HMS Rodney Build Log - 1/200

[andyelbac]

3 hours ago, Rich75 said:

Thanks, although I think it was @ArnoldAmbrose who said it might bug you in the future! But i had a similar dilemma with my current build, I think I would always wish I'd dealt with it. Ships can be quite time consuming I've found, don't give up!!

Thanks @Rich75 and apologies to @ArnoldAmbrose. The sentiment is the same. I will persevere a little longer with the scuttles.

[ArnoldAmbrose]

Gidday, and absolutely no apologies necessary. 🙂 Good luck with the scuttles. Regards, Jeff.

[andyelbac]

I spent a few hours this morning re-drilling the scuttles. I really do think this is close as I can get to accurate but still suspect the port side in particular may not be totally correct. The issue being very few good shots of Rodney perfectly side on in good light (starboard or port) seem to exist. As most are at an angle it makes determining where the scuttles are accurately located very difficult. However, I honestly do not believe I can go any further with them based on the available photos. If you spot any mistakes in the scuttles, please don't bother telling me! 😕😁 Tomorrow I shall finish off the bilge outlets and start thinking about adding the Pontos scuttle surrounds. That should be fun.🤨 Moving on and it has become obvious that I need to consider mounting the hull. I decided to prepare a temporary mount until such time as Rodney is finished. It serves two purposes. First, it will make working on the hull easier (once I have added the PE scuttle surround and added the kit deck). Secondly, the final base will need to be quite a big piece of timber. You may recall I mentioned in an earlier post that I had found a second hand acrylic box on Ebay. This will need to sit in a routered groove running along the top of a piece of wood, which itself will need to accommodate the footprint of the box which comes in at 260mm x 1200mm. If I make the permanent base now I think it will be too unwieldy to handle as I move the model around to work on. So this is what I came up with for a temporary base:

Bits of wood from my shed and two 12mm bolts and nuts. I drilled two 13mm holes in the hull for the bolts. My plan was to expoxy resin the two small blocks you can see above onto the base of the hull. When dry I will expoxy resin in the nuts (dropped into the blocks) to create captive nuts. That way, in the unlikely event the model needs removing from the base, I can remove the bolts from underneath the base. Like all plans, they never survive first contact with the enemy; the enemy in this case being my atrocious woodworking 'skills'. The centres for the two holes I drilled in the hull are 256mm. I wrote it on the temporary wood base you can see above. This way I knew for certain I could not screw it up. I promptly drilled the centres, congratulating myself on how well it was going as I used my brand new cordless drill whilst standing in my shed. This I thought, is what real men do! I took the base up to my tank room and offered up the hull, which promptly refused to fit. It wasn't even a close thing. I had measured the centres at 265mm! 🤨 Refusing to buckle under the appalling weight of my own idiocy, I found another off cut and tried again. This time success! I offered it up to the hull. Yes! This, I told myself, is what real men do!:

 

 To hide the black nuts, I purchased two brass sleeves off Ebay. You can see them in the photos below:

 

 I wish that were the end of the story. Unfortunately, when turning the base over I realised I couldn't get a socket into the hole drilled underneath to remove the bolt 😥 so am now waiting for a bigger wood bit so I can redo the temporary base. This l, thought, is what real men do! Needless to say, when I come to buy a nice piece of oak to use as my permanent base, I will get the timber yard to drill the locating holes for me! This, I thought.....................

[ArnoldAmbrose]

Gidday Andy, I like the idea of a temporary base while building the model. I do the same, although somewhat smaller for a 1/600 model. 265mm instead of 256mm? Who hasn't done that, or similar? 😁   Could I ask, why the wood inside the hull, won't the nuts glue direct to the plastic? Or is it to allow a bit of 'give' when tightening the bolts?

And speaking of bolts, using a spade bit on the underneath of the outside block should give you enough clearance for the socket head. But that usually gets done first, before drilling the hole for the bolt shaft. If it's too late then maybe with a hack saw cut a slot in the head of the bolt, to take a screwdriver. I screw up directly into the hull plastic (thickened inside at those locations) but weight isn't such an issue for me, the model being much smaller.

