nick Posted May 27, 2023 Author Share Posted May 27, 2023 1 hour ago, Noel Smith said: Hi Nick Like another poster suggested with a link. H S Walsh look like they just might have something. I have just been looking at their Hatton Garden shop website. They also have a branch in Birmingham in their jewellery quarter I believe. Just a thought. The slot drills and tungsten carbide bits that you already have. If you are looking to obtain a true flat end on them it might be worth contacting a local engineering tool maker who will probably have a surface grinder with a fine grit wheel. They could mount the bits in a chuck holding the bits vertically under the wheel. A few quick passes should level off the bit ends for you, and might just give you the absolutely flat ended tools that you are looking for. If you show them an example of what you are trying to achieve, in my experience engineers are generally fascinated by what model makers are trying to do and generally willing to help in any way. If you could utilise those tools you already have, it might save having to worry about wear compensation when abrasive tools are used. Now that's a thought, I know a few old toolmakers as it happens. Good idea - thanks Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick Posted May 27, 2023 Author Share Posted May 27, 2023 So back in the real world now, here’s the first physical version of everything. Still need to solve needles and faces and the whole thing can be tidier, but generally, for a first version, pretty happy finally! Dangerously, heres an extremely neat real one. Mine doesn't fair well in a direct comparison but at this scale I'll take it. Thanks for all the support and interest so far. Nick 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noel Smith Posted May 27, 2023 Share Posted May 27, 2023 (edited) Those dashboard prototypes look really nice Nick. That old Airfix Bentley has a lot of potential to turn it into a highly detailed model with the right after market accessories that you are developing. I have a kit in the stash plus a bitsa that a mate of mine dug out of his loft, so I am thinking about a long wheelbase version. Edited May 28, 2023 by Noel Smith 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick Posted May 27, 2023 Author Share Posted May 27, 2023 Breakthrough with the laser finally! I’ve got it to cut the outlines for the decals now, which is great because it’s really hard to do manually and this method just cuts the decal film, not the backing and leaves no border at all which is ace. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete in Lincs Posted May 27, 2023 Share Posted May 27, 2023 Nick, That's one beautiful dashboard. I've had a quick catch up on the thread, so there is a scattering of likes going back in time as it were. I'll pop back again soon for more. Cheers, Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick Posted May 27, 2023 Author Share Posted May 27, 2023 Just applied the laser cut decals and they look great. I’ve also cut out the ‘glass’ with the CNC milling machine and that’s worked well. I’ve just got to figure out the needles now. I’m going to have one more go at laser cutting with a slightly expanded outline, and also try resin printing again but directly on the plate. If either of these can’t be made to work, I can always just add them as flat images to the existing dials. That’s my last resort having come this far and solving everything else though, it seems a shame to stumble here. They are minuscule in fairness at 1/12th. I’m now remembering the Eduard aircraft instrument panels in 1/4 scale as stand alone items, you can see where this going what do we think? Maybe not 1/4 I’ll have to do the maths, but wont be far off with my milling bed size I reckon. stay tuned! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noel Smith Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 Hi Nick Making instrument needles as separate items in 1/12th scale would be certainly taking this to the nth degree for the end user to assemble and would look absolutely superb. I'm reasonably dexterous, but many might struggle a bit to locate and fit them as separate items I feel. Maybe an optional laser printed sheet of the gauges with the needles just printed in situ might.he worth thinking about as well if you solve the separate needles problem. Your Bentley developments are coming along well in parallel to the Italeri Bugatti items being developed. The question I guess that many are wondering is which sets will become available first? The Bentley of Bugatti bits? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick Posted May 28, 2023 Author Share Posted May 28, 2023 So today's exciting installment! hats off to my amazing little Mars printer, it produced these this morning This is as small and thin as it's possible to print realistically, and even then, they look way out of scale in thickness in situ. Before admitting defeat and just printing the needles on the decals I have one last roll of the dice. I'm cutting the dial glazing out on my CNC machine anyway, so I'm going to try and engrave the needles on the inside face of the dial ‘glass’, then a wipe of white paint might just do the trick. