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New Tool Vulcan B2 - "rivet counted" build X2 - second build now active


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I mostly used reference images from XH558 (I know, terrible idea to use anything on 558 for reference for an in service Vulcan) and XM603 as there are readily accessible photos of both, 558 also having a working set is helpful.

 

True, sometimes it's impossible to get these details from anything other than a museum example. Personally I'm happy they chose XM594 as it's pretty much in the same condition it was when it arrived directly from Waddington in 1983. Museums also have a horrible habit of 'doing their own thing' when it comes to repaints and the odd replacement part, understandable given the budget restrictions and availability of original parts. I also used references from XL360 at Bagington due to it being a 201 powered airframe.

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1 hour ago, general melchett said:

 

 

True, sometimes it's impossible to get these details from anything other than a museum example. Personally I'm happy they chose XM594 as it's pretty much in the same condition it was when it arrived directly from Waddington in 1983.

XM594 is a good choice, although I'm somewhat surprised the centre wiper was overlooked by the kit designer, given that the attachment point is easily visible. It suggests an over-reliance on LIDAR scans and using one aircraft too much for reference. A simple Google search of "Avro Vulcan canopy" would do just to check the details on the museum example against other Vulcans.

38bae66023d8561ee579b398d0bae9b9.jpg

 

Isn't XJ824 still fairly original at Duxford? That probably would have been my choice for a primary reference example, although I'm biased as I prefer the 200 series airframes. It's in a hangar so it's in very good condition, I don't recall any major alterations being made by the museum, it looks like there's just about space to put equipment to get a look at the top side but I'm not entirely sure on that.

161100baeabf3d99e670ee20a085ded5.jpg

 

1 hour ago, general melchett said:

 

 

Museums also have a horrible habit of 'doing their own thing' when it comes to repaints and the odd replacement part, understandable given the budget restrictions and availability of original parts. I also used references from XL360 at Bagington due to it being a 201 powered airframe.

XL319 in Sunderland is in an entirely inaccurate scheme given its configuration, but where else are you going to see a camo Vulcan with Type D roundels? It would be nice if the museum could alter it in a similar way to XM603, but I don't think they have the budget or manpower for that.

adedfcef508b970fcc47b81140eeffe1.jpg

 

XL360 in need of a repaint. They need to lose the museum logo plastered on the side of the aircraft. Next time I go, I'll probably ask if I can get a look at the other side behind the rope barriers to take some more photos.

ca55f403226e80382b07835118a7edb3.jpg

 

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IMG_20210706_120331

I decided to go with XM594 in the end for the camouflage scheme, kit decals. I've already done a fair bit of the research for it so why bother doing it all again for another one? I like the soft edged camo, gloss finish pretty much everything about the scheme. I'm going aftermarket for my white one, so I have one which will stand out a little.

First thing for this airframe specifically, Blue Steel. I remember from the Victor kit that this will end up with a nasty seam which is difficult to remove. 

 

 

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Having seen that image of XJ824 I think she’s a serious contender for one of my projected builds.  Several years ago now fellow BM-er @avro683 and I visited Duxford with my then-toddler daughter.  Tony and I were busily engrossed in the minutiae of ‘824’s undersides when I suddenly realised that it had “gone quiet”.  “Where’s Gracie gone?” I asked.  “Not sure.” was the reply.  A quick visual check soon located her: she’d toddled under the rope barrier around the port undercarriage and had her arms round one of the wheels, looking for all the world like she was trying to remove it from the aeroplane with a big cheerful grin on her face.  A swift recovery operation was mounted and ‘824 appeared none the worse for the encounter.

 

XJ824 would have made a good reference source for Airfix; like XM594 she’s been largely untouched since her arrival at Duxford (look at some of the upper surface paintwork).  I can see that she has the later Olympus 201/202 tailpipes and late aerial fit.  What I can’t remember is what state her Skybolt/Blue Steel provisioning is in, i.e. blisters and ECM fit.

