AIRFIX 2022 rumours/thoughts/chat thread...

[Adam Poultney]

Just now, trickydicky210 said:

Is there a Battle for scanning or drawings available?

 

a few surviving examples to scan

[TEXANTOMCAT]

Yep one at Hendon one in Belgium and at least one in Canada IIRC

 

TT

[ckw]

14 minutes ago, Adam Poultney said:

If Airfix can justify a Walrus or a Whitley, I'm sure they can justify a Battle. It's a Battle of Britain aircraft, that in itself will increase the sales somewhat. 

The Battle is also a Victoria Cross aircraft, so they can use this as part of the box art/promotion as they did for the Beaufort

 

Cheers

 

Colin

[VMA131Marine]

10 hours ago, Dave Fleming said:

 

SAM-2 yes, The clear mould for the Islander was lost, but Airfix had a new one made when the kit was re-released in the 2000s

The SAM-2 mold and the one for the SS France went missing somewhere around the time all the molds were moved to the Heller factory in Trun. I don’t know how you lose a hunk of metal that weighs up to a ton, but there we are. A number of molds have been “retired” having worn out or become obsolete and these would include (all 1/72 except where noted)

the first Boulton-Paul Defiant

the original Gladiator

the first Wellington

the first and second Lancasters

the JEJ Spitfire IX

the first Spitfire Mk.I

the original Bf 109E

the original Bf 109G

original Blenheim IV

the first 1/48 Spitfire Vb

the first 1/48 Hurricane I

the original Folland Gnat

the original Jet Provost T.3

the original Harrier GR.1/3

the original Bf 110D

the original FM-2 Wildcat

the 1st and 2nd P-51D molds

the original Fw 190A-8/F-8 (they need a new D-9)

the original Fw 190D-9 (from the 1950s), they retooled in the late 70s)

the original Mosquito and maybe the 2nd tooling from the 70s

the original Beaufighter TF.X

 

there are probably more I have forgotten about, but you can see a theme here that Airfix has been replacing their best sellers with new molds along with a smattering of new subjects. That’s why I think a new Halifax is inevitable; the existing tooling dates from the 1960s. However, this doesn’t mean Airfix will do another B.III. I’d prefer a Merlin powered variant just because Revell’s kit and the Matchbox kit are screwed up in a number of different ways.

[RichG]

1 hour ago, Denford said:

The Avenger could, on the basis of usage\service or whatever you call it, be expected to sell worldwide.

Of course whilst the Avenger would be a worthy and impressive subject in its own right as a wartime torpedo bomber, the fact that it also saw service in the Fleet Air Arm  in 5 squadrons off RN carriers in the 1950's in the Anti-Submarine role, would surely tick a few boxes down Margate way and strengthen its claim to be a 1/48 subject...  

 

Not a type I know much about - but a very interesting subject nonetheless. 

 

Rich

Edited November 9, 2021 by RichG

[Giorgio N]

I think the problem of existing competition must be put in the proper perspective...

Competition on a product is not simply a matter of "there's already 3 kits on the market of subject X and none of subject Y, better do Y...". In the end the goal of a manufacturer is to sell a certain number of kits, part of which will cover the investment and the rest will constitute profit. It doesn't matter how and why modellers will choose such kit, what matters is they buy it. The presence of other kits may be an issue or may not, depends on a lot of things: what's the popularity of the subject ? Does this guarantee a good number of sales? And what's the popularity of the subject in the markets where my company has a good distribution ? Is my kit offering something new or different that is  guaranteed to get me a good portion of that market regardless of the competition? Is the competition better distributed or acknowledged in the markets where my product may be more desirable ? Where am I placing myself in terms of pricing against the competition ? And a lot of similar stuff, that means that in the end the presence or not of potential competition from other kits may be absolutely nothing to worry about.
 

Notice how I mentioned the importance of the position of a company in the market: I may have a kit of a subject capable of selling like hot cakes in say Japan but if I don't have a proper distribution in that country I'll never sell as much as I'd like. Same if my pricing is such to put me at a serious disadvantage in the country where my product would be more popular. On the other hand if I have a good distribution and reputation in a certain country I may well sell more than a competitor with a better product

Now I don't know how Airfix distribution is around the world and how their sales are split across the main countries, I bet however that a large part of their sales would be in the UK so even if a competing product exists they only need it to be scarcely available or too expensive in the home market and suddenly the competition does not exist anymore or if it does it's not much of a problem.

 

Then there's the good old truth that the 10% of a 100,000 pieces market is much better than the 100% of a 1,000 pieces market: it doesn't matter if I can get the whole market for say a 1/72 Vickers Valentia for myself if this market is too small to make a profit (choosing the Valentia since I don't think there's any injection kit of the type), much better to issue another Bf.109 variant, as this one is guaranteed to sell even if there are 20 other kits on the market (and the reissue of the Airfix 1/72 G-6 seem to indicate that a 109 will sell well even if it's a kit much inferior to the competition...). As said before, the goal is to sell X kits, not sell more than the rest of the competition put together.

