Colour of Messerschmitt Bf 109 E-4 wheels - AND NOSE!?

[Johnson]

1 hour ago, JackG said:

don't need any filter to see that yellow (particularly RLM 27) can end up looking quite similar to the RLM 65

Excellent analysis. I’m aware of RLM 27, was it widely used?

[JackG]

According to Luftwaffe Colours book by Ullmann, both yellows were intended for markings.  If one was more prevalent than the other, I would not know.  Have to wonder why the need for two yellows, but then there are also two types of reds listed for markings as well - RLM 23 Rot, and a much deeper shade RLM 28 Winerot.

 

regards,

Jack

[Jochen Barett]

In my understanding "some" of the RLM colors for "markings" were used for "codings" like shown here

https://ww2aircraft.net/forum/threads/was-rlm-02-used-as-a-top-surface-camouflage-colour-on-luftwaffe-fighters.50255/page-6

 

one of the postings (scroll down a bit in that thread) showing this table with color codes for tubing acccording to DIN 5381:

 

and the color codes would be used on instrument panels as well (eg brown for an oil pressure gage or oil temperature, yellow for fuel, blue for oxygen or air ...) like seen here https://www.deutscheluftwaffe.de/originale-geraetebretter and the RLM paints used for these were in the RLM 21 to 28 range, while RLM 04 was the "identification" yellow used on the outside. And in theory that should work for the coolant and oil filler cap on the outside and octane triangle too and does this look 04 or 27? https://www.key.aero/forum/historic-aviation/3865057-luftwaffe-87-octane-hatch

 

Don't ask how I came to this, maybe there was a source a few years ago, maybe it was just a jump to conclusion thing and I am dumb or 99,999% brilliant and this was the one fail in a million.

 

Ullmann is giving RAL 1021 as an equivalent to RLM 27 (and RAL 1004 for RLM 04) and RAL 6000 for RLM 25 (and so on, disagreeing with this DIN idea), so maybe I'm off by a few miles, maybe the RLM knew better how to translate the DIN into their own RAL numbers, maybe they even used DIN-given paint on tubing and RLM-given paint on the outside (or nobody really cared as long as red was red and yellow was yellow).

 

As always: Use your own eyes and brain, check and double check all available sources, don't trust "that guy on the internet"!

 

 

PS: To me this here is about getting smarter, not about showing off how smart I am.

Edited September 2, 2021 by Jochen Barett

[JackG]

For the most part, modern researchers seem to show the yellows being somewhat similar, with RLM 27 being the lighter of the two:

 

 

 

Unlike this sample that was screen grabbed off the internet:

 

 

.... but another example (more aged?):

 

 

 

regards,

Jack

[tempestfan]

The "title row" of the lower Farbtontafel is cut off, but... why does a Tafel explicitly calling itself "1938 edition" omit 61/62/63 which should have been pretty relevant then, and show colours that obviously are 74/75/76? 

@JackG, do you recall whether any explanation was given? Or is it just that the 1938 relates to the Behandlungs- und Anwendungsvorschrift, which was not updated post 1938, in contrast to the LDv 521? Sorry, I'm not well versed enough with this stuff.

Edited September 3, 2021 by tempestfan
Adding ping