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RCAF Ventura scheme.


stevej60

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3 minutes ago, dogsbody said:

According to Aviaeology, yes.

 

https://www.aviaeology.com/store/c5/48th_scale_Decals-n-Docs#/

 

 

 

 

Chris

Thank's Chris I've just stumbled on the same question here from a few years back which you contributed to too.

https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/37941-rcaf-ventura-colour-question/page/2/

 

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It is a two-colour scheme, so Sea Blue Gray/Light Gray - factory scheme also for early USN machines.

In fact, Intermediate Blue was very close to (although lighter than) Sea Blue Gray, but it was never combined with Light Gray undersides.

And it has never been used in any two-colour scheme. So IMHO Revell is wrong.

Cheers

Michael

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USN Blue-Gray was made using Prussian blue.  Intermediate Blue was made using ultramarine blue.  Because of the different composition Blue Gray had a 'green' tinge that Intermediate Blue does not.  So even given the likelihood that there were variants of Blue Gray, it is not really interchangeable with Intermediate Blue.

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7 hours ago, jimmaas said:

USN Blue-Gray was made using Prussian blue.  Intermediate Blue was made using ultramarine blue.  Because of the different composition Blue Gray had a 'green' tinge that Intermediate Blue does not...

 

A bit off topic, but it's great that you touched on the subject of green (Prussian) and purple (ultramarine) notes in shades of USN blues.

Is it just my feeling that the NS Sea Blue from 1943-44 was also based on ultramarine?

And which dye were based on both (overall) Gloss Sea Blue shades - the one from 1944-47 and the later one used on the first jets (F9F, F2H, etc.)?

Cheers

Michael

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Appreciate a specific RCAF aircraft is being discussed, but some background.  In order to avoid duplication and conflict each aircraft type under production in the US from 1940/41 onwards during WWII were assigned to either the USN or USAAF as the procuring agent, then distributed as required.  So an aircraft was either army or navy.  The Lockheed model 37, Ventura, B-34, PV-1, PV-2 and Harpoon is rather unique, it changed from being army to navy in December 1942, that is to end November 1942 production was officially Model 37, Ventura or B-34, after that, apart from a specific USAAF order, the aircraft were PV-1 or 2.


Naturally the USN changed the paint specifications from those of the USAAF.

 

The British placed orders for eight hundred and seventy five model 37 Ventura, of which two hundred received USAAF serials as the B-34.  The USAAF also ordered eighteen modified versions as the RB-37.  The rest were USN production assigned Bureau Numbers.

Model 37 Ventura I, 300 built August 1941 to June 1942, AE, AF serials
Model 37 Ventura II, 375 built May 1942 to September 1942, AJ serials
B-34, 200 built September to November 1942, FD serials
RB-37, 18 built January to April 1943

PV-1, 1,600 built December 1942 to May 1944, Ventura V, FN and later serials
PV-2C, 30 built March to October 1944, Harpoon
PV-2, 470 built October 1944 to December 1945, Harpoon
PV-2D, 35 built July to December 1945, Harpoon

So the Commonwealth air forces ended up with a mixture of, in US terms, B-34 and PV-1.  All RCAF mark I and II operated under their RAF serials, most mark V under RCAF serials 2141 to 2277, except 20 FN and FP serials.

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10 hours ago, KRK4m said:

 

 

A bit off topic, but it's great that you touched on the subject of green (Prussian) and purple (ultramarine) notes in shades of USN blues.

Is it just my feeling that the NS Sea Blue from 1943-44 was also based on ultramarine?

And which dye were based on both (overall) Gloss Sea Blue shades - the one from 1944-47 and the later one used on the first jets (F9F, F2H, etc.)?

Cheers

Michael

Yes, both Intrrmediate and Sea Blue used ultramarine base.  I don't have expertise on the postwar blues (though I'm aware there were differences from the wartime blues) but I am pretty sure they were ultramarine blues also.  