 

Edited by stever219
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1 minute ago, stever219 said:

XJ824 would have made a good reference source for Airfix; like XM594 she’s been largely untouched since her arrival at Duxford (look at some of the upper surface paintwork).  I can see that she has the later Olympus 201/202 tailpipes and late aerial fit.  What I can’t remember is what state her Skybolt/Blue Steel provisioning is in, i.e. blisters and ECM fit.

 

We need to go back then 😉

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On 03/07/2021 at 14:37, Terry1954 said:

I've loved the aircraft ever since. Built an odd scale one many years ago (can't recall who made it), and am gearing myself, my wallet, my space and my wife up for getting at least one of these beauties. 

Just get one Terry, if the Memsahib objects too much, you always have that tempting offer of running away to sea. I am given to understand that Avocet is really quite a comfortable boat to doss down on. Mrs Martian may or may not slap a premium on your unit subs, depending how long you need the boat's services for. Might be a wise move to take Gill's Shilling now before she reads this; or an even wiser move to take Gill's Shilling before Mrs Terry (sorry I forgot her name) reads it!

 

Helpful of Mars 👽

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Funnily enough I was driving to work this morning and decided I need a trip to Duxford - my last two visits were centred on the Concorde, Blackbird and B-29. I managed to spend two whole days just looking at three airframes (OK I buckled and spent time with the Tonkas and Tooms too haha)

 

Cheers,

  WV908

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Adam, yesterday I posted about my intention to build XL317 with it's blue Blue Steel missile, here is the photo:

Vulcan 617 BS.

My research into why it was painted blue and not the usual white has not bought forward any revelations, however I found a Pathe News clip from 1963 of 617 Sqn declaring that they were now operational with the missile and for the cameras there was a four aircraft scramble, but the interesting thing is that all aircraft had the blue missiles, the film is too grainy to see aircraft serial numbers but the masked off stencils and dials on the missile along with the darker tone compared to the white aircraft certainly makes them blue. (Another photo from starboard shows that it's XL317)

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30 minutes ago, Retired Bob said:

Adam, yesterday I posted about my intention to build XL317 with it's blue Blue Steel missile, here is the photo:

Vulcan 617 BS.

My research into why it was painted blue and not the usual white has not bought forward any revelations, however I found a Pathe News clip from 1963 of 617 Sqn declaring that they were now operational with the missile and for the cameras there was a four aircraft scramble, but the interesting thing is that all aircraft had the blue missiles, the film is too grainy to see aircraft serial numbers but the masked off stencils and dials on the missile along with the darker tone compared to the white aircraft certainly makes them blue. (Another photo from starboard shows that it's XL317)

I stand to be corrected but it is in the back of my mind that Blue Steel training rounds were painted blue. Perhaps someone more knowledgeable than me about V Bombers can provide further enlightenment? Adam? ADAM? ADAM? Where is the wretched creature when you need him and, more to the point, who unchained him from his modelling bench?

 

Martian 👽

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Someone in the 'wanted' section was asking for pylons from the old kit to put on the new.

 

That got me curious about them, which / how many Vulcans were fitted with Shrike pylons please ? And why are they different sizes in the old kit ?

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12 minutes ago, WV908 said:

Is there a full list anywhere please of all the Blue Steel fitted Vulcans? 

 

Cheers,

  WV908

Yes.

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ljleemPGEVyH360F-DqwZqu5iB3LrcqL/view?usp=sharing

 

XA903 and XH539 on development, and all the Vulcans from XL317 to XM595, excluding XL391 and XM574, carried it operationally.

 

41 minutes ago, Martian said:

I stand to be corrected but it is in the back of my mind that Blue Steel training rounds were painted blue. Perhaps someone more knowledgeable than me about V Bombers can provide further enlightenment? Adam? ADAM? ADAM? Where is the wretched creature when you need him and, more to the point, who unchained him from his modelling bench?

 

Martian 👽

I'm here I'm here! I escaped to do some light reading!

