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Canberra PR7


BillF67
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1 hour ago, canberra kid said:

Yes Bill that should work too. I'll get back to you later with more detail.

John

Sorry, @canberra kid but I'm going to contradict you. I'm not sure the Aeroclub conversion would be a good fit for the Airfix B-57, it seems to have been designed for the oversize italeri kit, here is my RB-57A conversion from the Italeri kit. I admit I haven't dug out my Airfix B-57 to measure it but I think it's based on their B6 which has a (correct) smaller diameter.

 

Sorry if all this is confusing you Bill, I don't want you to spend a load of money on incompatible parts and I know the Aeroclub conversion you have only fits the Italeri kit of the ones in my stash.

 

Come to that, I think if you had an HP B(I)8 all you would need would be a fuselage extension, some careful cutting and filling to fit the goldfish bowl canopy from your conversion and a modified cockpit.

 

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17 minutes ago, rossm said:

Sorry, @canberra kid but I'm going to contradict you. I'm not sure the Aeroclub conversion would be a good fit for the Airfix B-57, it seems to have been designed for the oversize italeri kit, here is my RB-57A conversion from the Italeri kit. I admit I haven't dug out my Airfix B-57 to measure it but I think it's based on their B6 which has a (correct) smaller diameter.

 

Sorry if all this is confusing you Bill, I don't want you to spend a load of money on incompatible parts and I know the Aeroclub conversion you have only fits the Italeri kit of the ones in my stash.

 

Come to that, I think if you had an HP B(I)8 all you would need would be a fuselage extension, some careful cutting and filling to fit the goldfish bowl canopy from your conversion and a modified cockpit.

 

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That's ok @rossm, it's always good to get other input on a subject. The fuselage dimension on the Italeri B.57B is about the only thing that is right, is fine, 6' 6" that is up until the rear of the bomb bay, that's where it all goes horribly wrong! Well from that aspect anyway, there is so much more, but that's a diferant story! Nice to see you building an A model, what are you going to do it as?   

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Rossm, John

 

Dont worry about confusing me - it doesn’t take much.

 

I will go for an easy option any time. If the aeroclub set is redundant, I can sell it on - I won’t have need of it - so not much harm done. What I am loving about my 17 Sqn project is seeing just how much knowledge about just about every a/c type there is on this forum. I’m actually thinking I might get a PR7 after all, by hook or by crook. That only leaves me a DH12 and an FK8, but apparently the DH12 is doable. By the time I’ve built the rest of the 17 Sqn stash, I should have learnt enough to have a stab at conversions.

 

VMT as always - once I’ve sourced a couple of (hopefully cheap) Canberra options based on input above, I’m sure I’ll be back for advice!

 

Bill

 

 

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Ok @BillF67 

Here's how I think it can work using the Airfix B.57 and HP B(I)8.  The Areoclub nose you have will fit the Airfix B.57 fuselage, all you need to do is remove so of the thickness on the inside to take the locating ring on the nose. As I've said be fore, for some odd reason when Palitoy destroyed to B.6 to make the B.57 they increased the length to that of the PR. Canberra's, every cloud and all that! The photo shows where the change (yellow line) was made, and where the extra length accrued (blue line) and where to make the cut (red line)

  SMY16p.jpg

SMY16p.jpgThe next photo shows after cutting.

 SMYt2f.jpg

 

Another silver lining to the butchery of the B.6 was the decision not to give the new version an open bomb bay option, this means that all you need to do is remove the raisd detail for the Martin bomb bay, and re-scribe as required. I can email the necessary plans for the forward full tank/ flair bay position. 

 SMYRB6.jpg

 

The HP B(I)8 wings will be good to go, you will need to either remove some of the span either by reducing the the integral part of wing from the Airfix kit or part of the HP wing, personnel I would remove some from the wing but that's up to you.  As a an aside this is a link to my PR.3 that I started, it's not quite the same way as your build but it may give a few pointers. I have done it the way I'm suggesting here on a T.22 but I have no WIP for that PR.3 build

John    

Edited by canberra kid
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Wow. Even I understand that, John. Small question - is the red cut line really on that panel line? Can life be so kind?

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6 minutes ago, BillF67 said:

Wow. Even I understand that, John. Small question - is the red cut line really on that panel line? Can life be so kind?

Phew, I'm glad it's clear! Yes, it really is that line. It's the forward transport joint, the Canberra fuselage brakes down into three sections, simple! 

 

John 

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3 hours ago, BillF67 said:

 

VMT as always - once I’ve sourced a couple of (hopefully cheap) Canberra options based on input above, I’m sure I’ll be back for advice!

 

 

 

If Frog B(I)8 wings are any good I'll try and find mine for you, the kit is no good now I've cut the nose off for the aborted attempt to fit the Aeroclub conversion.

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@canberra kid did the PR.7s have the doubler plates on the rear fuselage sides? I think I can remember seeing them on PR. 3 WF922 as preserved at Midaland Air Museum, Coventry Airport, but I rarely trust a restored or preserved aircraft 100% as a reference without "in service" images.

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1 minute ago, stever219 said:

@canberra kid did the PR.7s have the doubler plates on the rear fuselage sides? I think I can remember seeing them on PR. 3 WF922 as preserved at Midaland Air Museum, Coventry Airport, but I rarely trust a restored or preserved aircraft 100% as a reference without "in service" images.

They did Steve, some of the very first PR.3's may not have done though. I've still not got to the bottom of that. All PR.7's did though.

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Good news! Frog PR 7 available on EBay!!!

 

Bad news - £193.66 plus £42.15 postage. Tax extra. Really dents my faith in the basic fairness of the human condition.