     Anyway, have a think about it, and have a beer while doing so. That's what real men do. 🙂 But under no circumstances do you follow any written instructions until all else fails. That's what real men do. 😁     Regards, Jeff.

[andyelbac]

2 hours ago, ArnoldAmbrose said:

Gidday Andy, I like the idea of a temporary base while building the model. I do the same, although somewhat smaller for a 1/600 model. 265mm instead of 256mm? Who hasn't done that, or similar? 😁   Could I ask, why the wood inside the hull, won't the nuts glue direct to the plastic? Or is it to allow a bit of 'give' when tightening the bolts?

And speaking of bolts, using a spade bit on the underneath of the outside block should give you enough clearance for the socket head. But that usually gets done first, before drilling the hole for the bolt shaft. If it's too late then maybe with a hack saw cut a slot in the head of the bolt, to take a screwdriver. I screw up directly into the hull plastic (thickened inside at those locations) but weight isn't such an issue for me, the model being much smaller.

     Anyway, have a think about it, and have a beer while doing so. That's what real men do. 🙂 But under no circumstances do you follow any written instructions until all else fails. That's what real men do. 😁     Regards, Jeff.

Cheers Jeff! Of course,  how could I have forgotten the beer! I'm sure my measurements would have been accurate if I had just imbibed myself of a few bottles (they could hardly be worse). On a serious note, I hadn't thought about just fixing the nuts straight to the plastic. Talk about making life difficult for yourself. Also,  your point about cutting a slot in the bolt head is another great idea. This is why any suggestion by myself that I'm going to attempt any sort of DIY around the house is met with looks of panic from my partner 😁

[ArnoldAmbrose]

3 hours ago, andyelbac said:

This is why any suggestion by myself that I'm going to attempt any sort of DIY around the house is met with looks of panic from my partner 😁

Gidday, that's not such a bad thing. Do a good job once and you're expected to do it all the time. Stuff it up the first time and the job will hopefully get passed on to someone else in future. 👍

Regards, Jeff.

[andyelbac]

☹ Let's start off with how I feel. The emoji says it all. Actually, I couldn't find an emoji that accurately shows how I feel. I've been drilling out the scuttles with a 1.8mm bit, slightly smaller than Trumpeter moulded the scuttle depressions. Today, and only today, I offered up the Pontos scuttle surrounds to a pre-drilled hole. It fell through. The first person that says 'Rookie mistake......' My first act was to get a beer.  Cheers @ArnoldAmbrose! I'm going to have to fill all the scuttles with 2mm rod and then re-drill with a 1.4mm bit. It's going to take a few days before the rod arrives and then many more days to fill, sand and re-drill. This old girl is going to feel like a lump of swiss cheese by the time I have finished with her😁. As least I can smile about it now. Beer or insanity can do that for a guy. 

[Rich75]

1 hour ago, andyelbac said:

☹ Let's start off with how I feel. The emoji says it all. Actually, I couldn't find an emoji that accurately shows how I feel. I've been drilling out the scuttles with a 1.8mm bit, slightly smaller than Trumpeter moulded the scuttle depressions. Today, and only today, I offered up the Pontos scuttle surrounds to a pre-drilled hole. It fell through. The first person that says 'Rookie mistake......' My first act was to get a beer.  Cheers @ArnoldAmbrose! I'm going to have to fill all the scuttles with 2mm rod and then re-drill with a 1.4mm bit. It's going to take a few days before the rod arrives and then many more days to fill, sand and re-drill. This old girl is going to feel like a lump of swiss cheese by the time I have finished with her😁. As least I can smile about it now. Beer or insanity can do that for a guy. 

Oh dear, can you post a picture of that? I'm can't get my head round why they don't fit, sorry for your troubles!🤞

[andyelbac]

@Rich75 here's some photos. The Pontos scuttle surround doesn't fall through all the holes, but most look like this. Bear in mind this hole was drilled slightly smaller than the Trumpeter scuttle depression:

 

 You can clearly see (in my opinion) that the finished scuttle will look odd. I'm assuming that the scuttle surround should sit proud of the hull, or am I misunderstanding the way scuttles sit in the hull?