 

In the end anyway the people at Airfix know what sells and what doesn't better than I do, afterall they have all the sales data for their kits for the last few years so they have a rough idea of what to expect from every new subject.. and being in the business I bet that they also know a thing or two about sales of the competition as well....

Whatever choice will be balanced between the will of offering something new and the need to generate profit... and maybe they could surprise us. If they don't, I hope modellers will understand that if they will have announced say a 1/72 jaguar instead of a Scimitar it will be for some very good reason (putting the Jag and the Scimitar as an example, not because I know or feel that they may do one.. although I'd gladly buy either)

 

[ckw]

1 hour ago, Denford said:

The Avenger could, on the basis of usage\service or whatever you call it, be expected to sell worldwide. 

Now if they were to do it as 1/24th ....

 

Cheers

 

Colin

[Rabbit Leader]

I’ve just read the last two pages of this thread and for some reason talk of an Avro Lincoln has dropped off. Therefore I’ll mention a ‘Lincoln’ again to make me happier, not because I think it’ll be done! 

I also agree with the comments for a good quality 1/72 Anson. This would fit nicely between their growing Coastal Command and Training ranges and has the potential to be re-released in many different boxes. 
 

Cheers .. Dave 

 

[Adam Poultney]

4 minutes ago, Rabbit Leader said:

I’ve just read the last two pages of this thread and for some reason talk of an Avro Lincoln has dropped off. Therefore I’ll mention a ‘Lincoln’ again to make me happier, not because I think it’ll be done! 
 

Likewise I will mention a Vulcan B1

[3DStewart]

3 hours ago, Rabbit Leader said:

I’ve just read the last two pages of this thread and for some reason talk of an Avro Lincoln has dropped off. Therefore I’ll mention a ‘Lincoln’ again to make me happier, not because I think it’ll be done!

 

 

And I will mention a late war Betty, as no one has ever done one, not even the Japanese!  There's zero chance of Airfix doing one, but just thinking about it makes me happy!

 

Betty, Betty, Betty. There, I've built it in my mind, where all my best builds are.

 

Edited November 9, 2021 by 3DStewart

[cmatthewbacon]

With the (dis)honourable exception of the British Phantom, has there ever been a time when Airfix hasn't had a 1/72 kit of the RAF's main front line aircraft in the range?(*) Hunter, Lightning, Javelin, Canberra, Buccaneer, Vulcan, Jaguar, Tornado, Eurofighter... I thiink the F-35 is pretty inevitable, even before you get to  the fact the mould can be amortised over 25+ years...

best,

M.

(*)yes, I know you could nitpick about precise release dates and what's "main", but the principle is pretty clear...

[JohnT]

If I had to go off piste with this then a 1/24 Hawker Hunter F6 with optional parts for the other later marks assuming clever moulding.  Would it sell?  Popular in Europe and around the world with 22 countries flying it at some time or other.  Hunter isn't too big for 1/24.  All the same the 1/32 Revell version are reputed not to have sold that well   Maybe she suffers from being subsonic at a time when the must have thing was Mach 1 plus to Mach 2

[RichG]

52 minutes ago, Adam Poultney said:

Likewise I will mention a Vulcan B1

in which case, I'll say Canberra B2 🤣

[Denford]

1 hour ago, Rabbit Leader said:

I’ve just read the last two pages of this thread and for some reason talk of an Avro Lincoln has dropped off. Therefore I’ll mention a ‘Lincoln’ again to make me happier, not because I think it’ll be done! 

I also agree with the comments for a good quality 1/72 Anson. This would fit nicely between their growing Coastal Command and Training ranges and has the potential to be re-released in many different boxes. 
 

Cheers .. Dave 

 

I'm sure it will be tooled some day.  If there is an example in Australia, and you can lead your rabbits to see it.

Incidentally I'm curious about your choice of name: I thought rabbits were pests.

[Wez]

3 hours ago, thepureness said:

 

I don't see the F35 being tooled. This is modern and to some degree still a secretive aircraft. The US military would have to potentially agree to the lidar scanning which airfix like to do. Some kits have been produced on licence and there could be a degree of terms within that licence which might prevent another brand getting access. For me I don't see it happening 

 

I'm in agreement here, I don't think ITAR rules would let them get anywhere near a live F-35 to sufficiently measure it properly let alone LIDAR it.  I don't believe the published data would be good enough for Airfix.

[Rabbit Leader]

1 hour ago, Denford said:

Incidentally I'm curious about your choice of name: I thought rabbits were pests.

