Airfix Valiant...probably!

[Timmas]

I've been umming and ahhing about this for a day or two. It was a toss up between a Nimrod or Valiant...both Airfix and both 1/72. Since there are two Nimrod builds started already and only one Valiant so far (I'm interested to see how your's comes together Adam), I'll almost certainly go for the Valiant. No idea which version yet but I'll get round to that later.

[Adam Poultney]

Well a second Valiant would be a welcome addition to this group build. The Airfix kit is pretty nice, a few errors which are easily overlooked but the resin does exist for those with a desire to correct it.

Do you have any thoughts on which scheme you plan to go with? For an aircraft with such a short service life there are plenty of schemes available. I think my next 1/72 one when I get a chance to build it will be camouflaged (but I don't think I'll be getting any opportunities to build it any time soon unfortunately).

Going to leave a photo here of my previous 1/144 Valiant not quite a build... it's a repainted, modified and improved diecast. Much more accurate than anything in its scale...

 

 

 

[Timmas]

8 hours ago, Adam Poultney said:

Well a second Valiant would be a welcome addition to this group build. The Airfix kit is pretty nice, a few errors which are easily overlooked but the resin does exist for those with a desire to correct it.

Do you have any thoughts on which scheme you plan to go with? For an aircraft with such a short service life there are plenty of schemes available. I think my next 1/72 one when I get a chance to build it will be camouflaged (but I don't think I'll be getting any opportunities to build it any time soon unfortunately).

Going to leave a photo here of my previous 1/144 Valiant not quite a build... it's a repainted, modified and improved diecast. Much more accurate than anything in its scale...

 

 

 

Hi Adam. That's a nice one

I have a Noah's Ark of unmade V Bombers in my stash...two of each. This one will very likely be finished in anti-flash white but I have no idea which particular airframe I'll go with yet. The other one will probably end up camouflaged. I know what will happen after that...I'll get another one and do it in silver. That's how the addiction works !

[cardiff guy]

I recently had a bash at the tanker version, lovely little kit.

 

 

 

 

[Timmas]

I'm a bit late starting, but I decided to get the earlier Airfix version out of the stash...

 

 

I'm planning to recreate this one...

 

 

I found the photo here... https://www.thunder-and-lightnings.co.uk/valiant/index.php

 

It looks like XD816 which I think is now at Brooklands. Or at least, the nose section is. It's a bit grubby looking in this pic, which I rather like. However, it doesn't appear to have any wing tanks and I can't find any other photos of it anywhere with them fitted. Is is reasonable to assume therefore that they never were fitted?

 

If any of the Valiant expers here can verify that, I'd appreciate it.

 

Thanks in advance.

 

Tim

 

 

[Timmas]

Started on the cockpit...

 

 

Airfix don't include a crew so I found a couple of bods hanging around not doing much...

 

 

...and laid it all out. Airfix have included quite a lot of nice detail which no-one is ever going to see. But that's not the point...

 

 

Cockpit glued into one half of the fuselage using the other half to keep it aligned while the glue sets off...

 

 

 

[arfa1983]

Nice looking cockpit! 

[Adam Poultney]

So far so good, looking forward to seeing some more!

[stever219]

On 3/22/2022 at 3:54 PM, Timmas said:

I'm a bit late starting, but I decided to get the earlier Airfix version out of the stash...

 

 

I'm planning to recreate this one...

 

 

I found the photo here... https://www.thunder-and-lightnings.co.uk/valiant/index.php

 

It looks like XD816 which I think is now at Brooklands. Or at least, the nose section is. It's a bit grubby looking in this pic, which I rather like. However, it doesn't appear to have any wing tanks and I can't find any other photos of it anywhere with them fitted. Is is reasonable to assume therefore that they never were fitted?

 

If any of the Valiant expers here can verify that, I'd appreciate it.

 

Thanks in advance.

 

Tim

 

 

I've found a poor quality image of '816 about to refuel a pair of Javelins and a better quality partial of her (port rear fuselage).  Both show her with underwing tanks, full colour national markings rather than anti-flash but no unit markings.  Looking for more.

