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1/350 Carriers Taiho and Graf Zeppelin


S-boat 55

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Nice job on both of them so far. I've been following for a while now, and I've been using your Graf Zeppelin build as a reference for my what-if kitbash of an old Lindberg Bismark and a spare carrier deck. Looking forward to seeing them both completed!

Edited by jacobs_models
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So Taiho is back off the naughty step, did a bit t the hangar well which are now essentially complete, there are a few little perforated sections to go on the sides but they're too short - that's the first issue I've found with the etch upgrade set, I just need to close off the sides where I've extended the floor back, 

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Got the boat cradles on as well and the 'tramway' for the bats that were stored at the rear of the hangar, 

 

Anyone any ideas how the little pointy up bits should be bent, the instructions weren't clear so I'im assuming they should bend down to meet the deck? 

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Theres a platform to add to the rear bulkhead/wall, then it can be stuck in, 

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The overhand is one of the things I love about Japanese carriers, nestling all the boats together seems to me to make sense, I'm guessing there was a reason British and American designers took a different approach but not sure what it was. 

 

There is a lot of etch to go under that overhang yet and thankfully the part much like the bow section is a separate plastic part you add so I at least don't have to take ages scrapping the moulded detail off. 

 

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Thanks for stopping in, 

 

Sam

 

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Presenting Graf Zebra;

 

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Finally got to have a play with the airbrush, all in all I think for a first attempt it went well, granted it's a little stripy but that was the idea 😉. Obviously the idea is to layer her up to then simulate a plating finish. I think i've not got it quite thick enough in places, though thats mainly on the starboard side and that the side that will least often be seen. Of course not having done it before it could actually all be no where near enough I guess i'll find out when she gets primed fully and then painted. When it comes to doing her 'colours' im guessing it would be best to swap to the .4 needle from the .2? 

 

All in all double action airbrush seems fiddly but also very handy and i found that even where i thought i had pooled the paint, as it was thinned 50/50 it dried up level and smooth, whether that is due to Colourcoats being excellent or just that is a general airbrushing thing i dont know. Must say though that the Jamie's paints do dry to a beautifully matt finish and seemed to go on very well even for a complete novice like me. 

 

I tried working out the layout for her flight deck and hangars the other night whilst watching the west wing. Wish i had read what i read this morning first. According to Without Wings by S.Burke, the Arado 197 that was being designed for use on here was fairly quickly abandoned in favour of adapting the ME-109 and later the ME-155. As i plan to do her as a version based around an uninterrupted completion in 1940/41ish I'll stick with the 109's and JU 87's with maybe a few fieslers as well. Next question was though where they go.  Evidently the Italians came and had a look at her during construction to take lessons for Aquila their carrier. Their measurements are recorded and have been used to try and corroborate which of various dimensions for key components are accurate as the Germans destroyed much of the original documentation. Both the German and Italian records indicate that the lower hangar wasn't as tall as the upper, nor as long. The forward magazine was also going to carry the various sized bombs etc for the JU 87's. Given the ME 109's wouldnt have folding wings but are a good bit smaller than the other panes carried I'm wondering if they would more likely have been in the lower hangar along with the Fieslers, with the upper hangar devoted to the larger Ju 87's. The Fieselrs would surely have been at the back as they would have to take off without the catapult assistance and the torpedoes were to be stored in the rearmost magazine as well.

 

Also i found something very odd happened the other day, there was a knock on the door and as if from no where this appeared on the doorstep, 

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I'm not sure what happened but i think it was something to do with too much time on a well know online auction site. 

 

Still at £65 i thought it was too good of a price to pass up, 

 

Thanks for stopping in, 

 

Sam

 

 

 

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25 minutes ago, ArnoldAmbrose said:

Gidday Sam, it's a striking camo scheme, I'll give it that. 🙂 Good luck with the experimentation. Regards, Jeff.

Thanks, I figured it's worth a go, worst case it comes out smooth same as the moulding, 

 

Still not settled on a paint scheme yet though, 

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2 hours ago, S-boat 55 said:

 

Also i found something very odd happened the other day, there was a knock on the door and as if from no where this appeared on the doorstep, 

y4m8SkBPINvbdQBH8lVhnMGINCAy--BpHXdX_3Uw

 

Does this mean that you’re thinking of a third carrier, or just that you’re going to transfer some of Cammell Laird’s 30s technology to Kiel?

 

For the Merit Ark, I’d say that Tetra set is completely indispensable.  Not sure how much it will help you for other ships (non-Brit ones, anyway!)

