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New Mimaki 3DUJ-553 printer and the end of the hobby.


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On 6/17/2021 at 6:13 PM, Harold55 said:

I have to agree with Mike, we had typewriters, and now word processors and printers but Calligraphy is still practiced and is a hobby so I don't see making models going away anytime soon.  I am actually excited about this.  As more folks get to understand what these machines can do we should see new products.

 

On 6/17/2021 at 6:26 PM, LorenSharp said:

Same thing was said when injection moulding came out in the late 40's early 50's. (To emphasize)"ITS THE END of modelling, no more shaving, sanding wood and gluing bits of tissue paper to make a model, O the humanity". it didn't end it, it just enhanced what was being done. I've seen outstanding models being created in the "old" style by @AdrianMF, and @Marklo just to name a few. All the printer does is give you a new set of tools.

Of course, it also gives you, more headaches, ideas and whatif's too because now your creativity gets a super shot of what can I do with this? I'll get off my soapbox now :angrysoapbox.sml:and return you to your regularly scheduled programing

 

On 6/17/2021 at 9:49 PM, AdrianMF said:

When I were a lad, I’d just finished a degree that it turned out I wasn’t really interested in (my fault) and fell into computer programming quite by accident/elimination.

 

Six months on we had a day out to a computer show in early 1981, where there was an exhibit called “The Last One”. This was going to make all programmers redundant overnight. After spending a few sleepless nights, I realised that it wasn’t - it simplified getting data out of a database and formatting it for printing, a chore at the best of times, but it wasn’t going to find Russian submarines in the Atlantic or any of the other things we had to do. 
 

That said, I think plastic modelling is going to either evolve radically or disappear when all us boomers have emptied our last sprue. None of my team now even knows what assembly code is, let alone writes it.

 

I will be quite happy working through the stash until I can’t do it any more. My wife has offered to buy me a printer for birthday/Xmas more than once, but I have declined, on the grounds that I’d rather be messing about with stuff than doing CAD/CAM at a computer all day. It’s building and, frankly, this forum that gives me the joy, not a perfectly realised product (with maybe rather overly emphasised panel lines)

 

Regards,

Adrian

 Seems like the message is clear to me. It'll change stuff but the hobby will continue. I think I was at that exhibition too as that rings a bell.

I also remember IBM predicting a world market of 6-7 computers. Given the amount they spent on R&D they were so far off it's embarrassing - especially as at Palo Alto Research Center the whole distributing computing network concept was pretty much defined and most was designed.

 

However things change some will stick to old methods, others adopt the new while the wise will pick and choose. We still have thatched roofs after all.  

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I really can't see what the fuss is about here !

Ok, so we have some new or newish 3D printer that can make high quality objects combining different colours. So what ? If I enjoy a hobby where I have to cut plastic parts from a sprue, assemble them, paint them and if I want add weathering, then apply decals so that in the end I have a reproduction of an aircraft/tank/car/whatever, why should I fear this new printer ? This printer is capable of making certain things, my hobby involves doing different things. Completed models have been around for decades, if my idea of fun is building a model I would rarely be interested in buying a completed model. If my idea of fun is buying a complete model (and it's a totally legitimate idea of having fun), then this printer will just add more to the range of products available.

 

On the contrary, as a modeller I see what printers like these can bring to the hobby: precoloured parts have been around for quite some time and there are situations where I like using them myself. I don't feel "less of a modeller" if I'm using a precoloured Eduard PE set, why should I feel the same if I had to use a fully precoloured cockpit (that is something that such a printer may make available) ? Some have described similar products as the end of the hobby... but how many kits have offered decals for instrument panels over the years ? And how many modellers are happy with such solution ? Yet nobody ever described such decals as the end of the hobby, so why should I look at precoloured aftermarket parts as such a tragedy ?

Mind, precoloured parts of some kind have been offered before ! Afterall, weren't the old chrome plated kits a way to help the modeller in achieving a natural metal finish withour having to use paints ? Arent' parts in different colours according to the final finish included in most car kits ?  And I even have vague memories of someone in the '60s offering "camouflage moulded" kits (IMC maybe, can't remember for sure). Yet the hobby has survived all such attempts at decreasing the modeller work content in the finished model.

