Martian Posted June 28, 2021 Author Share Posted June 28, 2021 2 hours ago, RichieW said: As for the living long enough, I'm hoping to preserve myself with cask strength rum. Great minds think alike! That plan is far more likely to succeed than trying to pickle oneself in Baldrick's Old Scrotum "ale" that was recommended to me by a certain member of the Imperial General Staff of this parish. I don't know exactly what's in the stuff but @general melchett advises me that the last poor soul who tried that managed to dissolve most of his vital organs, thus hastening his demise! Scientists at Porton Down are said to be analysing the brew and have so far detected large quantities of neat hydrogen peroxide, several gallons of gnat's widdle and some of the General's old socks to add a little flavour. They are still trying to work out what gives it its kick! Martian 👽 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeronut Posted June 28, 2021 Share Posted June 28, 2021 The Avro Triplane replica at Shuttle worth uses wing warping for roll control as per the original. If you look at a photo of it you will notice that the outer most interplane struts on the upper to mid wing have no cross bracing, thus allowing the wing tips to be warped. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandy Posted June 28, 2021 Share Posted June 28, 2021 2 hours ago, Aeronut said: The Avro Triplane replica at Shuttle worth uses wing warping for roll control as per the original. If you look at a photo of it you will notice that the outer most interplane struts on the upper to mid wing have no cross bracing, thus allowing the wing tips to be warped. Standard for any wing-warper. If they had the stagger wires the wings would not be able to bend! As for the "kick" in Baldrick's Old Scrotum Ale, I think the clue may be in the name! Ian 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete in Lincs Posted June 28, 2021 Share Posted June 28, 2021 And I'm reasonably certain that something around here is warped.... 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Cohiba Posted June 28, 2021 Share Posted June 28, 2021 6 hours ago, RichieW said: As for the living long enough, I'm hoping to preserve myself with cask strength rum. From my own experience I'd rather prefer Single Malts. Islay, to be precise. Nothing that smells and tastes like burned oil from an rotary can be bad! 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Cohiba Posted June 28, 2021 Share Posted June 28, 2021 3 hours ago, Aeronut said: The Avro Triplane replica at Shuttle worth uses wing warping for roll control as per the original. If you look at a photo of it you will notice that the outer most interplane struts on the upper to mid wing have no cross bracing, thus allowing the wing tips to be warped. While wing warping as a turning strategy might be acceptable for my wee mind on something like a Taube, I refuse to understand how this could work on a bi- or triplane. When I try to imagine to picture this an exploding box of matches, in combination with an imploiding card house instantly appears. Quantum theory is more understandable. 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted June 28, 2021 Author Share Posted June 28, 2021 2 hours ago, Pete in Lincs said: And I'm reasonably certain that something around here is warped.... Has been ever since I joined and quite possibly before that! Martian 👽 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieW Posted June 29, 2021 Share Posted June 29, 2021 On 28/06/2021 at 21:29, Chief Cohiba said: While wing warping as a turning strategy might be acceptable for my wee mind on something like a Taube, I refuse to understand how this could work on a bi- or triplane. When I try to imagine to picture this an exploding box of matches, in combination with an imploiding card house instantly appears. Quantum theory is more understandable. I talked to one of the engineers today who assured me that only the top wing warps, a mystery solved! Martian, I did my best with photos but the Boxkite is humongous and was not ideally placed. I will upload the photos tomorrow once I have recovered from my well earned Pan Galactic Gargle Blasters. I have pictures of the Avro Triplane too. Richie 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeronut Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 9 hours ago, RichieW said: I talked to one of the engineers today who assured me that only the top wing warps, a mystery solved! Well he's telling you porkies. The film's Technical advisor Air Cmdr. Wheeler wrote a book about choosing, building and flying the replicas titled Building Aeroplanes for 'Those Magnificent Men'. On the subject of the Triplane's control system he wrote: "Being a triplane the multiplicity of the wire bracing members was considerable but the principle was the same as for a biplane. The chief complication in the wing structure arose from the very ingenious method for providing wing-warping whereby the outer portion of the rear spars on the two top planes were definitely hinged to allow for the warp distortion without depending on the elasticity of the wooden spar, as was the then practice for wing warping". 