondays but we were traveling back from Maryland. Man, we've all been so careful - but at least everyone (except little Dexter) has been vaccinated so I'm hoping the symptoms are mild.

 

Cheers,

Bill

[Procopius]

5 minutes ago, Navy Bird said:

Arghh - lousy news on the home front. My daughter, her husband, and almost one-year old Dexter all tested positive for Covid today. They are now quarantining at home, feeling kinda crummy. Dexter is being quite cranky. Wifey and I will need to get tested since we were with my daughter and Dexter yesterday. We normally babysit Dexter on Mondays but we were traveling back from Maryland. Man, we've all been so careful - but at least everyone (except little Dexter) has been vaccinated so I'm hoping the symptoms are mild.

Oof. Hope it passes quickly and without much worthy of comment, Bill. 

[stevehnz]

Fingered crossed for you guys Bill that it is a mild as it's supposed to be.

Steve.

[AdrianMF]

Sorry to hear about the Covid - hope it passes soon. The boxed in bays look very nice and I appreciate your efforts on a basic kit. IMHO Building OOB is overrated as a source of entertainment but I'm rather glad I've got a Sword kit tucked away for when I've finished my current phase of fiddly biplane builds!

 

Regards,

Adrian

[Brandy]

To be honest, I wouldn't worry about Covid any more. I work with a gentleman who is currently undergoing chemo for stage 4 cancer. He tested positive and still only had mild cold symptoms for a day or so.

It's time we moved on!

 

As for the Demon, I had not heard of it before either, but will definitely be following along!

 

Ian

[giemme]

Fingers crossed you get through this unscathed, Bill

 

Lovely detailing going on, meanwhile  

 

Ciao

[Navy Bird]

14 hours ago, Procopius said:

Oof. Hope it passes quickly and without much worthy of comment, Bill. 

 

Thanks Edward. And I think Madelaine is a lovely name for your coming attraction.   

 

10 hours ago, stevehnz said:

Fingered crossed for you guys Bill that it is a mild as it's supposed to be.

 

Thanks. So far, my son-in-law has minor flu-like symptoms (basically a fever and achy joints), little Dexter is running a fever at the same time four teeth are coming in, so he is really cranky), and my daughter has no symptoms at all yet. Fingers crossed things stay mild.

 

3 hours ago, AdrianMF said:

Sorry to hear about the Covid - hope it passes soon. The boxed in bays look very nice and I appreciate your efforts on a basic kit. IMHO Building OOB is overrated as a source of entertainment but I'm rather glad I've got a Sword kit tucked away for when I've finished my current phase of fiddly biplane builds!

 

Thanks Adrian. I haven't built a kit OOB in so long I can't remember. Besides, I like spending the kid's inheritance on aftermarket, thereby supporting the economy of the Czech Republic.    

 

21 minutes ago, giemme said:

Fingers crossed you get through this unscathed, Bill

 

Thanks Giorgio. I'm sure things will be OK with the family. I'm most worried about the baby but his pediatric doctor doesn't seem too concerned.

 

29 minutes ago, Brandy said:

To be honest, I wouldn't worry about Covid any more. I work with a gentleman who is currently undergoing chemo for stage 4 cancer. He tested positive and still only had mild cold symptoms for a day or so. It's time we moved on!

 

As for the Demon, I had not heard of it before either, but will definitely be following along!

 

Never heard of the Demon? Welcome to the club. Hopefully I won't muck it up too bad. The Emhar kit leaves a lot to be desired. The Sword kit looks better, but I think we still don't have a definitive modern kit of the "Beta Phantom."

 

I agree that Covid is most likely entering the endemic phase and we'll have to deal with it like we do the annual flu. In the meantime, both of my daughters work at the hospital and some folks still get pretty sick from it. I've been through chemo for stage 4 lymphoma twice - once in 2002 and again in 2015 when it recurred. I am now immunodeficient due to all the chemo I received (nearly 50 infusions total). I now get monthly infusions of IgG to boost my immune system - without it I get upper respiratory infections all the time. I have to be careful with any kind of stuff like Covid. But I'll accept that instead of the lymphoma!   

 

*****

 

Now for the good news - my wife and I both tested negative! We're still not sure where or when my daughter and her family were exposed though. I shall now return to trying to build a mnemonic memory circuit using stone knives and bear skins* - uh, I mean building the Demon.    

 

Cheers,

Bill

 

* Apologies to the Ghost of Leonard Nimoy.