 

In the end I like to think of the opportunities that such a product can bring to the hobby. I'm sure some enterprising company will come up with ideas to use them to propose new things for us modellers. Some modellers will sure be inspired to make things for themselves that may then become available to others, so increasing even further the range of available products. To me all these are good things to see happening. Personally I don't have the time to start playing with 3D modelling and printing and I'm sure many others feel the same, be it because of lack of time or inclination or whatever. At the same time I'm happy to see this as a novel way of reproducting something in scale and will happily use whatever product may come out of it if I feel this add something to my models... models that however will still be mainly built through the old cut from sprue- prepare- glue- paint-decal-weather process

Edited by Giorgio N
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On 6/17/2021 at 10:40 PM, Nocoolname said:

What... you mean we're not living on the moon?

Yes 'Everyone's gone to the moon'.

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1 hour ago, Giorgio N said:

I really can't see what the fuss is about here ! Ok, so we have some new or newish 3D printer that can make high quality objects combining different colours.

Exactly right - this 3D printer enthusiast guy has created a storm in a teacup. This printer has been around for a few years and a few manufacturers have taken advantage of it with a limited range of fairly expensive but (mostly) high quality items, limited by the quality of their research. According to predictions 10 years ago, the most common method of building a kit today would be downloading plans from the net, sending them to a 3D printing hub and assembling the bits after they were delivered (by a drone of course). It hasn't happened for me yet - maybe in 10 years time, maybe not!

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What plans? ;)

 

Apart from JT, I don't see many people offering high-quality designed parts to the masses in .stl for free (as in beer). 

The amount of work going into parts/kit design is significant enough that manufacturers keep those close to their chest as it represents a substantial investment that generally speaking you'd want a return on. 
 

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34 minutes ago, alt-92 said:

Apart from JT, I don't see many people offering high-quality designed parts to the masses in .stl for free (as in beer). 

 

Just a few years ago, when there was the first major boom in 3D printers, I read how it would finally be easy to make a whole bunch of models not available on the market, because modellers would quickly design either whole models or conversion kits. Of course, both were going to be free or low cost to download, but they were also going to be available to buy as high quality prints, at a price similar to injection moulding kits.

 

Years go by and I still don't see a conversion from the ICM He 70 to the Hungarian He 170, and this is just one of dozens or hundreds of such cases.

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There are however a large number of aftermarket items now made by 3D printers, and these seem to have almost completely replaced the earlier resin parts with a considerable gain in detail - if with an increase in price.  Any move to larger parts however seems to be stuck with the problems of slow production and high price, plus problems with obvious layering and brittleness of the material.  It does seem that these last two problems have been solved, at least on more expensive printers, but as far as aircraft modellers are concerned not the others.  However 3D printing is very well established in railway and ship modelling, if less so in vehicles and even less so in aircraft, although the signs are there for small items such as wheels.  I gather the use of 3D printers is almost universal where it comes to prototype pieces.

 

As for specific conversions, we all have our favourites and few of them have appeared!  Conversions have always been rarer in the larger scales because of the smaller markets and greater cost, but there are plenty of missing "obvious" choices in 1/72 - although it is possible to do an He.170.  

 

As for non-delivery of promises by enthusiasts, it was well into the last century that announcements were made how 1/48 would completely replace 1/72.  Yeah.

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On 6/22/2021 at 11:13 AM, Ed Russell said:

According to predictions 10 years ago, the most common method of building a kit today would be downloading plans from the net, sending them to a 3D printing hub and assembling the bits after they were delivered (by a drone of course). It hasn't happened for me yet - maybe in 10 years time, maybe not!

Nuclear Fusion was 10 years away when I was at school. Now nearly 60 it's still 10 years away....

 

Coming at this from an economics angle I don't see how that scenario, which I remember well too, was ever going to work unless we went full 'Star Trek' moneyless society. Within the current trade networks the 'best' or 'least worse' plan that could be applied now would be for a manufacturer to list the kits that they offer as 3D prints to be printed off locally. As now the files could be sent for manufacture and have a single use licence embedded. Decals and instructions could be sent directly to the customer. The International banking system is already setup to handle local taxes that are transaction specific so the burden for that is removed from the purchaser. What will need to change is the import duty that is charged in some countries but only on items that are shipped. Buy it elsewhere and carry it through in person and you have a different process.

 

As for the printers they could be leased by a local operator who would distribute accordingly. A great way to generate employment especially for folks with challenges as the work area can be tailored for specific needs. If a bakery line can be setup for wheelchair and partially sighted workers to use safely then anything should be possible. The line I saw is in Germany but there are others in the USA for certain.   