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10 minutes ago, Ex-FAAWAFU said:

Does this mean that you’re thinking of a third carrier, or just that you’re going to transfer some of Cammell Laird’s 30s technology to Kiel?

 

For the Merit Ark, I’d say that Tetra set is completely indispensable.  Not sure how much it will help you for other ships (non-Brit ones, anyway!)

Well call me a masochist but I'm quite liking doing two at a time, so the plan is to shift to a pair of allied carriers, Ark Royal and an American one, likely trumpeters yorktown cv-10, that being said, having looked at the tetra set and your build that approach might take me years!

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very nice PE work sam . I have never heard of tretra model works , I tried to go onto there site , but I can't navigate it , do you have a link for it mate . 

Edited by steve5
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3 hours ago, steve5 said:

very nice PE work sam . I have never heard of tretra model works , I tried to go onto there site , but I can't navigate it , do you have a link for it mate . 

Hi Steve 

 

I've only used their website to see what else they do, most of the ship sets are 1:700, though they do a set for USS Intrepid in 1:200, 

 

http://www.tetramodel.com/?act=shop.goods_list&GC=GD03

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Bit of progress, the remaining platforms are on and started the PE supports for them, 

 

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Also got the casemates done using aber barrels, was a bit of a faff as the plastic 'bearing' left after removing the plastic barrels are so tiny and delicate its hard to do much with them. I really do think that for the very limited cost to sell brass fittings with the barrels would be better. 

 

On the subject of the casemates - what on earth were they thinking - it could only be that she would operate independently at times which is just bonkers, that said its because she look a little bonkers that she appeals, 

 

hopefully do a bit more soon, then i'll need to get Taiho to the same kind of point, id estimate Zeppy is 25%+ complete, 

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13 hours ago, S-boat 55 said:

On the subject of the casemates - what on earth were they thinking - it could only be that she would operate independently at times

Gidday, while I'm not an expert on this subject I've read a little about it.

     Both the Japanese Akagi and Kaga originally carried six 200mm (7.9-inch) guns in casemates in the hull and two twin turrets with the same guns on the middle (of three) flightdeck. These were for defense against warships if they were surprised and had to defend themselves in a gun duel. The American Lexington and Saratoga had four twin 8-inch turrets for the same reason. In the American's case it was thought that if the flightdecks were damaged they could act as heavy cruisers. These ideas were in early days when carrier operations were in their infancy and untried in battle. All of these ships had their turrets removed at a later date, but I don't know about the casemates. I guess in the case of the Germans they followed the same doctrine, this being new for them also, although they were a little behind the other navies. There may be more to it, these are just concepts that I've read about. HTH.

 

    DKM Graf Zebra is looking very good. And yeah some of my models are of ships I've chosen because they were a little different. Regards, Jeff.

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2 hours ago, ArnoldAmbrose said:

Gidday, while I'm not an expert on this subject I've read a little about it.

     Both the Japanese Akagi and Kaga originally carried six 200mm (7.9-inch) guns in casemates in the hull and two twin turrets with the same guns on the middle (of three) flightdeck. These were for defense against warships if they were surprised and had to defend themselves in a gun duel. The American Lexington and Saratoga had four twin 8-inch turrets for the same reason. In the American's case it was thought that if the flightdecks were damaged they could act as heavy cruisers. These ideas were in early days when carrier operations were in their infancy and untried in battle. All of these ships had their turrets removed at a later date, but I don't know about the casemates. I guess in the case of the Germans they followed the same doctrine, this being new for them also, although they were a little behind the other navies. There may be more to it, these are just concepts that I've read about. HTH.

 

    DKM Graf Zebra is looking very good. And yeah some of my models are of ships I've chosen because they were a little different. Regards, Jeff.

Thanks Jeff, tbf, that does make a degree of sense and as you say the Germans were a way behind in Carrier development, Graf Zeppelin and Ark Royal were laid down within a few months of each other and are chalk and cheese in some ways, 

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Hi All, 

 

Painting - painting can be a problem as we all know, its all about the sequence, on Zeppy the rear of the hangar forms the bulkheads on the rear deck. I wanted to get the hull as complete as possible so that it could be painted together without having to mask off the boat deck along her side. I decided to do that by not pre fitting the hangar assembly. That meant chopping off the rear most section of the hangar to close up the stern most area. I scored the line and then used wire cutters, worked a treat, 

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You can see in that one as well the recycled parts for trumpeters boat davits being used to mimic detail for the elevators/wells, 

 

