stevej60 Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 Hi folk's,building Revells 1/48 kit with the RCAF scheme instructions say intermediate blue over white I assume this is correct? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogsbody Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 According to Aviaeology, yes. https://www.aviaeology.com/store/c5/48th_scale_Decals-n-Docs#/ Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevej60 Posted August 31, 2021 Author Share Posted August 31, 2021 3 minutes ago, dogsbody said: According to Aviaeology, yes. https://www.aviaeology.com/store/c5/48th_scale_Decals-n-Docs#/ Chris Thank's Chris I've just stumbled on the same question here from a few years back which you contributed to too. https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/37941-rcaf-ventura-colour-question/page/2/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRK4m Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 It is a two-colour scheme, so Sea Blue Gray/Light Gray - factory scheme also for early USN machines. In fact, Intermediate Blue was very close to (although lighter than) Sea Blue Gray, but it was never combined with Light Gray undersides. And it has never been used in any two-colour scheme. So IMHO Revell is wrong. Cheers Michael 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmaas Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 USN Blue-Gray was made using Prussian blue. Intermediate Blue was made using ultramarine blue. Because of the different composition Blue Gray had a 'green' tinge that Intermediate Blue does not. So even given the likelihood that there were variants of Blue Gray, it is not really interchangeable with Intermediate Blue. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRK4m Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 7 hours ago, jimmaas said: USN Blue-Gray was made using Prussian blue. Intermediate Blue was made using ultramarine blue. Because of the different composition Blue Gray had a 'green' tinge that Intermediate Blue does not... A bit off topic, but it's great that you touched on the subject of green (Prussian) and purple (ultramarine) notes in shades of USN blues. Is it just my feeling that the NS Sea Blue from 1943-44 was also based on ultramarine? And which dye were based on both (overall) Gloss Sea Blue shades - the one from 1944-47 and the later one used on the first jets (F9F, F2H, etc.)? Cheers Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoffrey Sinclair Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 Appreciate a specific RCAF aircraft is being discussed, but some background. In order to avoid duplication and conflict each aircraft type under production in the US from 1940/41 onwards during WWII were assigned to either the USN or USAAF as the procuring agent, then distributed as required. So an aircraft was either army or navy. The Lockheed model 37, Ventura, B-34, PV-1, PV-2 and Harpoon is rather unique, it changed from being army to navy in December 1942, that is to end November 1942 production was officially Model 37, Ventura or B-34, after that, apart from a specific USAAF order, the aircraft were PV-1 or 2. Naturally the USN changed the paint specifications from those of the USAAF. The British placed orders for eight hundred and seventy five model 37 Ventura, of which two hundred received USAAF serials as the B-34. The USAAF also ordered eighteen modified versions as the RB-37. The rest were USN production assigned Bureau Numbers. Model 37 Ventura I, 300 built August 1941 to June 1942, AE, AF serials Model 37 Ventura II, 375 built May 1942 to September 1942, AJ serials B-34, 200 built September to November 1942, FD serials RB-37, 18 built January to April 1943 PV-1, 1,600 built December 1942 to May 1944, Ventura V, FN and later serials PV-2C, 30 built March to October 1944, Harpoon PV-2, 470 built October 1944 to December 1945, Harpoon PV-2D, 35 built July to December 1945, Harpoon So the Commonwealth air forces ended up with a mixture of, in US terms, B-34 and PV-1. All RCAF mark I and II operated under their RAF serials, most mark V under RCAF serials 2141 to 2277, except 20 FN and FP serials. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmaas Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 10 hours ago, KRK4m said: A bit off topic, but it's great that you touched on the subject of green (Prussian) and purple (ultramarine) notes in shades of USN blues. Is it just my feeling that the NS Sea Blue from 1943-44 was also based on ultramarine? And which dye were based on both (overall) Gloss Sea Blue shades - the one from 1944-47 and the later one used on the first jets (F9F, F2H, etc.)? Cheers Michael Yes, both Intrrmediate and Sea Blue used ultramarine base. I don't have expertise on the postwar blues (though I'm aware there were differences from the wartime blues) but I am pretty sure they were ultramarine blues also. