Jump to content

A-6 & EA-6 Intruder / Prowler Offset Seats


Uncle Dick
 Share

Recommended Posts

From memory neither my Hasegawa nor my Fujimi 1/72 intruder kits had offset seats! Be interesting to do a survey to see whether any kits in 1/72 and 1/48 of the Intruder & Prowler have the correct seating and which ones don't !

 

spacer.png

 

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Can you give me a more detailed explaination what you mean? The type of ejection seat or variant of the type or anything else?

Happy modelling 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, dov said:

Can you give me a more detailed explaination what you mean? The type of ejection seat or variant of the type or anything else?

Happy modelling 

I think he meant that the seat for the  B/N on the RH side of the Intruder was set back from the pilot's seat, so they were not sitting side by side- the posted photo shows this.

Mike

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ah, jesus, this you mean? Consider a tall and smal crew member or vice versa? I will take a look in the Flight Manual of this type. It may be a pinpoint situation just valid for this particular pic also.

Happy modelling 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

31 minutes ago, dov said:

Ah, jesus, this you mean? Consider a tall and smal crew member or vice versa? I will take a look in the Flight Manual of this type. It may be a pinpoint situation just valid for this particular pic also.

Happy modelling 

From the AirVectors website on the A-6:

 

The pilot and the bombardier-navigator (B/N) sat side by side under a canopy that slid back to open. The B/N's position was offset about a hand's width to the rear of the pilot's. They sat on Mark-Baker Mark 5 ejection seats that could provide safe ejection at any altitude from ground on up, but required a minimum speed of 185 KPH (115 MPH / 100 KT). Late production A-6As were fitted with Martin-Baker Mark 7 ejection seats with true "zero-zero" -- zero speed, zero altitude -- capability; these seats also had the ability to recline back to improve crew comfort on long flights. The aircrew got in using a step that hinged down from the engine nacelle on each side of the aircraft.

 

https://avgeekery.com/six-things-you-probably-never-knew-about-the-mighty-a-6-intruder/

Edited by 72modeler
added link
  • Like 3
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, a lot of words in this thread but no one attempted to answer the question...

 

I can only answer for 1:48:

 Hobby Boss A-6 family: yes, offset

 Kinetic EA-6B: yes, offset (both fore and aft)

 Revell EA-6A "Electric Intruder": yes, offset (quite a lot actually, probably too much).

 

Cheers,

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

JeffreyK: First we had to make sure, that this question has a real basis and in my case really understood! . Afterward details to the kit:

HB you said is ok? Fine.

Kinnetik correct too. Fine.

Other kits I do not have home.

Older versions of the A-6: I do not know if they have it in real. It maybe an improovement on later versions too. I have no clue about this.

 

Happy modelling 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, Uncle Dick said:

neither my Hasegawa nor my Fujimi 1/72 intruder kits had offset seats!

Almost correct; I have the 1/72 Fujimi A-6A, EA-6A, and A-6E Tram kits, and there are no locating pegs or tabs for either seat; you can either move the pilot's seat a bit fwd or the B/N's seat a bit  aft. so the seats are offset from one another.  They should have included a drawing showing the correct location of the seats in plan view, but they didn't. Now I'm curious if  EA-6B Prowlers had the front seats offset...to the reference library!

Mike

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Strange that people struggled to understand the question from @Uncle Dick as I though he made it pretty clear he was trying to see which kits had the slightly staggered seating of the A-6 and EA-6 (front cockpit) 

 

Julien

  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 hours ago, 72modeler said:

Almost correct; I have the 1/72 Fujimi A-6A, EA-6A, and A-6E Tram kits, and there are no locating pegs or tabs for either seat; you can either move the pilot's seat a bit fwd or the B/N's seat a bit  aft. so the seats are offset from one another.  They should have included a drawing showing the correct location of the seats in plan view, but they didn't. Now I'm curious if  EA-6B Prowlers had the front seats offset...to the reference library!

Mike

 

The front seats of the EA-6B are offset but the rear seats are not.

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 hours ago, 72modeler said:

Almost correct; I have the 1/72 Fujimi A-6A, EA-6A, and A-6E Tram kits, and there are no locating pegs or tabs for either seat; you can either move the pilot's seat a bit fwd or the B/N's seat a bit  aft. so the seats are offset from one another. 

