81-er Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 The great results you've been getting from it are making me want to have a go at black basing. I think I may have to dig out a test mule over the weekend James 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbadbadge Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 Looks great John with your paint effects. Cracking work. Chris 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortCummins Posted January 27, 2022 Author Share Posted January 27, 2022 6 hours ago, 81-er said: The great results you've been getting from it are making me want to have a go at black basing. I think I may have to dig out a test mule over the weekend James thanks James black basing will give you "uneven" finish to your paint, it can look as if you've sprayed the paint poorly however what I'm trying to achieve is "different" tones across the airframe, "in real life" the metal skin of an aircraft won't stay "flat" once the aircraft has been in the air, different stresses cause the aluminium to slightly buckle and therefore the painted surface will appear either darker or lighter. the "more traditional" way to achieve this is pre and post-shading. I never really got on with pre-shading, I always made the model look a bit like a patchwork quilt. The marble layer, in black basing, is really an extension of this however it's not confined to panel lines. give it a go, its not for everyone but if you get results you like then however you do it is good! 5 hours ago, bigbadbadge said: Looks great John with your paint effects. Cracking work. Chris thanks Chris photographing doesn't really show it to its best effect, I need to get some better light to show the subtleties of how the under colours effect the top coat but I do find adding different colours to the marble layer helps to start the weathering process, it also can act as a "practice run" before you add oil stains and exhaust stains proper. rgds John(shortCummins) 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortCummins Posted January 27, 2022 Author Share Posted January 27, 2022 I decided to add the wing cannon, I must take care not to knock them off! The underside was masked in preparation for the green and grey top camo’, this will be “over-sprayed” solid green later on. Before adding the ocean grey I added some Extreme metal AK 488 matte aluminium to area that I plan to “chip”. Liquid mask was then applied to these areas, with a tooth pick and sponge, and then a marble layer of Tamiya XF-68 NATO brown, XF-24 dark grey and XF-27 black green was applied… …followed by the “main” marble layer of XF-82 ocean grey . A blend coat of XF-82 ocean gray was then applied in thin coats. Next I’ll be applying the green camo’. until next time as always, any suggestions, criticisms or comments will be gratefully received. rgds John(shortCummins) 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortCummins Posted January 28, 2022 Author Share Posted January 28, 2022 Because the grey green camo’ will be over painted I decided to try my hand a free handing the RAF dark green. My weapon of choice is a Harder & Steenbeck Infinity with a 0.2 needle, the paint, Tamiya XF-81 dark green thinned 50/50 with Mr Color self levelling thinner. My first task was to mark the outlines… Once again a marble layer was applied, first with XF-81, as I already had it loaded in the airbrush… …followed by hobby color H302 green FS34092 and Tamiya XF-27. I think that my “marble squiggles” could have been a bit “tighter”, if I had masked the grey areas I think it would have made the job easier, I was very conscious of not causing too much overspray. Highly thinned Tamiya XF-81 was then sprayed in thin coats to blend the marble layers. Next I’ll be preparing for applying the Russian green. until next time as always, any suggestions, criticisms or comments will be gratefully received. rgds John(shortCummins) 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81-er Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 It's looking good John James 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark.au Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 Looks very nice indeed, the freehand camo allows for a tonne of variation and texture, almost too bad it’ll be mostly covered up! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortCummins Posted January 29, 2022 Author Share Posted January 29, 2022 7 hours ago, 81-er said: It's looking good John James thanks James I need to get some proper lights to take photos, the subtile variations don't show that well at the moment 1 hour ago, mark.au said: Looks very nice indeed, the freehand camo allows for a tonne of variation and texture, almost too bad it’ll be mostly covered up! thanks Mark it is a shame, its the first time I've free-handed the camo and I'm pleased with the result however, I really like the "Russian green" scheme and hopefully I'll be able to "suggest" the grey and green camo underneath providing I'm not too heavy handed with the over spray? rgds John(shortCummins) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortCummins Posted January 29, 2022 Author Share Posted January 29, 2022 My idea for the Russian green scheme is that the aircraft would have been delivered with the grey and green camo’ and then over-sprayed at a later date. I’m going to assume that the aircraft had been flown in the grey and green, and would have had wear and tear, dirt, chips etc. so I’ll add some weathering to this paintwork before over spraying. I’m only going to work on the upper surfaces of the aircraft at this time, I’ll weather the underside later. I first removed the masking fluid along the wing roots. Additional chips were brush painted with vallejo metal color 77.717 dull aluminium to try and make them look a bit more natural. Exhaust stains were added by spraying a very highly thinned, approx 98% thinner 2% paint, mixture, XF-68 NATO brown and XF-27 black green. Everything was then given a protective coat of aqua gloss. Next I’ll be spraying the Russian green. until next time as always, any suggestions, criticisms or comments will be gratefully received. rgds John(shortCummins) 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbadbadge