Rabbit Leader Posted January 29, 2022 Share Posted January 29, 2022 Just wondering if anyone out there can answer some questions about South Africa’s early model Puma helicopters? From what I’ve seen so far, France delivered twenty early model SA330C Puma’s to the SAAF around 1969-70. Initially these were painted in an overall glossy Olive Drab / Dark Green scheme which may have been a similar colour to how France painted their Pumas as well? Does anyone know what this overall paint colour is? Later on in their service lives, these and later Puma purchases were painted in a two colour combination camouflage pattern. I am of the opinion that these colours are BS298 Olive Drab and BS450 Dark Earth. Are these correct paint matches and does anyone know what year South Africa’s Puma’s transitioned from the overall green colour to camouflage? Cheers and kind regards.. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blimpyboy Posted January 29, 2022 Share Posted January 29, 2022 (edited) Have you seen this page: https://www.sa-transport.co.za/aircraft/articles/puma/puma_sa_330.html? It has these pictures (and many more) and a good history of SAAF Pumas. This forum thread may be useful, too: https://www.saairforce.co.za/forum/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=4469&sid=d6068eba1638124b50b2c9d5b3ab94f6 Happy painting! Edited January 29, 2022 by Blimpyboy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Leader Posted January 29, 2022 Author Share Posted January 29, 2022 Thanks @Blimpyboy, yes I have come across these images and that website, however I’ll admit I’ve also read that the original scheme was in ‘French’ colours (whatever that means) and the camo green was BS298 which is Royal Navy Olive Drab. I do respect Mike Keeps notes so I’d like to explore if there is an official paint match for this ‘French’ Olive Drab. Cheers.. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blimpyboy Posted January 30, 2022 Share Posted January 30, 2022 (edited) 3 hours ago, Rabbit Leader said: ‘French’ colours Yeah, I'd read (somewhere...) that the French delivery colour for Pumas was replaced with a two-tone scheme that used different SA colours. I notice; however, that the pictures above show a continued use of the original green shade in conjunction with the brown in the subsequent two-tone scheme! Is there a BS colour called 'dark olive drab', or is that an anglicised version of the original French paint colour name? From what (extremely little) I know of SANS 1091, I can see there's an 'olive green' (No. 20) - but I'm in no way familiar with SAAF paint standards/colours, so I'd be guessing about No. 20's use on SA Pumas. To confuse matters further, I found an old copy of Scale Aircraft Modelling from 1980 (Vol. 3, No. 3, December 1980), which lists the overall green colour as being "overall gloss olive drab". This is described, in the colour key, as being 298 of BS.381C. As with the pictures shown earlier, this green is also shown as having been carried over into the two-tone scheme. Now - and a cautious note regarding my general ignorance about such matters - I suspect the use of a BS.381 colour in the initial delivery scheme to have been unlikely. I am also a bit leery about the continued use of a French green in the later two-tone scheme... Maybe this thread will yield better results: A long shot, perhaps, but there may also be something you can glean from these pages: http://www.arcforums.com/forums/air/index.php?/topic/302105-french-army-pumagazelle-colors/ and http://militaryphotoreport.blogspot.com/2013/10/couleurs-otan-et-etude-des-peintures.html?m=1 Hopefully, some nice French modellers will jump in with useful information for you! Edited January 30, 2022 by Blimpyboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Leader Posted January 30, 2022 Author Share Posted January 30, 2022 Thanks again @Blimpyboy, those links are interesting so perhaps its just whatever colour the French Army used on their Gazelles and Pumas at the time. I’m starting to think its more of a Dark Green then an Olive colour as this close up colour photo seems to suggest. I’m hoping @Etiennedup doesn’t mind me posting this image here and if he has any colour information, may be able to share it with us on here. Cheers and regards.. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etiennedup Posted January 30, 2022 Share Posted January 30, 2022 Hiya Dave, According to Ron Belling in his book "A portrait of Military Aviation in South Africa" he states that they were delivered from December 1969 in overall BS Matt Olive Drab and later changed to Dark Earth/ Olive Drab. However, from memory I seem to remember the first one's had a definite sheen on the Olive Drab as in the above picture ( but that was fifty years ago 🥴) Cheers, Etienne. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Leader Posted January 30, 2022 Author Share Posted January 30, 2022 I appreciate the quick reply @Etiennedup, so its looks like these Puma’s were delivered in British Colours as opposed to French. I suppose if i try to match the glossy green with what’s in the above photo I should hopefully come close. If you happen to have anymore photos from this same period, I’d be most pleased to see them. Cheers and regards.. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Hugo Posted January 30, 2022 Share Posted January 30, 2022 @Rabbit Leader, if you on facebook go to this page SA Colours and MArkings, that is run by William MArshall, icw Piet van Schalkwyk who are far more knowledgable on UDF./SDF/SNDF/SAAF colours than I am. You will get all the answers you need. Also Geoff Timms posts there and he is extremeley well versed on SAAF helicopters FWI the Frelons were delivered in French Olive Green BSC 220 Iwill go through my scnas and see what early Puma shots I have although TBH I were still a nipper then so any pics are from other sources 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etiennedup Posted January 30, 2022 Share Posted January 30, 2022 Dave, here are a few scans from books and magazines. All the best............ Etienne. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Leader Posted January 30, 2022 Author Share Posted January 30, 2022 @Charlie Hugo and @Etiennedup, I am extremely grateful your your excellent contributions to this post. I have just been accepted into the FB page as suggested and from a quick glance it looks to be an excellent reference source, I’m very happy about that. The additional photographs provided by Etienne are fantastic and I would say there could be a good link between Charlie’s advice (Frelons were delivered in French Olive Green BSC 220) and the last photograph showing one parked besides Puma 122. To my eye, the greens look very similar if not the same. I will post a question on the FB page a little later. It’s Monday morning down here and that means getting ready for work. Cheers and very kind regards.. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NFR Posted February 16, 2022 Share Posted February 16, 2022 Can't wait to see the build Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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