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick Posted May 28, 2023 Author Share Posted May 28, 2023 production time! I printed the needles on the decals 😞 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noel Smith Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 Hi Nick Engraving the needles on the backs of each dial glass looks to be a neat way of getting around the problem and still giving a realistic 3D effect with the white paint wash. Just another thought. Is your laser cutter capable of working on thin clear acrylic or acetate? The 'glass' could have the needles etched on to what will be the reverse side with the laser and then the circular shapes cut out. When I had access to a laser at the high school I used to work for I made some headlamp lenses for an old Pocher kit by etching the lens pattern and then cutting out. That was on 1mm clear acrylic compared with the finer thicknesses you will be working on. Principle would be the same though if it works and probably would be a lot quicker than engraving. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick Posted May 28, 2023 Author Share Posted May 28, 2023 3 hours ago, Noel Smith said: Hi Nick Engraving the needles on the backs of each dial glass looks to be a neat way of getting around the problem and still giving a realistic 3D effect with the white paint wash. Just another thought. Is your laser cutter capable of working on thin clear acrylic or acetate? The 'glass' could have the needles etched on to what will be the reverse side with the laser and then the circular shapes cut out. When I had access to a laser at the high school I used to work for I made some headlamp lenses for an old Pocher kit by etching the lens pattern and then cutting out. That was on 1mm clear acrylic compared with the finer thicknesses you will be working on. Principle would be the same though if it works and probably would be a lot quicker than engraving. Hadn’t considered this, I assumed the laser would just burn clear, might have an experiment with it tomorrow. Still playing with the supports for the 3D printing, it’s not reliable at the moment so may resort to my old trick of drawing custom supports in fusion. Talking of High Schools, my laser issue was a real schoolboy error in the end BTW, my numbers were correct for the feed rates, but my UNITS weren’t. I was using mm/second whereas everybody else seems to use mm/minute (I now know) both me and the support guy failed to notice this for a couple of days of confusion and cutting failure. So my laser was moving 60 times faster than it should have been, so unsurprisingly wasn’t cutting much! 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick Posted May 29, 2023 Author Share Posted May 29, 2023 Here’s the laser cutting the carrier away on the decals. We like. I’ve changed the build plate layout for the 3D printed resin parts and they’re coming off nicely now too, photos to follow of the slightly tweaked second prototype. thanks for all the help and support 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick Posted May 29, 2023 Author Share Posted May 29, 2023 3D printing is reliable and repeatable now too 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noel Smith Posted May 30, 2023 Share Posted May 30, 2023 Looking good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick Posted May 30, 2023 Author Share Posted May 30, 2023 So heres version 2, I think its a lot sharper I was forced to print the needles on the decals in the end, and I think they look OK 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick Posted May 30, 2023 Author Share Posted May 30, 2023 My cratex block just arrived too, here’s what 30 quid buys ya. hope it works after all that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noel Smith Posted May 31, 2023 Share Posted May 31, 2023 The printed needles on the instruments look just fine to me. Separate needles was worth experimenting with, as there was no other way of knowing if it would work or not. Looking at the prototype dashboards you have made, you might just have a market for built up ones too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick Posted May 31, 2023 Author Share Posted May 31, 2023 4 hours ago, Noel Smith said: The printed needles on the instruments look just fine to me. Separate needles was worth experimenting with, as there was no other way of knowing if it would work or not. Looking at the prototype dashboards you have made, you might just have a market for built up ones too! I tried lasering them and it left burn marks as I suspected, and its just too small to engrave ultimately. This is a simulation with 0.1mm engraving cutter - the smallest available. I guess I could widen the pointer needles to 0.1 which wont be too far out of scale. Might try that tomorrow when the finer pointed tools arrive as I don't actually have any right now to try. What did we do before Amazon? - I can't remember. No really I can't remember. Anything. Luckily I have machines to do that for me 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geedubelyer Posted May 31, 2023 Share Posted May 31, 2023 Crikey! 