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Looking for help on Russian P-40's


yeehah1

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15 11 2021

Afternoon people

I have Wolfpack's P-40 Warhawk part 2 / Lend Lease Warhawk/Tomahawk in VVS sheet ... WD48016. I am planning to make White 51 / Tomahawk Mk. IIB, 14th Army AF. I'm trying to find a little more information on it or maybe some photos but having trouble locating such. I did find The P-40 in Soviet Aviation – Lend-Lease  website but it doesn't hold any information on this aircraft.

 

I'm just wondering if there are any books or sites that might have some info.

 

Also...I tried to post the website address as a link but it didn't paste in as such. Is it not allowed to post links in topics? (just wondering . I haven't been on this site for a while)

 

Thanks in advance

 

Liam

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1 hour ago, yeehah1 said:

I have Wolfpack's P-40 Warhawk part 2 / Lend Lease Warhawk/Tomahawk in VVS sheet ... WD48016. I am planning to make White 51 / Tomahawk Mk. IIB, 14th Army AF. I'm trying to find a little more information on it or maybe some photos but having trouble locating such.

looked up the sheet

https://spruebrothers.com/wpddec48016-1-48-wolfpack-decal-p-40-warhawk-part-2-lend-lease-warhawk-tomahawk-in-vvs/

wpddec48016__91724.1612229384.jpg?c=1

 

Not very impressed, says 'we looked at some profile we found online' for research.  Note usual practice was to paint out RAF/US markings before delivery.

note, compare 53 on the sheet with the photos and profiles here

https://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/lendlease/p-40/p-40.html

 

ah, the link on 53 has gone,  which is here

https://lend-lease.net/articles-en/p-40-recovery-in-russia/

 

note there is also a P-40E  '51'

 

 

p-40e_03.jpg

 

interestingly  '51' is also on the Authetic decals sheet

22501_2_atd-48-60_1.jpg

 

 

This does provide a unit

 

@Massimo Tessitori maybe able to add more,  his is the site linked.

 

note here 

http://ava.org.ru/iap/126.htm

 

there are some P-4B/C images, the crashed white AH471 is new too me,  and a clearer image of AH965 in camo, as well as in winter white. Wolfpack has this with light blue undersides, which I doubt. 

 

Ah, finally

here

http://ava.org.ru/iap/20g.htm

 

P-40B/C '51'

http://ava.org.ru/iap/20g/p40-51-1941.jpg

 

please note though the deal profile shows the port side, the photo shows the starboard side....  and they have done a poor job of  numbers, well the '5' 

wpddec48016b.jpg

 

still, nothing a sharp pair of scissors won't sort but really pretty shoddy.....  sorry for the rambling @yeehah1  but the trail maybe of use for you and others.   the ava.org.ru site is packed with great photos, as long as you know what unit you are looking for!!!! 

Searching it otherwise can be tricky, but new pics keep being posted and so much more solid information on VVS unit markings is being pinned down as a result.

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2 hours ago, Troy Smith said:

still, nothing a sharp pair of scissors won't sort but really pretty shoddy.....  sorry for the rambling @yeehah1  but the trail maybe of use for you and others.   the ava.org.ru site is packed with great photos, as long as you know what unit you are looking for!!!! 

Searching it otherwise can be tricky, but new pics keep being posted and so much more solid information on VVS unit markings is being pinned down as a result.

15 11 2021

@Troy Smith thank you for such a complete response.  The 20 GIAP (147 IAP) Air Force KA - aircraft and emblems (ava.org.ru)  is amazing. I love the Hurricanes depicted here. 

Would I be right in thinking that the photo and profile of White 51 are two different P-40's? 

 

Thanks again for your help 👍 😊

 

Liam

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29 minutes ago, yeehah1 said:

Would I be right in thinking that the photo and profile of White 51 are two different P-40's? 

I got a bit rambling Liam, but I posted two different white 51's,  one is a P-40E, the colour photo of a salvaged plane.

 

the other a P-40B,  one of the Wolfpack  decals is of this plane in the photo

P-40B/C  white '51'

http://ava.org.ru/iap/20g/p40-51-1941.jpg

 

I was pointing out they didn't get the '5' right.  Hope this makes sense now?  

 

re 

Quote

The 20 GIAP (147 IAP) Air Force KA - aircraft and emblems (ava.org.ru)  is amazing. I love the Hurricanes depicted here. 

the hurricane profiles are fomr the Osprey Soviet Hurricane Aces book, certainly one of the better books in the series, but no supporting photo for the profiles in the page.  

http://ava.org.ru/iap/20g.htm

 

The book author and profiler are Russian, and I counted 20 photos of VVS Huricanes I'd not seen, but I'd still prefer the reference photo ;) 

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Is the P-40K white 36 on the Authentic decals sheet a two seater and do I see correct that there is a bent behind the cockpit of P-40K white 96 in front of the fold in the instructions?The other drawings on the right side do not have that bent.