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brewerjerry Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 (edited) Hi there are some ventura colour photos here, from a film https://www.impdb.org/index.php?title=Son_of_Lassie cheers jerryb Edited September 1, 2021 by brewerjerry 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRK4m Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 (edited) 4 hours ago, brewerjerry said: Hi there are some ventura colour photos here, from a film https://www.impdb.org/index.php?title=Son_of_Lassie Thank you for this link. However the Venturas here feature other two camo schemes seen on the Lockheed twins in RCAF service - one is the RAF Coastal Command ASW scheme of EDSG and DSG over white (high demarcation line), while another is the USN late 1943 four-colour pattern of two Dark Sea Blues (gloss and non-specular), Intermediate Blue and White. And here you can clearly see the purple shade of those USN late blue colors (as mentioned by Jimmaas). Cheers Michael Edited September 1, 2021 by KRK4m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyot Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 Without knowing the exact scheme you are going for,.... I would say that it should be US Navy Blue Grey and Light Grey,..... ie the standard US delivery scheme before they changed to the three colour scheme with white undersides. The RCAF also added RAF style Coastal Command colours to its Ventura`s too. Cheers Tony 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevej60 Posted September 3, 2021 Author Share Posted September 3, 2021 3 hours ago, tonyot said: Without knowing the exact scheme you are going for,.... I would say that it should be US Navy Blue Grey and Light Grey,..... ie the standard US delivery scheme before they changed to the three colour scheme with white undersides. The RCAF also added RAF style Coastal Command colours to its Ventura`s too. Cheers Tony Hi Tony, This is the kit and scheme Blue Gray over white as the instructions would have you paint it. https://finescale.com/product-info/kit-reviews/2012/03/revell-148-scale-lockeed-pv-1-ventura Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogsbody Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 I took this photo at the Northern Wings Model Show, at The Alberta Aviation Museum, in June 2012. Brett Green of Hyperscale was there, too. Chris 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRK4m Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 5 hours ago, stevej60 said: Hi Tony, This is the kit and scheme Blue Gray over white as the instructions would have you paint it. https://finescale.com/product-info/kit-reviews/2012/03/revell-148-scale-lockeed-pv-1-ventura Stevej60 - there has never been such a scheme. The white undersides were only used in late-war US and British anti-submarine schemes: Dark Gull Gray/Light Gull Gray/White (USN carrier aircraft in North Atlantic) Dark Gull Gray/White (USN carrier a/c and flying boats in whole Atlantic area) Dark Sea Blue/Intermediate Blue/White (USN and USMC a/c in whole Pacific area) Extra Dark Sea Grey/Dark Slate Grey/White (RAF and FAA aircraft in 1942-44) Extra Dark Sea Grey/White (RAF anti-sub and GR aircraft from 1944 on) Schemes #3 and 4 are visible on RCAF Venturas here https://www.impdb.org/index.php?title=Son_of_Lassie The only known scheme using USN Blue Gray topsides linked them to USN Light Gray undersides, not White. So I repeat again: Revell instructions are wrong Cheers Michael 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyot Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 6 hours ago, stevej60 said: Hi Tony, This is the kit and scheme Blue Gray over white as the instructions would have you paint it. https://finescale.com/product-info/kit-reviews/2012/03/revell-148-scale-lockeed-pv-1-ventura Hiya Steve,.... it should be Blue Grey and Light Grey mate,.... that Revell scheme is fantasy. Here is a RCAF aircraft in the same scheme; Here is one with the US star overpainted on the nose ad rear fuselage and smaller RCAF roundel added behind,..... the one alongside is overall white; And in colour; And here is a model that I made in the scheme; All the best mate Tony 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevej60 Posted September 4, 2021 Author Share Posted September 4, 2021 11 hours ago, tonyot said: All the best mate Tony Cheer's Tony,that's cheered me up no end really didn't want to paint all that white! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyot Posted September 4, 2021 Share Posted September 4, 2021 2 hours ago, stevej60 said: Cheer's Tony,that's cheered me up no end really didn't want to paint all that white! No worries mate,.... I`ve got quite a bit of Ventura reference stuff if you get stuck or fancy a different scheme. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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