[Rich75]

9 hours ago, andyelbac said:

@Rich75 here's some photos. The Pontos scuttle surround doesn't fall through all the holes, but most look like this. Bear in mind this hole was drilled slightly smaller than the Trumpeter scuttle depression:

 

 You can clearly see (in my opinion) that the finished scuttle will look odd. I'm assuming that the scuttle surround should sit proud of the hull, or am I misunderstanding the way scuttles sit in the hull?

Does look that way doesn't it, I take it they are all the same size...

[andyelbac]

58 minutes ago, Rich75 said:

Does look that way doesn't it, I take it they are all the same size...

Good point. I should check. Interestingly, it's the only part Pontos does not refer to in their instructions.

[andyelbac]

Looking at the Pontos scuttles, and @Rich75 wondered if they were all the same size. I've checked all the frets and they appear all the same. As I mentioned, these are the only parts on the frets which are not numbered, nor are they referred to in the Pontos instructions. You can see from the pictures below that Pontos have scattered the scuttles across the frets, instead of placing them all together. As I type this the thought has crossed my mind that perhaps the scuttles are actually only designed to go on the superstructure. In which case, I may have a slight problem. Clearly I need to count them all:

 If anyone following this post has built the Trumpeter kit with Pontos, your advice very much appreciated.

[andyelbac]

I've plugged up all the scuttles with 2mm rod. At some point over the next few days I will start re-drilling them. The Pontos scuttles are a friction fit over a 1.4mm drill bit so that's the size I intend to drill the holes. I also took the opportunity to count how many scuttles Pontos provide. Here's the strange thing. There are approx. 220 scuttles on the hull (give or take a couple). I've counted 67 on the superstructure, giving a total of 287. Now I'm working on the assumption that as Pontos went to the trouble of etching scuttles they intended you to use them. I need 287 but Pontos have only provided 242. I either leave the Trumpeter moulded scuttles in place on the superstructure or I look to see if I can purchase 1/200 PE scuttles online. I'm hoping that there are aftermarket scuttles available as I have no choice now but to use the scuttles on the hull and leaving the Trumpeter ones in place on the superstructure will just look odd.

[andyelbac]

I've finally have the hull fixed to its temporary base. I've applied epoxy resin to the nut and washer inside the hull to make a captive nut. Worryingly, a few minutes after applying the expoxy I noticed smoke coming from the resin. I had forgotten how much heat it generates as it cures. For a few minutes I had visions of it eating through the hull, rather like the Aliens blood! Thankfully it finished curing before the plastic started melting. Here are some pictures of how she looks:

 

 

 

[robgizlu]

Hi Andy - I feel your pain.  

1)  Worth checking for other 1/200 scuttles that might be bigger?

2)  In the pic showing the scuttle - would it be possible to place the scuttle over the "filled" hole and then drill "through" the scuttle is thi what yo are planning - it would reduce the work.  And yes to your question.  As far as I'm concerned Scuttles sit proud of the hull.

Keep persevering - it'll be worthwhile

Rob

[andyelbac]

On 16/05/2022 at 10:55, robgizlu said:

Hi Andy - I feel your pain.  

1)  Worth checking for other 1/200 scuttles that might be bigger?

2)  In the pic showing the scuttle - would it be possible to place the scuttle over the "filled" hole and then drill "through" the scuttle is thi what yo are planning - it would reduce the work.  And yes to your question.  As far as I'm concerned Scuttles sit proud of the hull.

Keep persevering - it'll be worthwhile

Rob

Thanks Rob. I will check for aftermarket scuttles before I start drilling. The frustrating thing is, because Pontos have not placed all the scuttles on one fret it makes it more expensive to buy spare off them. I need at least 45 to complete and more likely 50 to allow for cock ups and feeding the Carpet Monster. I need to check to see if any of the frets have 50 scuttles (that way I only need one spare fret from Pontos) but I'm pretty certain they don't. As to how I apply the PE scuttles, your idea of using them as a template sounds like a good idea. I might try one on a scrap piece of plastic to see how that works out. Since my last build time update I have spent another 9 hours on the hull, including working on the temporary base, which brings the total build time to 81 hours. Last night I sanded down the faces of the rod I glued into the scuttles. I also went over with putty to ensure any cavities were filled, so more time still to spend on the hull before I can prime and face the camo scheme. Which reminds me, now Sovereign Hobbies have resumed posting goods, I need to get my NARN42 on order before the new batch sells out. Now, where did my girlfriend hide my credit card......  🤔

[Xtof P]

On 31/03/2022 at 11:51, foeth said:

Great work! Boats and such anti-aircraft guns are models entirely by themselves...