 

Thank you very much

 

Saluti

 

Giampiero

 

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1 minute ago, GiampieroSilvestri said:

Is the P-40K white 36 on the Authentic decals sheet a two seater

White 34 is a 2 seater with a rear seater camera operator. There are details of this conversion,  Sovietwarplanes.

http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/lendlease/p-40/tapani/p-40k-m-n/34twoseater.htm

 

and there is a drawing which shows the camera equipment layout, in a book, aand I think was posted on Sovietwarplanes

 

note the P-40K below white 34, is also photodocumented

 

 

1 minute ago, GiampieroSilvestri said:

 

and do I see correct that there is a bent behind the cockpit of P-40K white 96 in front of the fold in the instructions?The other drawings on the right side do not have that bent.

 

it's just a crease in the instructions. 

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15 11 2021

Thanks again Troy and also I should thank @dogsbody for his contribution as well.

 

Love the markings on these aircraft and that two-seater version on the Authentic decal  sheet looks like it might be a very good modelling subject.

 

For someone else 🙂

 

Liam

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There were also the elusive Klimov M-105-engined P-40's, so elusive that this is the only photo documentation I have ever seen of one of these birds.

spacer.png

Klimov based the M-105 engine on the Hispano Suiza 12-cylinder motor that powered pretty much every French inline-engined fighter in WWII, so when their lend-lease P-40 Allison engines had worn out and every single fighter available was needed on the front lines, the Russians figured they'd adapt, overcome and survive, chucking the Klimov into their Warhawks and adding what appears to be a Yak spinner to boot.

 

Here's a translated from Russian source on the Klimov-engined P-40's:

 

"The spring of 1942 parts, fighting near Leningrad, experienced an acute shortage of spare engines, 'Allison'. Because of this large number of 'Tomahawks' and 'Kittyhawk' motors which have developed a resource turned out to be laid. In the 154th Regiment in May 1942 without engines were almost all cars. This was all the more intolerable, that fighter at the time, and so sorely lacking.On 1st aviarembaze 13 VA in Leningrad at the initiative of the commander of the 154th Regiment and Colonel A.A.Matveeva P.Malikova engaged alteration P-40 under the Soviet M-105P engine and M-105R. Total thus been converted more than 40 fighters including several double training machines. This forced alteration degrade the P-40. Maximum speed at the ground with M-105P engine and propellers-61P has fallen from 477 to 465 km / h. Most of the works thus adapted aircraft was concentrated in the 196th Regiment, acting on Ladoga. In January 1943 four "Tomahawks" M-105 (including one home-made floor layout with an open cockpit and engine of the M-105R) of 156 a regiment were attached to the 12-th separate spotter squadrons. They flew there until December, covering reconnaissance Su-2 and Curtis O-52, with daily departures."

 

Here's an M-105, and a link if you wanna see more close-ups of the engine at Victory Park in Moscow.

spacer.png

 

Bigg Tim over at LSP built a wicked awesome version of Red 20 from the 196th IAP, here's the WIP.

 

Just thought I'd add this bit of trivia to the mix, good luck with your VVS bird.

 

- Thomaz

Edited by TAG
added info + link
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4 hours ago, TAG said:

so elusive that this is the only photo documentation I have ever seen of one of these birds.

so I though too,

 

  until I found this, co-incidentally today 

https://zaika70.livejournal.com/88233.html

 

a P-40B with a M-105 it seems , the below courtesy of auto translate

"The one that many have read about, but have not yet seen - in the articles, starting with the ancient "AS", it is only mentioned that along with the P-40E, Tomahawks were also sawed on the 1st ARB under the M-105. But the illustrative row was tight and the same photo of the P-40E wandered around in all publications. And so, in the album of the head of the aircraft department of the 1st ARB I.I. Gorbachev, along with this canonical photo, two fragments of another car flashed. And if purely by plumage, you cannot always distinguish the 36th hawk from the 40th, not to mention the unambiguous definition of A, B, C, etc. in the 40x family.

That is a purely British version of the sighting devices + visible course machine guns and wing port plugs leave no doubt that this is a Tomahawk II. And the classic common exhaust manifold also unambiguously informs about the M-105 installed on this machine."
 

as well as much better version of that famed P-40E with M-105

 

4 hours ago, TAG said:

Bigg Tim over at LSP built a wicked awesome version of Red 20 from the 196th IAP,

one of the blinkin' profiles only references.   LSP brims with enthusiasm, but not always with accuracy I have found.   

 

 

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