“Pest”!! Well I’ve been certainly called much worse then that and rabbits are very frequent pests in this part of the world. Now the name “Rabbit Leader” has been unashamedly ‘borrowed’ from the 1969 Battle of Britain movie where British actor Robert Shaw plays a Squadron Leader pilot character which has been likened to the South African Ace Sailor Malan. My avatar is of such a figure, which incidentally bares absolutely no likeliness to this ‘wanna be’ Action Hero from the subtropical city of Brisbane. That’s now got me thinking… where does the name Denford come from? 
 

Cheers.. Dave  

[TEXANTOMCAT]

6 minutes ago, Rabbit Leader said:

“Pest”!! Well I’ve been certainly called much worse then that and rabbits are very frequent pests in this part of the world. Now the name “Rabbit Leader” has been unashamedly ‘borrowed’ from the 1969 Battle of Britain movie where British actor Robert Shaw plays a Squadron Leader pilot character which has been likened to the South African Ace Sailor Malan. My avatar is of such a figure, which incidentally bares absolutely no likeliness to this ‘wanna be’ Action hero from the subtropical city of Brisbane. That’s now got me thinking… where does the name Denford come from? 
 

Cheers.. Dave  

Spat tea laughing at this Dave! 😆😆

[Adam Poultney]

7 minutes ago, Rabbit Leader said:

“Pest”!! Well I’ve been certainly called much worse then that and rabbits are very frequent pests in this part of the world. Now the name “Rabbit Leader” has been unashamedly ‘borrowed’ from the 1969 Battle of Britain movie where British actor Robert Shaw plays a Squadron Leader pilot character which has been likened to the South African Ace Sailor Malan. My avatar is of such a figure, which incidentally bares absolutely no likeliness to this ‘wanna be’ Action hero from the subtropical city of Brisbane. That’s now got me thinking… where does the name Denford come from? 
 

Cheers.. Dave  

I'm just here with..... my name

[Rabbit Leader]

1 minute ago, TEXANTOMCAT said:

Spat tea laughing at this Dave! 😆😆

Ha!! Hope it wasn’t all over your newly painted model TT, unless of course it’s of Italian WW2 design where it might actually look better than any of my mottling techniques! 
Cheers and best go and make yourself another cuppa.. Dave 

[trickydicky210]

With reference to the F35 ITAR issue, I am not so sure that it would be a problem. A lot of info and images are in the public domain, there would certainly be some parts that MoD would not want to appear on a kit ( most would be internal) which providing the kit maker ( in this case Airfix) does not include them or does not indicate what they are in the kit/instructions. 
 

I know Airfix produced the 1/48 Merlin with sensitive parts ( such as added armour)  but MoD were not bothered, so maybe it will be the same with a F35 or another Such modern aircraft.
 

And as this thread now has a 2nd topic 

my user name is because my name is Rich and as Tricky Dicky was already taken I added my office number which is 210 (shows that I am on here too often instead of working).

 

cheers Rich

 

[alt-92]

22 hours ago, trickydicky210 said:

there is a shot of the designer at his desk with a 1/48 F35 kit next to him

If you mean Paramjit: well, yes. He's a modeller himself and frequently does non-Airfix stuff (although he does like building them for the testshot pics)

[Richard Humm]

1 hour ago, trickydicky210 said:

With reference to the F35 ITAR issue, I am not so sure that it would be a problem. A lot of info and images are in the public domain, there would certainly be some parts that MoD would not want to appear on a kit ( most would be internal) which providing the kit maker ( in this case Airfix) does not include them or does not indicate what they are in the kit/instructions. 
 

I know Airfix produced the 1/48 Merlin with sensitive parts ( such as added armour)  but MoD were not bothered, so maybe it will be the same with a F35 or another Such modern aircraft.
 

 

 

The Airfix Merlin was produced using CAD information supplied by Westland, according to a lecture some years back by one of their researchers at the RAF Museum. Whether Lockheed Martin would be so forthcoming is questionable.

[VMA131Marine]

5 hours ago, Wez said:

 

I'm in agreement here, I don't think ITAR rules would let them get anywhere near a live F-35 to sufficiently measure it properly let alone LIDAR it.  I don't believe the published data would be good enough for Airfix.

And yet somehow we have acceptably accurate kits from Academy, Italeri, Hasegawa, Meng, and Orange Hobby.

[VMA131Marine]

2 hours ago, Richard Humm said:

The Airfix Merlin was produced using CAD information supplied by Westland, according to a lecture some years back by one of their researchers at the RAF Museum. Whether Lockheed Martin would be so forthcoming is questionable.

The biggest issues with the F-35 are the internals you can’t see and the software. The external shape has been captured fairly accurately by multiple kit manufacturers.

[VMA131Marine]

I’ve figured it out, and in 1/24th scale too