7a0735e109eb59eaa0ac65cf6bf71d24.jpg

 

I'm 90% sure this is correct, a number of inert training rounds were painted blue.

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2 hours ago, Martian said:

I stand to be corrected but it is in the back of my mind that Blue Steel training rounds were painted blue. Perhaps someone more knowledgeable than me about V Bombers can provide further enlightenment? 

Most photos of white Blue Steel missiles fitted to aircraft will be inert/training rounds, the rocket fuel was too dangerous to be flown around and that's without the added worries of a thermonuclear warhead to add to the danger.  If it's on the ground with a missile attached and there is no police guard with his brain on a chain, then it's inert.  Practice weapons around this time were being painted light Saxe blue so perhaps that's the reason these were blue, drill weapons that were not for flight were painted Oxford blue.  Perhaps someone reasoned that if all the inert/training Blue Steel rounds were painted up blue it would give the Russians nothing to worry about so they stopped.  I posted yesterday, the real ones were kept locked away until things were about to go pear shaped.  As these were before my time behind the wire (weapon storage area's) It would good to know if the real ones had the explosive and nuclear material warning bands like Yellow Sun had, it was after all the same warhead.

Here's a photo of a real thermonuclear weapon with it's warning bands, 2 inch orange band for nuclear material and 1 inch yellow band for high explosive, this is the tactical free fall WE177 that the Vulcan would have carried in that role, only it would have been white, they were painted green when they were to be carried externally by the Jaguar and Tornado.  After Blue Danube, Red Beard, Yellow Sun and Blue Steel they must have run out of colours because it was only ever called by the alfa/numeric WE177B. :shrug:

128924 UNC.jpgwe.177

 

Edited by Retired Bob
missing word
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Suddenly there is a thing that is vaguely triangular on my desk. Since this a Blue Steel one, I haven't bothered painting all the bomb bay bits which won't be seen, but I've put it all in place for the structural strength. Vulcans had a fairly strong airframe, being the V Bomber which made the transition to low level the best of the three. We all know how badly it ended for the Valiants, and the Victors didn't adapt quite as well as the Vulcan did. 

If you're following this thread, you'll have to get used to me going on about how much nicer the Mk1 Vulcans looked, but apparently they were much more nimble at low level than the B2s, makes sense since they were smaller and lighter. Now can someone please do a Vulcan B1/B1a kit already.

IMG_20210706_153902

 

IMG_20210706_153911

 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Jack Ruskin said:

 

 

That got me curious about them, which / how many Vulcans were fitted with Shrike pylons please ? And why are they different sizes in the old kit ?

Black Buck column in my spreadsheet

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ljleemPGEVyH360F-DqwZqu5iB3LrcqL/view?usp=sharing

 

XM597, XM598, XM607, XM612 and the spare was XL391. 597 and 598 carried Shrikes on the relevant flights.

The four which went to Ascension Island survive today, the spare, XL391, met its demise in 2006 in Blackpool after years of neglect. No Vulcan has been scrapped since, although we lost Victor XH673 last year, let's keep it that way. 

 

Edited by Adam Poultney
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30 minutes ago, Jack Ruskin said:

And why are they different sizes in the old kit ? or are they like that on the real a/c ?

Who?  What?  Where?  Why?  How?  When?  Asking for a very confused fiend.

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41 minutes ago, Jack Ruskin said:

And why are they different sizes in the old kit ? or are they like that on the real a/c ?

I think this thread explains / confirms things.

 

 

Hope this helps.

 

Rich

 

 

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1 minute ago, Gondor44 said:

Is this thread comming out in an abridged version or full book format? :huh:

 

TLDR:

Vulcan crazy madman spills his ramblings from the Tin Triangle asylum onto forum full of bemused onlookers

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Seriously though, would you mind if I copy, cut, paste and edit the thread so I can distill all this lovly info on the kit so I know what details I have to leave or add for each of the three builds I plan to do?

 

Gondor

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