Posted January 29, 2022 Share Posted January 29, 2022 It does seem a shame to cover it up John as it certainly looks good . This will look good when covered with the Rusdian green, if your Malta Spitfire is anything to go by. Looking forward to seeing this. Great work Chris 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortCummins Posted January 30, 2022 Author Share Posted January 30, 2022 10 hours ago, bigbadbadge said: It does seem a shame to cover it up John as it certainly looks good . This will look good when covered with the Rusdian green, if your Malta Spitfire is anything to go by. Looking forward to seeing this. Great work Chris thanks Chris I need to be carful with the Russian green, not enough and she'll look insipid, too much and I'll obliterate the "under camo". Still its all good practice getting the paint mixture correct. By-the-bye I've found another Spitfire scheme that will require over-spraying a grey/green camo, this time an all black(ish) night fighter, that'll be coming after this build, of maybe in a couple of builds time depending on how quickly Eduard sends me their MkV "overtrees" and if I can source the aircraft code letters, I may have a go at making them myself?, as I've plenty of Montex roundels from previous builds, but that's for another time, I must finish this one first! rgds John(shortCummins) 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunny Posted January 30, 2022 Share Posted January 30, 2022 Lovely work John - I also use an H&S Infinity, and XF81 is my DG of choice! Cheers, Roger 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortCummins Posted January 30, 2022 Author Share Posted January 30, 2022 You may be wondering why I went through the effort of applying the “RAF” grey green camo’ if I’m going to cover it up, and even more of a waste of time was the black basing marble layers!? Well you could be right, if I “over do” this next stage I could loose all of the subtile paint work, so fingers crossed I can apply the Russian green with a light touch. My idea is to allow the “under camo” to be apparent. To protect the grey green camo’ I gave the airframe a coat of aqua gloss varnish. Once the varnish had fully cured I applied a couple of coats of hairspray, I’ve followed Mike Rinaldi’s advice and used TRESemme no 3 firm hold . This was left for 20 minutes or so and then I sprayed Alkan AMT-4 green in two or three of light coats, “In real life” the under camo’ doesn’t show up quite as much, I could add another layer but I’m getting close to “hiding” the under camo’ and I don’t want to risk it, maybe next time? I did “extra” AMT-4 to the aluminium wing roots. I let the paint dry for over an hour and then various areas were “chipped” to show both the “under camo” and some of the aluminium previously painted. Wing cannon access and wing root. Top cowl. Wing root and cannon access. Radio compartment. Apart from the aluminium the chipping is quite subtle, the under dark green colour hardly shows and the grey is little better, however its more or less the effect I was after. Next I’ll be spraying the white tail. until next time as always, any suggestions, criticisms or comments will be gratefully received. rgds John(shortCummins) 9 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortCummins Posted January 30, 2022 Author Share Posted January 30, 2022 1 hour ago, Dunny said: Lovely work John - I also use an H&S Infinity, and XF81 is my DG of choice! Cheers, Roger thanks Roger I've used my H&S infinity since I returned to the hobby, I also use a H&S ultra, with a .6 needle, for primer. Someone mentioned getting an airbrush solely to use with metallic colours, this sounds like a good idea. I wish that H&S gave you the option of different coloured rear sections of the airbrush, not because I don't like the dark red of my current one but because if I did get one specifically for metallic paint I'd like to "see" which is which easily. recently I've started using MRP lacquers, I've not got their RAF dark green yet but I plan to when I come to the end of my XF-81. A good thing about the MRP paints is you can use them "straight from the bottle", you don't need to thin them so there's no guess work in getting the mixture "just right" for spraying. Another bonus is that being lacquer they dry really quickly, a downside is they are a bit smelly, I always wear a respirator whatever paint I'm spraying, however if you like the smell of lemon drops then the smell won't be an issue. rgds John(shortCummins) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortCummins Posted January 30, 2022 Author Share Posted January 30, 2022 The tail and horizontal stabilisers were masked and a couple of coats of hairspray applied before a thin layers of MRP-004 white were applied. 20 minutes or so later the rudder was lightly chipped. Next I’ll be applying the decals. until next time as always, any suggestions, criticisms or comments will be gratefully received. rgds John(shortCummins) 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbadbadge Posted January 30, 2022 Share Posted January 30, 2022 Looks very nice indeed John , it's a great effect. Cracking job Chris 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortCummins Posted January 30, 2022 Author Share Posted January 30, 2022 6 hours ago, bigbadbadge said: Looks very nice indeed John , it's a great effect. Cracking job Chris thanks Chris I think maybe I should have been a bit braver and gone for another coat, having said that I'm happy with the result rgds John(shotCummins) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve 1602 Posted January 30, 2022 Share Posted January 30, 2022 Looking nice John. The white tail really stands out. A quick question on hairspray… I’ve read elsewhere that it’s to allow chipping, but does it make the rest of the paintwork fragile (or do yiu target where it goes?) Steve 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortCummins Posted January 30, 2022 Author Share Posted January 30, 2022 1 hour ago, Steve 1602 said: Looking nice John. The white tail really stands out. A quick question on hairspray… I’ve read elsewhere that it’s to allow chipping, but does it make the rest of the paintwork fragile (or do yiu target