[Timmas]

13 hours ago, stever219 said:

I've found a poor quality image of '816 about to refuel a pair of Javelins and a better quality partial of her (port rear fuselage).  Both show her with underwing tanks, full colour national markings rather than anti-flash but no unit markings.  Looking for more.

Thanks Steve. That refuelling pic sounds interesting. I didn't realise 816 ever did any tanker duty because its history is a bit obscure. This is one of the shots I've found of her (sans tanks) which seems to show the markings in a sort of pale version of full strength but not antiflash. The photo doesn't appear to be particularly faded so maybe it's a trick of the light.

 

Pic credit: Chris England

 

[stever219]

9 hours ago, Timmas said:

Thanks Steve. That refuelling pic sounds interesting. I didn't realise 816 ever did any tanker duty because its history is a bit obscure. This is one of the shots I've found of her (sans tanks) which seems to show the markings in a sort of pale version of full strength but not antiflash. The photo doesn't appear to be particularly faded so maybe it's a trick of the light.

 

Pic credit: Chris England

 

@Timmas that image was taken at Abingdon when the RAF "celebrated" its 50th anniversary.  By that time '816 had become the only Valiant to be resparred.  She's still wearing 214 Squadron's emblem on the fin but the fin flash appears to be a mix of anti-flash blue and full strength red.  What little I can see of the fuselage roundel appears to be full anti-flash, as are the fuselage serials.  Such a crying shame that she wasn't preserved intact.

[Timmas]

42 minutes ago, stever219 said:

... that image was taken at Abingdon when the RAF "celebrated" its 50th anniversary.  By that time '816 had become the only Valiant to be resparred.  She's still wearing 214 Squadron's emblem on the fin but the fin flash appears to be a mix of anti-flash blue and full strength red.  What little I can see of the fuselage roundel appears to be full anti-flash, as are the fuselage serials.  Such a crying shame that she wasn't preserved intact.

Thanks Steve. The resparring fact is very interesting. I've also found some more pics of her. One is the b/w tanker shot you mention above (the tanker role is maybe why the extra fuel tanks were fitted) and the other is this one. The markings are cleary visible and, as you say do look to be in two different strengths, especially on the fin and fuselage although the blue doesn't seem to be as pale as 'proper' antiflash. I wonder how and why that happened...

 

[stever219]

38 minutes ago, Timmas said:

Thanks Steve. The resparring fact is very interesting. I've also found some more pics of her. One is the b/w tanker shot you mention above (the tanker role is maybe why the extra fuel tanks were fitted) and the other is this one. The markings are cleary visible and, as you say do look to be in two different strengths, especially on the fin and fuselage although the blue doesn't seem to be as pale as 'proper' antiflash. I wonder how and why that happened...

 

@Timmas Valiant colour scheme variations seem to be almost a law unto themselves and atypical of the other members of the V-Force, just scan through a few images and you’ll see.  I suppose some of the colour differences could be down to film, lighting, processing and umpteen dozen other variables but, as you suggest, you’d generally expect consistency within each image.  The under-wing tanks weren’t role specific and could be installed or removed dependent on mission requirements but their installation, especially when full, would certainly have helped with wing bending  moments p, but not the underlying fatigue cracking that dealt the Valiants their death blow.

[Timmas]

I've torn the muscles on my shoulder so not a huge amount has happened on this for the past few days. I have however done a bit more dry fitting and so far it looks like it will go together quite nicely.

 

The fit of the bomb bay seemed a bit odd to start with though...

 

 

...but doesn't look so bad from below although there is an awkward-looking gap in the lower fuselage to the rear of it...

 

 

I've decided to give her a full bomb load and er when I dug out the sprues I noticed a pin mark on every single bomb. All 21 of them. Hmmm, that's helpful...

 

 

...and then there are the fixing gates which probably could have been placed on the same alignment as the attaching lugs...

 

 

But since Airfix decided otherwise I know what I'll be doing for a chunk of this afternoon!

 

More as it happens...