So hanger end chopped off and stuck in place, it did create a bit of a seam that I cheated and covered, then got the walkway that runs around the end fitted and laid the wood deck in place to get an idea of fit. Outcome fo that was stern fit is goodish, bow, more suspect. Before and after shot,

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Saw a recommendation that railing sticks better if joined to the plastic pre paint so on some went, 

 

Also did the same on the boat decks/openings/holes what ever they are called, stood two of Eduards boat davit/supports in, they seem over the top to me so I'm in a quandary as to what to do now, I cant use Trumpeters as they have been cut up for the hangar, hmmmmm. There's a pic of each set of openings, apologies for the repetition;

 

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There isn't much more that can go on at the stern pre second primer and painting, a couple of bits at the bow to do and the remaining few supports for the platforms but their railings will have to wait, 

 

Need to sort a stand as well,  

 

Aside working out the boat supports I'd like to add a little more detail to the boat decks but not sure what yet, I've spare degaussing cable for Hood which might work,  I might percolate a bit and get Taiho on the go again, 

 

Lastly a shot of where she is at, along with a certain half finished project which a certain pair or modellers have been mentioning of late @ERK @Adm Lord De Univers, she's got to go back in the cupboard for now, 

 

y4maoEic4Q80PCPq4jeAMXZDyRO3fU2uU1Jmw4a-

 

Thanks for stopping in, 

 

S-boat, 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by S-boat 55
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1 hour ago, S-boat 55 said:

Saw a recommendation that railing sticks better if joined to the plastic pre paint so on some went, 

I’ve tried both, sticking to bare plastic and sticking to painted surface, whether it be primer or finish colour. I use this at the mo’ and it does dry to quite a strong join. I can’t use CA, so I’m always looking for an alternative.

https://www.scalemodelshop.co.uk/product/ultra-glue-for-etch-clear-parts-more-acrylic-waterbase-glue/

I’ve had more bond failures when sticking to a painted surface, where the glue stick to the paint, but the paint doesn’t stick to the plastic, primed or not.

Jon

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31 minutes ago, Adm Lord De Univers said:

Am I the only one who quite likes the striped camo?

 

Also that Warspite looks very close to being finished...

 

David

My wife is somewhat aggrieved the straps won't be staying, I don't think it's quite right for even a fictitious situation though, 

 

I can't settle on a scheme, I'm currently thinking akin to other major German units of the time and Dunkelgrau 51 from the flight deck down and Hellgrau 50 on the superstructure, 

 

As for warspite, we'll as she's an out the box build so aside barrels and likely main bits of railing your probably not wrong and its fairly simple bits to do and painting her up, when I finish dunkerque I'll start doing a bit on her I guess, 

 

P.s. I confess having got into doing more detail wise I'd be tempted to go back and do warspite again and throw everything at her, I've always thought she was a magnification ship and one of the true national disgrace's tha she wasn't preserved 

Edited by S-boat 55
Chuffing autocorrect
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4 hours ago, S-boat 55 said:

My wife is somewhat aggrieved the straps won't be staying, I don't think it's quite right for even a fictitious situation though, 

 

I can't settle on a scheme, I'm currently thinking akin to other major German units of the time and Dunkelgrau 51 from the flight deck down and Hellgrau 50 on the superstructure, 

 

As for warspite, we'll as she's an out the box build so aside barrels and likely main bits of railing your probably not wrong and its fairly simple bits to do and painting her up, when I finish dunkerque I'll start doing a bit on her I guess, 

 

P.s. I confess having got into doing more detail wise I'd be tempted to go back and do warspite again and throw everything at her, I've always thought she was a magnification ship and one of the true national disgrace's tha she wasn't preserved 

The Old Girl  was stubbern  to the very end  - she did not want to be scrapped  - hence why she  struggled with the tugs  taking her to the scrappers.

 

Erk.

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Hell hath a new name and it is 'strut' 

 

so darn many struts - taking an age, but port side nearly done on these and the fairly standard gusset affair, 

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less on the starboard thank heavens, 

 

Not far from being able to prime the hull up fully now

 

Sam

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Graf Zep was bigger than I realised (assuming she and Warspite are both 1/350!).

 

On the detailing of the boat bays / hull galleries, Black Cat do some really useful generic detailing sets - small lockers, buckets, hydrants, that kind of thing - which I have acquired with a view to busying up some of Ark’s equivalent spaces (where not obscured by boats, obvs).  Go to their website and search for “Deck Accessories”.

 

Great work with those struts; I feel your pain!

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