 

 

One of my pompoms is wonky too, if someone points that out I'll point out an eye

 

Looks really cool! Which colours did you use for those pieces? It is quite difficult to find proper references for the colours of those smaller arms of Rodney. Oerlikons and pompom directors too. Where the tones from the Royal Navy colour schemes used here as well or are those completedly different? I've got the Rodney on my stack as well - so any information will be appreciated.

[Xtof P]

On 13/05/2022 at 19:44, andyelbac said:

I've plugged up all the scuttles with 2mm rod. At some point over the next few days I will start re-drilling them. The Pontos scuttles are a friction fit over a 1.4mm drill bit so that's the size I intend to drill the holes. I also took the opportunity to count how many scuttles Pontos provide. Here's the strange thing. There are approx. 220 scuttles on the hull (give or take a couple). I've counted 67 on the superstructure, giving a total of 287. Now I'm working on the assumption that as Pontos went to the trouble of etching scuttles they intended you to use them. I need 287 but Pontos have only provided 242. I either leave the Trumpeter moulded scuttles in place on the superstructure or I look to see if I can purchase 1/200 PE scuttles online. I'm hoping that there are aftermarket scuttles available as I have no choice now but to use the scuttles on the hull and leaving the Trumpeter ones in place on the superstructure will just look odd.

 

Probably those might be interesting: https://www.whiteensignmodels.com/p/WEM+1200+Porthole+Eyebrows+PE+2009/18894/#.YoO0KFVCRxA

[foeth]

17 hours ago, Xtof P said:

Which colours did you use for those pieces? It is quite difficult to find proper references for the colours of those smaller arms of Rodney. Oerlikons and pompom directors too. Where the tones from the Royal Navy colour schemes used here as well or are those completedly different? I've got the Rodney on my stack as well - so any information will be appreciated.

 

So these three are for HMS Hood and are painted in her hull colour, AP507B (Much to my regret, a DIY mix before SovereignHobbies new paints hit the markets).

 

 

I painted the floor dark deck grey, and some pics of Hood also show the chute below the main barrels in a darker colour, so I copied that.

Not entire clear if that persisted, but it seems so. I have not actively searched for any (C)AFOs specifying how to paint the pompoms though! The barrels are a light gun metal with darker metallic cooling sleeves. Hood was painted in a uniform grey, so I used that for all directors and such as well, though you do see colour variation. For instance, the 4" mount in the background is markedly lighter than the rest of the ship...

 

[andyelbac]

On 17/05/2022 at 15:47, Xtof P said:

 

Probably those might be interesting: https://www.whiteensignmodels.com/p/WEM+1200+Porthole+Eyebrows+PE+2009/18894/#.YoO0KFVCRxA

Thanks. I will check them out. 

[andyelbac]

I've checked out the scuttles available with White Ensign Models but unfortunately they only provide them for German WWIi and US Navy. They do offer scuttle 'eyebrows' in 1/200 but not the whole surround. I've decided to fit the Pontos scuttle surrounds to the hull and leave the superstructure scuttles as moulded. Hopefully I can share photos of the re-drilled scuttles soon prior to fixing the Pontos parts.

[foeth]

For about 20-25 EUR you can have your own set done at https://www.etchworks.eu/ . I can send you my eyebrow design as an example, if you wish...

[Rich75]

Good luck hope it goes OK 👍 

[Rich75]

Also I think you can get complete scuttle surrounds from microdesign in 1/200,  I doubt they'll be the same design as yours, but maybe worth getting a set to compare and might be OK for your superstructures though, if you wanted to add them ....

[andyelbac]

On 20/05/2022 at 18:08, foeth said:

For about 20-25 EUR you can have your own set done at https://www.etchworks.eu/ . I can send you my eyebrow design as an example, if you wish...

That would be very much appreciated.