😲 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandy Posted May 31, 2023 Share Posted May 31, 2023 Absolutely gorgeous results. I bought aftermarket switches for mine. Just the actual moving bit not the whole part, but without digging it out I can't remember where from. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick Posted May 31, 2023 Author Share Posted May 31, 2023 Now the dashboard is something like, I’ve decided to dust off the rest of the car now. I remember why I stopped. Every part I pick up needs attention, like all of them. anyway, progress. I’ve decided to retain the kit chassis, I was toying with CNC machining this before I got my machine, but now it’s all real, due to its shape, it would require so much material to make, most of which would be milled away, it wouldn’t be worth it. the kit chassis shape is OK so the next job is to shave all the woolly, moulded ‘detail’ off and redraw all the bracing, brackets, bolts and fittings, and I think it will look acceptable then. now the leaf springs, I think I will have a go at milling the leaves and 3D printing the brackets as a hybrid affair, like the dashboard, now I’ve got into it the floor has to go obviously as it’s a crazy diamond/chequer plate thing in the kit. It should be wood, so why not? this can be CNC cut of course now. I was toying with CNC cutting the wooden framing for the main body as well - ash in the real thing I assume? but nice as it would be, it won’t be seen and I would still need to form the outer shell with a plug or something. so my current thinking is to dremel the doors out of the kit body (with a nod to Michael Caine of course) and replace them with 3D printed items as that’s where most of the visible detail needs to be. then that only leaves seats, bulkhead, bonnet, straps, radiator, mudguards, brake drums, windscreen, fuel tank, differential, prop shaft, exhaust, lights, tyres, glass and steering column to do. so really I’ll just be using (modified) chassis, body and maybe tyres from the kit. The good news is any badly built eBay thing can be used as a doner, there really is no point in blowing £100 on a new kit as 90% of it is unusable in this scenario. as bad as all that sounds, it’s a plan and I’m not stuck anymore. I’m actually looking forward to most of it too, not only that, I know how I am going to do it all and have all the kit I need now. stay tuned for the next exciting instalment! Nick The cratex didn’t go well BTW 🙁 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noel Smith Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 (edited) That's quite a list of parts, almost replacing most of the kit items! From a marketing point of view I guess that all those items would be sold as separate items so that the modeller can buy what they feel most necessary for their particular build, as they may want to retain some of the kit parts to use. Airfix had full access to the car back in the 70's when Neil Corner was the owner so I am surprised about the metal tread plate floor being incorrect and should be wood. Very thin ply could be lasered to emulate it quite easily to etch the plank lines and cut the overall shape to fit into the chassis/bodywork. I think that the replacement wooden decks for battleship kits like Iowa, Yamato and Prince of Wales are made this way. Edited June 1, 2023 by Noel Smith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick Posted June 1, 2023 Author Share Posted June 1, 2023 5 hours ago, Noel Smith said: Airfix had full access to the car back in the 70's when Neil Corner was the owner so I am surprised about the metal tread plate floor being incorrect and should be wood. Here's Airfix's take on the floor. Hard to beleive it's correct? there aren't many floor pictures out there, but all the ones I can find are either transverse wooden planks or ribbed rubber mats, the airfix thing looks like a cross between expanded metal and tread plate and if it really was anything like that, it would have had to have been cast, which I think is unlikely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jo NZ Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 Hi Nick Here's a wooden floor in the restored single seater Blower. Before restoration it had an aluminium floor: the new owner has been pretty fastidious getting it back to it's 1932 form, so my version got changed to a wooden floor too. Note the cutout for the gearbox cover. not sure if this was standard or a racing modification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick Posted June 2, 2023 Author Share Posted June 2, 2023 This is a modern restoration, but looks very high quality and is clearly wood too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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