4 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieW Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 27 minutes ago, Aeronut said: Well he's telling you porkies It would indeed appear he told me porkies! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted June 30, 2021 Author Share Posted June 30, 2021 10 hours ago, RichieW said: I talked to one of the engineers today who assured me that only the top wing warps, a mystery solved! Martian, I did my best with photos but the Boxkite is humongous and was not ideally placed. I will upload the photos tomorrow once I have recovered from my well earned Pan Galactic Gargle Blasters. I have pictures of the Avro Triplane too. Richie Thanks Richie, I'm sure anything you have taken will be of great assistance. 36 minutes ago, Aeronut said: Well he's telling you porkies. The film's Technical advisor Air Cmdr. Wheeler wrote a book about choosing, building and flying the replicas titled Building Aeroplanes for 'Those Magnificent Men'. On the subject of the Triplane's control system he wrote: "Being a triplane the multiplicity of the wire bracing members was considerable but the principle was the same as for a biplane. The chief complication in the wing structure arose from the very ingenious method for providing wing-warping whereby the outer portion of the rear spars on the two top planes were definitely hinged to allow for the warp distortion without depending on the elasticity of the wooden spar, as was the then practice for wing warping". Thanks for clearing that one up Aeronut. I'm not sure how much a hinged strut will show up in 1/48 but it's nice to know how the thing works. Unhinged of Mars 👽 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieW Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 Well Martian, I here is a picture from little voyage yesterday; There are 40 or so pictures in the album, here is a link to it. I am glad you enjoy rigging, this would be a miserable project if you didn't! https://flic.kr/s/aHsmW6pBfu Feel free to download and use them as you wish, I only take these for the fun of it to help out modellers. I haven't got round to uploading the Avro triplane pics yet but will do tonight. Cheers Richie 7 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted June 30, 2021 Author Share Posted June 30, 2021 20 minutes ago, RichieW said: Well Martian, I here is a picture from little voyage yesterday; There are 40 or so pictures in the album, here is a link to it. I am glad you enjoy rigging, this would be a miserable project if you didn't! https://flic.kr/s/aHsmW6pBfu Feel free to download and use them as you wish, I only take these for the fun of it to help out modellers. I haven't got round to uploading the Avro triplane pics yet but will do tonight. Cheers Richie Many thanks Richie, those pictures are a massive help! Grateful of Mars 👽 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted June 30, 2021 Author Share Posted June 30, 2021 Update time! I have been very busy cleaning up struts and booms but that isn't really worth a picture as no difference would be apparent in the photographs. What I have got done is to get the flying surfaces primed, thus losing that horrible marbled plastic. When the primer had had time to cure, I drew in the spars and ribs of the flying surfaces with a brown Posca Pen. When this had had time to set properly, I will then begin misting on thin layers of MRP Bleached Linen paint to give the impression of light shining through the translucent covering of the flying surfaces. I still to decide what to do about the upper surfaces as in some pictures, one sees light playing off the rib tapes and in others one sees the ribs themselves, only less starkly than when viewed from below. Decisions, decisions! Further insanity may now recommence while I make up my mind. Thanks for looking. Indecisive of Mars 👽 15 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieW Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 Nice, I love MRP paints for the translucency you can create with thin layers. They dry quickly too, for some reason (possibly drunkenness) I used oil paint on my project and can't touch it for a few days. Ho hum..... 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmatthewbacon Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 @Martian according to the Wheeler book on constructing the replicas (which I found in a second hand shop in Cromer a couple of days ago and have just read) the Boxkite wing is mostly a single layer of fabric on top of the ribs, with spars “faired in” on the lower surface with a span wise strip of fabric. So it’s very translucent between the spars, and the ribs are mostly visible wood underneath. There are also distinctly less translucent (darker) square patches in an upward view, which may correlate with rigging or spar fixings on the top or may just be doped repair patches doubling the skin thickness. Wheeler says the Boxkite was one of the nicest to fly (and someone else flew it from Skegness to Booker), but had a top speed of about 40mph and a stalling speed of 28, so there wasn’t much of an envelope to “push”… and that was with a 90hp Continental instead of the 50hp rotary originally fitted… he blames a smaller propeller. best, M. 