Omani Challenger 2

[Tanker325]

Hello everyone. Any of you guys made an Omani Challenger 2? What is the best model kit to use and if you can share the modes that was made?

[ivan-o]

Hi Tanker,

if you can get hold of this book there is a detailed conversion done by the author.

 

 

HTH,

Ivan

[Stef N.]

I would highly recommend the Rye Field Challenger kit. Goes together really well, the tracks look more daunting than they actually are and has markings for a Middle East version (they don't say where though.)

 

[ivan-o]

You could use any CR2 kit as the base but for an Omani tank it will require extensive modification to the hull as it is far different to our tanks.

[Kingsman]

13 hours ago, Stef N. said:

has markings for a Middle East version (they don't say where though.)

Oman was the only customer so that kinda narrows it down.

 

13 hours ago, ivan-o said:

extensive modification to the hull as it is far different to our tanks.

Different single-block tracks too.

 

The changes are mostly but not exclusively at the rear around the engine compartment for improved cooling.  There are a good few photos on the web but other references are scarce.

[ivan-o]

Talking about Omani tanks surely they would be a prime customer for the new turret to upgrade their Challengers too?

Just as an afterthought Jordan’s Khalids would be suitable as well!

[Tanker325]

Thank you all for the inputs!

[Kingsman]

On 7/5/2021 at 7:47 AM, ivan-o said:

Jordan’s Khalids would be suitable as well!

Jordan no longer operates the Khalid, which was a Chieftain with a CV12 engine and other changes.  They do have most of our Challenger 1s, renamed Al-Hussain, as Khalid replacement.  They experimented with an unmanned Falcon low-profile turret with a RUAG 120mm smoothbore and with re-arming the Al-Hussain with the same weapon as a cheaper alternative but neither were adopted.  Jordan decided to phase out the Al-Hussains in favour of Centauro wheeled AFVs.  Whether the CR3 might change their minds is an interesting question but the switch from tracks to wheels suggests not.  And the CR3 compatibility with CR1 is unknown and by no means necessarily as simple as it sounds.

 

Oman might be interested.  The Shah likes to have modern kit and he will have an ammunition supply problem when RO Birtley stops making the rifled ammunition, which may already have happened in order to run down stocks before the changeover.  he could of course buy up remaining stock but that is finite.  He would get a better price for 50 on the back of 150 for us.  It would only change our price if it were a joint deal for 200 all done as a single build.  But again there may be incompatibilities with the Omani version to be ironed-out.

[ivan-o]

👍got my Jordan tanks messed up🥴

Rhienmettall did say the turret was designed to be a drop in solution for other tanks

[Kingsman]

23 hours ago, ivan-o said:

Rhienmettall did say the turret was designed to be a drop in solution for other tanks

But then they first said that about transplanting the Leopard turret onto CR2................  Of course CR3 isn't just the turret.  There's the new hull ammunition racks, for a start.  Then the mobility and survivability upgrades, different comms systems etc etc.  Much more complex proposition now than in WW2 era.  That's why a re-gunned CR2 has been on the cards for about 20 years without us ever doing it.  One was converted back in about 2003 or so but it turned out to be so much a bigger job that it was dropped.  Below the turret ring the CR1 is not exactly the same as CR2.  Similar but not identical.  Otherwise I'm sure we would have gone for a turret swap on CR1 hulls to save money.

 

I'm sure the CR3 upgrade could be readily adapted to the Omani version as both are CR2s.  Not so sure about the CR1 Al-Hussain, but with Jordan opting to replace the 160 in-service Al Hussains with 160 used Leclercs ex-UAE as well as the 140 used Centauros and keeping the 180-odd upgraded M60A3s I think that ship has well and truly sailed.  240 or so Al Hussains were in storage anyway, along with the Khalids and about 90 ex-Iranian Chieftains donated by Iraq.  Apparently they still have nearly 400 Centurion Tariqs in storage too.  How many stored tanks would be serviceable if needed is a question.  Not to mention 3 incompatible types of ammunition.

[Kingsman]

Looking again at the Omani CR2 tracks I think they are the same type as fitted to Khalid, i.e. standard Chieftain tracks.  Certainly close enough in 1/35.

[ivan-o]

I have taken the liberty of taking some photos from the above book,it shows the work needed for the Omani and Jordanian tanks.

 

as you can see quite a bit of work to be done

 

Ivan