where it goes?) Steve thanks Steve the way that hairspray works is that you put down your "base" layer, the grey/green camo in my case, then apply the hairspray, wait until it drys, around 20 minutes, then spray your top coat. As I was using acrylic paint I waited about an hour, then wetted a brush with water and "painted" the water in the area I wanted to chip, the water "activates" the hairspray causing the top layer of paint to flake off. I used an old stubby brush to prod the area I wanted to chip, this was done carefully and once I saw paint being removed I stoped and moved to another area and repeated the process. If I wanted to remove more paint I went back to the area after some time, trying to chip a lot in one go will 99 times out of 100 remove far too much, so slowly is the best way. In the past I have used cocktail sticks to gently pick at the paint, other scratches can be achieved by carefully using blunt(ish) blades of scrapers. "in theory" only the areas wetted will be workable, "dry" areas should be the same as any "normal" paint however, once I've finished my chipping I give everything a protective layer of varnish, "just in case". One area of concern would be applying decals, if the decal or "setter" softens the paint then there's a chance that the paint will lift, ie the hairspray gets "activated". You could wait for the hairspray to fully cure, depending on the hairspray and how much of it was used this could take anything from a couple of days to a week or more, I've never tried to chip paint after a few hours so I don't know how long it would take to be "safe" without the protective layer? In this instance I only applied hairspray to the wing roots forward, I knew I was going to mask for the white tail so I was carful not to get hairspray in that area until after I'd masked for the white paint. The MRP paint is a lacquer based paint, the chipping is far harder to get started with lacquers, I'm guessing that as acrylic is water based its easier for the water to get to the hairspray? I used a toothpick on the MRP paint, stabbing it with an old paintbrush didn't appear to have any effect. rgds John(shortCummins) 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve 1602 Posted January 30, 2022 Share Posted January 30, 2022 Thanks John - I may have to give that a go on a paint mule at some point. I’ve just started using weathering pencils which I really like, but I think the chipping you’ve done looks more realistic. Steve 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortCummins Posted January 30, 2022 Author Share Posted January 30, 2022 10 minutes ago, Steve 1602 said: Thanks John - I may have to give that a go on a paint mule at some point. I’ve just started using weathering pencils which I really like, but I think the chipping you’ve done looks more realistic. Steve the thing that pencils give you is far more control, hairspray won't unless your Mike Rinaldi and he's been practicing for years! nearly every time I tried hairspray I've got a little bit better at it. I think the main problem is you've little or no control over how much paint comes off, it can appear that nothing is happening for ages and then all of a sudden far too much comes off! that's why I work in small areas for a small amount of time coming back if needed. a paint mule to test on is a really good idea, at least you'll start to get a feel for it rgds Jon(shortCummins) 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark.au Posted January 30, 2022 Share Posted January 30, 2022 Thanks for the explanation John, the technique clearly works well as your excellent results show. I am absolutely going to have a go at this at the next opportunity. The Spitfire itself is looking fabulous, I’ve enjoyed your methodical and clinical approach - it’s producing great results. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81-er Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 Great results as ever John, I'm looking forward to the next update. Seeing the talk about airbrushes, I've just ordered myself a UMP Apex. That looks like quite a nice bit of kit for the money, and it has the option of little coloured tail markers to denote which brush you're using if you've got a couple. Rather looking forward to it arriving. James 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortCummins Posted January 31, 2022 Author Share Posted January 31, 2022 1 hour ago, 81-er said: Great results as ever John, I'm looking forward to the next update. Seeing the talk about airbrushes, I've just ordered myself a UMP Apex. That looks like quite a nice bit of kit for the money, and it has the option of little coloured tail markers to denote which brush you're using if you've got a couple. Rather looking forward to it arriving. James that's a good airbrush, UMP have rebranded a Badger patriot? with a .35 "progressive" needle, I think the idea is that the "harder" you push the spray leaver the "larger" the needle size becomes. the key to using an airbrush is practice, getting your paint mixture thin enough to spray will take experimentation, and annoyingly you'll think you've cracked it only to find the next time it doesn't work as before, something will have changed, you've not shaken/stirred the paint enough, humidity effecting the paint, tip dry (paint build up on the needle tip), the moons in retrograde, your not wearing your lucky underpants etc. etc. you'll get there, if you don't get perfect results first time don't be discouraged, practice is the key rgds John(shortCummins) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81-er Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 Thanks for the tips John. I've been having fun learning about how double-action brushes work with a JVR (had a single action as a teen). The issue I have there is I'm not sure what needle size it has as it was 2nd hand (I think it's a 0.3, but not 100%) and the "universal" needle/nozzle set I bought doesn't work. It fits, I just can't get any air or paint through it with anything other than the needle it came with. I did well clearing some junk on eBay, so decided to treat myself. James 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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