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieW Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 Avro Triplane photos https://flic.kr/s/aHsmWbyxb6 Richie 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted June 30, 2021 Author Share Posted June 30, 2021 25 minutes ago, RichieW said: Avro Triplane photos https://flic.kr/s/aHsmWbyxb6 Richie Thanks Richie, once again, most useful. I am clearly going to have to make @general melchett's triplane now. Let me think who got me thinking about these subjects. I shall consult my list of suspects. (Examines list very carefully. MELCHETT! Puts list away.) 6 hours ago, cmatthewbacon said: @Martian according to the Wheeler book on constructing the replicas (which I found in a second hand shop in Cromer a couple of days ago and have just read) the Boxkite wing is mostly a single layer of fabric on top of the ribs, with spars “faired in” on the lower surface with a span wise strip of fabric. So it’s very translucent between the spars, and the ribs are mostly visible wood underneath. There are also distinctly less translucent (darker) square patches in an upward view, which may correlate with rigging or spar fixings on the top or may just be doped repair patches doubling the skin thickness. Wheeler says the Boxkite was one of the nicest to fly (and someone else flew it from Skegness to Booker), but had a top speed of about 40mph and a stalling speed of 28, so there wasn’t much of an envelope to “push”… and that was with a 90hp Continental instead of the 50hp rotary originally fitted… he blames a smaller propeller. best, M. Thanks for bringing that book to my attention. A copy has been duly tracked down and ordered. Martian 👽 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieW Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 32 minutes ago, Martian said: Thanks Richie, once again, most useful. I am clearly going to have to make @general melchett's triplane now. Best get on and make it, I hear he's been a touch grumpy since his little chipmunk stepped on a land mine. Richie 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted June 30, 2021 Author Share Posted June 30, 2021 4 hours ago, RichieW said: Best get on and make it, I hear he's been a touch grumpy since his little chipmunk stepped on a land mine. Richie Don't let on but the chipmunk story was a cunning tissue of lies put about to get "Georgina" off the hook. Or was that off @general melchett's hook? Martian 👽 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Flannel Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 Magic. You've done this before haven't you. It's always enjoyable to observe some pioneer-themed work; "filigree and cement" as someone learned used to say. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted July 1, 2021 Author Share Posted July 1, 2021 Thanks Major. I built this kit about twenty years ago so it doesn't hold much in the way of terrors for me, just slow methodical work. Martian 👽 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete in Lincs Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 9 hours ago, Martian said: 13 hours ago, RichieW said: Don't let on but the chipmunk story was a cunning tissue of lies put about to get "Georgina" off the hook. Or was that off @general melchett's hook? Man, it was such a drag... 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
general melchett Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 Quote And I'm reasonably certain that something around here is warped.... Err, why are you looking over here?....nothing to see, nothing to see... Quote Let me think who got me thinking about these subjects. I shall consult my list of suspects. (Examines list very carefully. MELCHETT! Puts list away.) By Jupiters sainted Y-Fronts, there's some serious insubordination going on here. I merely planted the tiniest of seeds.........'twas you who then poured rotting compost, oily rainwater, a pair of Darling's gold-lamé 'sports' briefs and a pint of Baldrick's Old Scrotum all over it.......you sir! And don't bring the lovely Georgina into it, she was completely over the moon....quite literally. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Cohiba Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 On 6/30/2021 at 6:40 PM, RichieW said: Avro Triplane photos https://flic.kr/s/aHsmWbyxb6 Richie I'd say the straps on them wheels are not period correct! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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