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4 hours ago, brewerjerry said:

Hi

    there are some ventura colour photos here, from a film

https://www.impdb.org/index.php?title=Son_of_Lassie

Thank you for this link. However the Venturas here feature other two camo schemes seen on the Lockheed twins in RCAF service - one is the RAF Coastal Command  ASW scheme of EDSG and DSG over white (high demarcation line), while another is the USN late 1943 four-colour pattern of two Dark Sea Blues (gloss and non-specular), Intermediate Blue and White.

And here you can clearly see the purple shade of those USN late blue colors (as mentioned by Jimmaas).

Cheers

Michael

Edited by KRK4m
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Without knowing the exact scheme you are going for,....  I would say that it should be US Navy Blue Grey and Light Grey,..... ie the standard US delivery scheme before they changed to the three colour scheme with white undersides.

The RCAF also added RAF style Coastal Command colours to its Ventura`s too. 

Cheers

         Tony 

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3 hours ago, tonyot said:

Without knowing the exact scheme you are going for,....  I would say that it should be US Navy Blue Grey and Light Grey,..... ie the standard US delivery scheme before they changed to the three colour scheme with white undersides.

The RCAF also added RAF style Coastal Command colours to its Ventura`s too. 

Cheers

         Tony 

Hi Tony,

This is the kit and scheme Blue Gray over white as the instructions would have you paint it.

https://finescale.com/product-info/kit-reviews/2012/03/revell-148-scale-lockeed-pv-1-ventura

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5 hours ago, stevej60 said:

Hi Tony,

This is the kit and scheme Blue Gray over white as the instructions would have you paint it.

https://finescale.com/product-info/kit-reviews/2012/03/revell-148-scale-lockeed-pv-1-ventura

Stevej60 - there has never been such a scheme. The white undersides were only used in late-war US and British anti-submarine schemes:

  1. Dark Gull Gray/Light Gull Gray/White (USN carrier aircraft in North Atlantic)
  2. Dark Gull Gray/White (USN carrier a/c and flying boats in whole Atlantic area)
  3. Dark Sea Blue/Intermediate Blue/White (USN and USMC a/c in whole Pacific area)
  4. Extra Dark Sea Grey/Dark Slate Grey/White (RAF and FAA aircraft in 1942-44)
  5. Extra Dark Sea Grey/White (RAF anti-sub and GR aircraft from 1944 on)

Schemes #3 and 4 are visible on RCAF Venturas here https://www.impdb.org/index.php?title=Son_of_Lassie

The only known scheme using USN Blue Gray topsides linked them to USN Light Gray undersides, not White.

So I repeat again: Revell instructions are wrong

Cheers

Michael

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6 hours ago, stevej60 said:

Hi Tony,

This is the kit and scheme Blue Gray over white as the instructions would have you paint it.

https://finescale.com/product-info/kit-reviews/2012/03/revell-148-scale-lockeed-pv-1-ventura

Hiya Steve,.... it should be Blue Grey and Light Grey mate,.... that Revell scheme is fantasy.

 

Here is a RCAF aircraft in the same scheme;

Ventura-GR-Mk-V-2160-145-Sqn-Torbay-Newf

 

Here is one with the US star overpainted on the nose ad rear fuselage and smaller RCAF roundel added behind,..... the one alongside is overall white;

VV6-12.jpg

And in colour;

Ventura-1.jpg

 

And here is a model that I made in the scheme;

DSCF2413.jpg

 

All the best mate

                        Tony

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11 hours ago, tonyot said:

All the best mate

                        Tony

Cheer's Tony,that's cheered me up no end really didn't want to paint all that white!

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2 hours ago, stevej60 said:

Cheer's Tony,that's cheered me up no end really didn't want to paint all that white!

No worries mate,.... I`ve got quite a bit of Ventura reference stuff if you get stuck or fancy a different scheme.

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