 

Carry on carrying on😎

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3 minutes ago, BillF67 said:

Good news! Frog PR 7 available on EBay!!!

 

Bad news - £193.66 plus £42.15 postage. Tax extra. Really dents my faith in the basic fairness of the human condition.

 

Carry on carrying on😎

If it goes for that, the buyer will probably hike the price and try to pass it on, or they may be a genuine collector rather than a gouger and want to keep it (unbuilt) ,and to each his own - unfortunately though, we're all feeding at the same trough.

 

Paul.

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I would never ever pay that but what amazes me is the postage. At that price I would expect the seller to hand deliver it (it’s from Japan, but even so! I’ve had other deliveries from there for under £15).

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5 minutes ago, BillF67 said:

I would never ever pay that but what amazes me is the postage. At that price I would expect the seller to hand deliver it (it’s from Japan, but even so! I’ve had other deliveries from there for under £15).

    Postage from the US to the UK is usually the highest out of all the things I look at but don't bid on, ranging from £15.00 for a small accessory to the forties and fifties for whole kits. Not everyone, but it puts it out of the range of mere mortals. A pity paricularly because the things I look for most tend to be the most reasonably priced in the States. Oh well, topic drift alert, sorry......................

 

    To get it back on track a bit - when I used my Aeroclub conversion (the vac PR fuselage)  I made a PR3 from it and an old Airfix B(1)6 with some carving of nacelles and bits as appropriate. I was quite happy with the result at the time, but if I ever find another Aeroclub set I'd like to have another stab at it, given the wealth of helpful info from folk in this thread that was hard to find back then.

 

Paul.

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 I got an aeroclub resin conversion. I’ve just gotten 2 Canberras off self same EBay, an Airfix B57 and a High Planes B(1)8 for £25 the pair. I’m hoping that with the help of the assembled wisdom here that I can make up my PR7 from them. To paraphrase Montgomery Burns, “Dammit, Smithers, it’s Canberra surgery! It isn’t rocket science”.

 

Bill

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2 minutes ago, BillF67 said:

 I got an aeroclub resin conversion. I’ve just gotten 2 Canberras off self same EBay, an Airfix B57 and a High Planes B(1)8 for £25 the pair. I’m hoping that with the help of the assembled wisdom here that I can make up my PR7 from them. To paraphrase Montgomery Burns, “Dammit, Smithers, it’s Canberra surgery! It isn’t rocket science”.

 

Bill

Aaaagh! It was you! I bid £24.00 and stopped there (I was only interested in the HPM kit). Sorry about that..............................

 

Paul.

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On 7/24/2021 at 4:23 AM, canberra kid said:

When you say that HP do a B.57 what model? I know they do an RB/EB.57A and RB/EB.57D do they have a B or E in the range?

John

No, they don't.  Actually, just perusing their website suggests they no longer produce any Canberra variants.   They did do a B-57A and a B-57D/E.  You can make a B from the D fuselage with a new set of wings.

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I was stopping at £30. I thought that a fair price for the two. Sorry back to you, Paul. At least you know it will get built at some point.

 

P.S. Maybe you can’t kill a horse with a flute but you can make a fine LP about them with one😜

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1 minute ago, BillF67 said:

I was stopping at £30. I thought that a fair price for the two. Sorry back to you, Paul. At least you know it will get built at some point.

 

I might have gone to £25 but forgot to get back in time. Good know I'd have lost anyway. Have fun with it. It's a very good kit of it's sort, and if you're new to the more limited run sort then by the end of cleanup you'll have a whole new bunch of  techniques in your aresenal, as well as a set of parts that will fit well to make an accurate model.

 

1 minute ago, BillF67 said:

 

P.S. Maybe you can’t kill a horse with a flute but you can make a fine LP about them with one😜

Only if you stand on one leg.

 

Keep meaning to change that quote - from an old Carradine film, anout the only decent line in it, silly though it may be.

 

Paul.

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 I should have asked earlier but is there an etiquette amongst Forum members about EBay bidding? Should one let people know when they are bidding so as not to encourage a feeding frenzy?

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1 hour ago, BillF67 said:

 I should have asked earlier but is there an etiquette amongst Forum members about EBay bidding? Should one let people know when they are bidding so as not to encourage a feeding frenzy?

simple answer- no

 

Selwyn

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On 7/25/2021 at 1:34 PM, rickshaw said:

No, they don't.  Actually, just perusing their website suggests they no longer produce any Canberra variants.   They did do a B-57A and a B-57D/E.  You can make a B from the D fuselage with a new set of wings.

I've got the D, I've not seen the A but I'd like to have a look at one. 

John

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10 hours ago, canberra kid said:

I've got the D, I've not seen the A but I'd like to have a look at one. 

John

It is should be just a rebadged and re-marked Canberra B.2...

 

If you are going to be working on the D, I would recommend you insert a spar.  The wings are really too heavy for insert.  You will also need a load of weight in the nose to compensate for the weight of the wings.

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4 minutes ago, rickshaw said:

It is should be just a rebadged and re-marked Canberra B.2...

That's why I'd like to see one, though superficially they look very much the same, in detail there are a lot of differences between the B.2 and Martin A model Canberra, I suspect HP got some of them but I'd like to see how much they got right. 

John

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2 hours ago, rickshaw said:

It is should be just a rebadged and re-marked Canberra B.2...

 

If you are going to be working on the D, I would recommend you insert a spar.  The wings are really too heavy for insert.  You will also need a load of weight in the nose to compensate for the weight of the wings.

 

I thought the A had the American engines?

 

For my D I did not use a spar, it's been ok so far. My problem was the main undercarriage legs seem too tall to get the right sit - or maybe they should have more rake than I gave them? RFI -

Sorry for give the thread drift another nudge Bill.

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