Gratified to read this...as I seemed to recall being able to do a proper offset with the Fujimi Intruder all those many years ago.

 

Nice to know the memory isn't yet failing along with everything else.... 🥴

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 8/28/2021 at 8:39 AM, 72modeler said:

The B/N's position was offset about a hand's width to the rear of the pilot's. They sat on Mark-Baker Mark 5 ejection seats that could provide safe ejection at any altitude from ground on up, but required a minimum speed of 185 KPH (115 MPH / 100 KT). Late production A-6As were fitted with Martin-Baker Mark 7 ejection seats with true "zero-zero" -- zero speed, zero altitude -- capability; these seats also had the ability to recline back to improve crew comfort on long flights.

Not faulting @72modeler but the original source on this: the ejection seats used in the late A-6/EA-6 family (right up until the recent retirement of the final Prowlers) was actually the Martin Baker GRU-7EA, not the Mk. 7.  This was a unique variant to the Intruder/Prowler, similar to the GRU-7 used in A/B model Tomcats (the noticeable difference being the 7EA has a single-loop face curtain handle, vs the Tomcat's paired loops).

 

On 8/28/2021 at 9:44 AM, dov said:

JeffreyK: First we had to make sure, that this question has a real basis and in my case really understood! .

Older versions of the A-6: I do not know if they have it in real. It maybe an improovement on later versions too. I have no clue about this.

 

In case this wasn't clear from previous posts, all A-6 variants including the 4-seat EA-6B, have always had the "offset" between pilot and B/N or ECMO-1 seats. It is a relatively small but noticeable and interesting detail for modelers - not unlike the offset between front and rear seats in the Buccaneer.

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

I saw the below cockpit image recently on a prowler model which indicates the rear seats were offset on the Prowler as well?

 

Now to ask the obvious questions - why was the seating offset in the Intruder?

 

For better pilot visibility? or because the bombardier navigator had instrument panel set deeper? ejection seat firing clearances or sequences? or some other reasons altogether?

 

F-111 for example from memory had no offset seats (granted looks to be a much roomier space in the F-111 also served as escape pod, no ejection seats).

 

And why would they carry over the offset seats in the rear seats of the Prowler?

 

 spacer.png

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Uncle Dick said:

And why would they carry over the offset seats in the rear seats of the Prowler?

 

The resin EA-6B cockpit in the photo you posted above is in error. Only the seats in the front cockpit of the Prowler were offset; the two seats in the rear cockpit were side by side. It was hard to find photos on the .net that showed the rear cockpits, most likely due to the sensitive nature of the equipment in the rear cockpit, but the few photos I was able to find showed the back seats were not offset, as did the photos in the A-6/EA-6 monographs I had.The reason the front seats were offset was so the pilot's vision to the RH side was unobstructed; there would be no reason to have the seats in the back offset. 

Mike 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Interesting concept!

Is this done in any other side by side cockpits?

Viking? Hawkeye?Tweet?

 

Inaddition, could the seat be positioned longitudinally by the pilot as well to adapt to hight differences?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, 72modeler said:

The resin EA-6B cockpit in the photo you posted above is in error. Only the seats in the front cockpit of the Prowler were offset; the two seats in the rear cockpit were side by side. It was hard to find photos on the .net that showed the rear cockpits, most likely due to the sensitive nature of the equipment in the rear cockpit, but the few photos I was able to find showed the back seats were not offset, as did the photos in the A-6/EA-6 monographs I had.The reason the front seats were offset was so the pilot's vision to the RH side was unobstructed; there would be no reason to have the seats in the back offset. 

Mike 

I'd have to pull them out a bookcase upstairs to be sure, but I'm convinced both the Minigraph as well as the D&S on the EA had very decent coverage of all positions - hardly internet-age publications? Or is it a case of "A book? What's that"? 😉

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I can confirm 72Modeler's observation based on a response from an EA-6B crew member to my specific inquiry. The rear seats are not staggered. The reason that the front seats are staggered in all A-6s was to provide the pilot on the left with a bit more cross-cockpit visibility for see-and-avoid purposes in VFR weather since the bombardier might be otherwise occupied. As to longitudinal positioning of the pilot with respect to the controls and visibility, I'm pretty sure that at least the seat bucket would go up and down and the rudder pedals would move back and forth.

  • Like 3
  • Thanks 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...