 

 

 

 

[stever219]

@Timmas sorry to hear of your torn muscles and hope that they heal soon: having had a dislocated shoulder a while ago I know something like that can be surprisingly debilitating.

 

The area aft of the bomb bay is a movable ramp which I believe was intended to modify the airflow around the bomb bay enough to allow the thousand pounders to leave cleanly.  Unfortubatrly Airfix simplified things a bit so on my "doors open" Valiant I ran the tip of a saw blade along the inside corners a few times to give the impression that the ramp isn't integral with the side walls.

 

Not only have Airfux moulded the bombs in a modeller-,unfriendly fashion but they're not a particularly good representation of RAF weapons  the fins in particular are more representative of American stores.  Maybe if there's someone on here who's building their shiny new Airfux Vulcans with bomb bays closed or tooled up with Blue Steel they might have the bombs from that looking for a new home.

Edited April 9, 2022 by stever219

[Timmas]

1 hour ago, stever219 said:

@Timmas sorry to hear of your torn muscles and hope that they heal soon: having had a dislocated shoulder a while ago I know something like that can be surprisingly debilitating.

 

The area aft of the bomb bay is a movable ramp which I believe was intended to modify the airflow around the bomb bay enough to allow the thousand pounders to leave cleanly.  Unfortubatrly Airfix simplified things a bit so on my "doors open" Valiant I ran the tip of a saw blade along the inside corners a few times to give the impression that the ramp isn't integral with the side walls.

 

Not only have Airfux moulded the bombs in a modeller-,unfriendly fashion but they're not a particularly good representation of RAF weapons  the fins in particular are more representative of American stores.  Maybe if there's someone on here who's building their shiny new Airfux Vulcans with bomb bays closed or tooled up with Blue Steel they might have the bombs from that looking for a new home.

Thanks Steve, unbelievably the shoulder injury came about by helping Mrs T stack some bedding onto the top shelf of the airing cupboard. Who'd have thought tha something as straightforward as that could pull a load of muscles. After visit to the doc in the morning I was sent down to the minor injuries unit....and sat there for about three hours. But hey ho. Lessons learnt and all that; one of which is to try and avoid domestic duties for fear of physical injury. I don't think I'll get away with that one but it's worth a shot !

 

Good tip about the ramp. I did wonder what the purpose of it was.

 

I noticed the bombs are a bit off too after I went back to T & L where I saw this...

 

 

I have wondered about looking for some aftermarket bombs or as you say, somebody might be willing to donate or sell me their's from a Vulcan. I'll have to ask around. If not, I'll make do with what I've got.

 

 

[Timmas]

I've just ordered a load of bombs. They're coming from the Czech Republic and will be here in a day or two.

 

I do hope the government doesn't get to hear about them...it could very likely put two and two together and come up with the wrong answer 

[Timmas]

While waiting fo things to arrive, set off and otherwise 'happen', I thought I'd do some sub assemblies and have glued the intakes together. Blimey, there are some tricky seams inside those, as well as a few visible ejector pin marks which will be visible if they're not dealt with too. Jeez.

 

Some wiser heads on here have advocated pouring thick emulsion paint down the insides of things like this and letting that fill the gaps. I'll have a go with Mr Surfacer first and see if that does the trick...

 

 

[Adam Poultney]

The Airfix valiant intake seams are quite difficult yes, thankfully though there is an aftermarket option for one piece resin parts 

[Timmas]

21 minutes ago, Adam Poultney said:

The Airfix valiant intake seams are quite difficult yes, thankfully though there is an aftermarket option for one piece resin parts 

I think I'll stick with the kit ones for this one and look at resin replacements on my next Valiant. That's assuming I make a decent job of the filling. I must admit, I thought the old tool Vulcan intakes were a pain but these look to be in a league of their own!

[Timmas]

Some progress. While fiddling around with the intakes, I did a loose dry fit to see how the fuse halves lined up and to check how the wing assembly will fit. I think it's going to go together quite well...

 

 

When I got stuck into the intakes I checked back at Thunder and Lightnings and noticed there should be a small horizontal bar between the two verticals...

 

...so I added them with plasticard...