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Only the newbie here but, for what it’s worth, I started to make models this year because I wanted to make them. I could buy a superbly rendered die cast but I prefer my little efforts with all their (many) imperfections because I made them (OK, with input from the kit, glue, paint and assorted tool manufacturers🤪).

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On 6/17/2021 at 4:52 PM, Stringbug said:

I don't know maybe it's just me but I think its really sad.

Absolutely, but we all collectively to blame for accepting these things in life. Ultimately if things don’t get bought they die, whatever it is. So, it’s about us and not the product.

 

Martin

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On 6/30/2021 at 6:45 PM, BillF67 said:

Only the newbie here but, for what it’s worth, I started to make models this year because I wanted to make them. I could buy a superbly rendered die cast but I prefer my little efforts with all their (many) imperfections because I made them (OK, with input from the kit, glue, paint and assorted tool manufacturers🤪).

Exactly! :)

 

Of course, 3D printers and their users won’t produce the multitude of variable colour schemes and particular configurations that you - the modeller - want. 

 

Martin

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3 hours ago, RidgeRunner said:

Exactly! :)

 

Of course, 3D printers and their users won’t produce the multitude of variable colour schemes and particular configurations that you - the modeller - want. 

 

Martin

Actually they would!

Just a change of surface to the model and done!

Lime changing a jacket.

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I suppose I already take advantage of drawing and printing decals and other aftermarket so, I guess. It is a natural progression. After all we are not all out there fletching anymore ;) 

 

Martin

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3 hours ago, Bozothenutter said:

Just a change of surface to the model and done!

 

That "just" means: redesign the entire colour layer, down to the smallest detail. This is as practical and achievable for 99% of modellers as "design yourself a kit in 3D from scratch".

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3 hours ago, Piotr Mikolajski said:

 

That "just" means: redesign the entire colour layer, down to the smallest detail. This is as practical and achievable for 99% of modellers as "design yourself a kit in 3D from scratch".

Yup, but all the skills are available,think of ot, a whole new aftermarket!

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3 hours ago, Bozothenutter said:

Yup, but all the skills are available,think of ot, a whole new aftermarket!

 

But that's exactly what was said about designing in 3D niche models that are not on the market.

 

I don't recall anyone of my friends being able to afford to order a 3D design of an aircraft that they would love to have, but that no one is producing. And I'm not talking about someone printing the model, but the STL file itself to print at home.

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32 minutes ago, Piotr Mikolajski said:

 

But that's exactly what was said about designing in 3D niche models that are not on the market.

 

I don't recall anyone of my friends being able to afford to order a 3D design of an aircraft that they would love to have, but that no one is producing. And I'm not talking about someone printing the model, but the STL file itself to print at home.

If you hear about a 1/72 Yak-9T, please let me know...

 

John

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If you'll pardon a golf metaphor - there are all kinds of "electronic golf" games available on your phone, computer or gaming system yet people are still dragging their clubs to the course.  All I want is to be able to make detail parts in one uniform tan/gray color to detail existing kits.  That's it!!!  Cheers

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I guess I engaged my fingers before my brain had a chance to kick in to action. I guess we all take advantage of modern techniques and products, and it is for us individually to decide what brings us satisfaction. Like others have said here, I enjoy the creative element of this hobby most of all. If, by bringing in a few new goodies I can enhance that why wouldn’t I? I can be stuck in the past in most things and need to open my mind a little! ;)

 

Martin

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On 7/3/2021 at 9:08 AM, RidgeRunner said:

Absolutely, but we all collectively to blame for accepting these things in life. Ultimately if things don’t get bought they die, whatever it is. So, it’s about us and not the product.

 

Martin

That's why many of us buy five times as much as we could ever make in this lifetime — buying and stashing is our way of showing our appreciation to the model manufacturers. More pleeese.

 

Tony

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On 23/06/2021 at 18:58, sroubos said:

Why do people build scale models?

 

Because they like BUILDING scale models :)

Wait, we're meant to build them? (looks nervously at stash growth) 🤪

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14 minutes ago, Modelraynz said:

Wait, we're meant to build them? (looks nervously at stash growth) 🤪

When they said 'build' I thought they meant build a stash!

 

No wonder all my businesses ventures failed. :facepalm:

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