 

 

...and glued the intakes into the lower wing halves. Some of the edges look a bit rough in the photos but they're much neater in real life...

 

 

Then glued the wing halves together...

 

 

There are a couple of very delicate connections around the small circular intakes just inboard of the main intakes but these have gone together quite nicely too. They'll need a small amount of filler but nothing too bad...

 

 

I can't glue the fuselage halves together yet because I want to fix the bombs in into the bomb bay beforehand. I've cleaned the kit parts up but I'm still waiting for the new ones to arrive. I'll have a think about how to straighten out the bombay up though as it's quite warped. Maybe a dunk into very hot water will do the trick...

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Timmas]

Yay, the bombs have arrived. I've bought 24 so will have three spares...

 

 

They're lovely replicas and very different from the Airfix offerings on the left. The stubs behind the fins need nipping off. I won't add the fuses to the fronts...

 

 

All painted, and ready for decals...

 

 

The bomb bay is in the background. I still haven't been able to completey straighten it out but it's better than it was.

 

I can get on with this now. More to follow.

 

 

 

[Timmas]

The warped bombay was still bothering me until I had a brainwave...coffee stirrers. I made a couple of splints by glueing two together and fixing them to the topside. They seem to do the trick. It doesn't look like it in this photo but the bay is now compleely level...

 

 

Then I realised that the bombs wouldn't fit; the Eduard ones are longer than Airfix's and the spacings between the bomb racks wasn't exactly the same either. I don't know if the mistake was mine or if the locating points weren't in quite the right place, but the central bomb rack was slightly off centre so I've moved it. It only needed to move a millimetre at the most but because it was so firmly glued firmly into its locating lug I had to saw the back off to free the part...

 

 

A quick test with blu tak and the bombs do now fit...

 

 

 

 

 

[Timmas]

Slow progress but the bombs are all in now...

 

 

They were far more fiddly than I imagined. The shape of them is quite different from the kit's offerings and they don't have the locating slots provided by Airfix either so there was quite a lot of filing involved to achieve a suitable fixing 'flat spot'.

 

I also gave them some random weathering as I assume they were stored outside in the elements. I couldn't find any contemporary reference photos but did find these wartime pics which gave me a guide...

 

 

 

[Timmas]

Progress on this is very slow. I've got tremendous pain in my hands and wrists which is limiting my dexterity. The doc has suggested I might have developed arthritis which isn't welcome news but I'll have to wait and see. Someone suggested that after tearing my shoulder a couple of months ago, it might be a trapped nerve in my neck. Whatever it is, it's bloody awkward...I can't even get the top off a jar of marmalade at the moment. I have an appointment with a chiropracter on Friday so I'm hoping he/she can pin the problem down and fix it. I hope so as I don't want to lose the use of my hands.

 

Anyway, the wings and tailplane are glued on and the bomb bay's in place The landing gear doors are also closed up too. They're quite a good fit ......

 

 

The doors suffered from a similar warpage as the top of the bomb bay, so coffee stirrers had to be employed again to straighten things out. The doors are stil slightly wobbly looking but they've done the trick generally. Because of where I had to attach the coffee stirrers, the doors have moved inwards so they're a bit more inboard than they ought to be. But I can't do anything about that now as they're all glued in place. I've painted the stirrers black so that when everything else is done they won't be visible...

 

 

This is a good kit actually. It's going together pretty well...

 

I'd always thought of the Valiant as the ugly duckling among the V Bombers. But because I've been looking a it a lot in recent weeks, I've come to realise that it was actually rather beautiful. It doesn't have the aggressive appearance of the Vulcan or Victor (which, as it acquired more lumps and bumps became ever more mean looking) and it's appearance disguises the fact that it was a no compromise warplane.

 

Anyway, this is how it looks from above. I drilled out the cooling vent at the base of the tail to give it a better rounded shape (and to thin down the surrounding bodywork) and did the same with the vents beside the main intakes...

 

A small amount of fillier was needed between the wing section and the fuselage, and a blast of primer reveals it's looking ok...

 

 

Next thing to do is mask the canopy and get some paint on.